Sandra’s Comments (group member since Jan 21, 2020)

Sandra’s comments from the The Obscure Reading Group group.

Thanks Kathleen and Ken.

Sorry!! I have been missing in action for the past year due to my husband’s health. I like receiving the updates in case I can rejoin at some point in the future. I miss “discussing” the books, but I am still reading 🙂

I’m with Ginny, although I dropped out after the first discussion. I have so little patience for books that are not satisfying. Thanks to the rest of you for keeping this Obscure Club alive, especially Kathleen and Ken. I just have too many books from the library that will be due soon.

I’m simply wondering if anyone else is finding this book boring. I’m about 40% finished and I can’t sink my teeth into it.

I also should add that I think it’s quite possible that these “questions” Charles has about certain perceptions could be Murdoch herself intruding into her character’s thoughts.

Interesting comments. I agree that the style is somewhat tedious. I fault Charles not Murdoch since he claims this is his writing. What I find surprising is the fact that he questions his own “perceptions.” Especially when taking about ghosts and sea monsters and faces. I am curious to see if that illustrates some metacognition in spite of his narcissism—or if it’s simply another way he deludes himself. I have not read any of Murdoch’s other books.

Love reading all your comments. I can’t add much to this already in-depth discussion except no one (that I saw) mentioned the role of fate. I did think often about Thomas Hardy’s characters, especially in Tess and Jude; no matter how well intentioned they were, it wasn’t possible for them to succeed. I think Gissing probably attributes the mournful state of his characters to social inequalities, and yet I see Kirkwood and Michael as two characters who were perhaps “fated” to fail in their idealistic attempts. Not to mention Clara, Jane, and even Clem. What role do you think fatalism plays in the nether world?

You’re funny!😂

I’m not joining you this time, but I remember discussing this novel in my Russian Lit class in 1966!
Here’s an interesting article about one of the themes in the book that I most appreciated.
I don’t know if the link will work. Have a great discussion.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/world-...

Hi, Liz. I am also a retired English teacher. I am 76, so just reverse your age and you can have mine! I loved reading The Brothers Karamazov because it lends itself to philosophical discussion. But I also am passing on rereading it. I have such a list if books to fit in. I look forward to your comments on the next book!

Ken, I love that bit about the lasting importance of reading The Odyssey. I did teach, it but I did not beat the students over the head with memory work. My students especially liked discussing whether or not they would classify Odysseus as a hero. I think we can ask the same thing about each character in a story. I will be interested to hear who you all think is the hero in The Brothers Karamazov.

I didn’t vote, but I have read the book. It’s brilliant in my opinion. I will be reading your discussion comments. It’s one of the handful of books that I refer to often when I am engaged in philosophical debates. Happy reading!

Thanks, Sara. I agree! I will have plenty of time to read when he’s back in Singapore!

I’m quite behind in my reading so am not voting. If I catch up, I will join all of you. I am only 1/3 through History of the Rain by Niall Williams. Because I am savoring every sentence, and because Christmas brought my son from Singapore to visit for the first time in over two years, I am far behind!! Happy holidays and Yvonne, I hope you are okay!

Thanks, Diane. I will have to add the follow-up book to my reading list.

I taught an excerpt from “Life Among the Savages” to my high school students. It was excellent and funny and endearing. I read that it was largely autobiographical. I used the excerpt as a model to teach students how to write a autobiographical narrative. My students loved the story and had fun writing their own comedic stories. I saw that you were reading the book, Kathleen. I’m sure you will enjoy it!

Yes, Ken. And from reading even the littlest bit of information on Shirley Jackson’s life, I see much in this novel is autobiographical. In an interviews she remarked, "My grandfather was an architect, and his father, and his father. One of them built houses only for millionaires in California and that's where the family wealth came from, and one of them was certain that houses could be made to stand on the sand dunes of San Francisco, and that's where the family wealth went."

Also, “Jackson's maternal grandmother, nicknamed "Mimi", was a Christian Science practitioner who continued to practice spiritual healing on members of the family after her retirement.”

Finished. I have little to offer you about this obscure book. I guess the last comment by Maryjane says it all: “It wasn’t the plot so much, you know, it was the acting. I mean, it was so real you really got to thinking they were real people.”

It definitely wasn’t the plot, and I don’t agree that these characters were anything like real people.

I guess the joke is on us.

Great points, Ginny! I did think of the parallels between Christianity and the “father’s house.”

Lionel being pushed stays clearly in my mind, though much else in the story has not. And I admit to the mistake of also reading Ken’s poetry and “This is Happiness” by Niall Williams. Ken’s poems are so much better to read and enjoy than “The Sundial.” And Williams’ novel is a delightfully Irish tale. So I am hardly motivated to read the second half of Jackson’s book. I loved “Life Among the Savages,” The Haunting of Hill House,” and “The Lottery,” so I will put aside the poems and Irish flavored prose at some point.