Fantasy Aficionados discussion

Ok I really need help, My 13 year old grandsons Lexile reading level score is 1500. He is a Epic Fantasy & Fantasy genre fan. We are having a difficult time finding books for him that are age appropriate yet reading level challenging for him. The gifted counselor is sending him to Lexile.com because the middle school doesn't have any books for his level but all we find there is college text or medical text type books but nothing that would interest a 13 year old boy. Any suggestions?

Bobbie--the young adult field can be a challenging one as to what parents think is appropriate or not. Can you give any more information on what you are trying to avoid when you say 'age appropriate?' Can it mention sex? Or would you rather it not appear at all? What about violence? There's a trend in modern epic fantasy of the 'anti-hero,' or someone you might not want to emulate.

Agree with Carol, if intellectually he is ready for adult fantasy, let him read what you parents, or the adults here are reading. If he is not emotionally ready,(i,e. sex) it may be that parts of books read will "Go over his head" or he will just go oh eww, and still be enjoyable.

Have you tried Tolkien or Sanderson? So far, the epic fantasy I've read contained no sex, except for GRR Martin. I know, I need to read more fantasy.

Because he needs some for school I would say no sex. some violence should be ok.

Thoa, I found some Tolkien I thought he might like but the Lexile level of Tolkien is only 810 we need in the 1400 - 1500 range. I know this is no easy task for a thirteen yo with a college reading level

Give him Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid! Or try some postmodernism. LOL.

I heard that Gardens of the Moon Malazan series is pretty complex. Anybody know whether it contained explicit material?

Aloha wrote: "I heard that Gardens of the Moon Malazan series is pretty complex. Anybody know whether it contained explicit material?"

this looks like something he might like I only wish I could find the lexile level for all books that the most difficult part of this problem

Based on people's comments, this would be the series for him if it doesn't contain explicit material.

thanks Aloha, I'll pass this on
Keep them coming, Justin's like a hungry boy he can eat a book for dinner and ask for more LOL
When My daughter called me with this problem, I said thats not a problem she said try it LOL I had no idea how difficult this task was but I found out fast LOL

I say give him Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid. He'll stop complaining.

He's not really complaining, He needs for school. He needs to challenge instead of reading below his level per his gifted counselor but the school does not have books at his level

Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid

I'm a Hofstadter groupee. I'm thinking of stalking him.

Also, you have to consider that he should be reading at a level that not only challenges him, but is enjoyable to him. so Lexile level is not what it's all about. Some books may have complex ideas but with simple delivery.

My daughter's reading level is off the charts, but her teacher is not allowed to test her for higher than the max indicated at that grade level. But she prefers to read books that all her friends are reading because she gets to laugh and gossip with them about the books.

Gardens of the Moon, and the series Malazan, does have a lot of violence and disturbing scenes. As for sex...it's not graphic but you know what's going on, and one of the main characters does commit rape...kind of. I can't think of language. That might be clean. It's definitely something be should eventually look into, just maybe not now.

The Ballantine Adult Fantasy Series has some good books. I'm starting to go through them. I finished The Man Who Was Thursday and that was really good. Here's my list if you want to transfer it over to your shelf so you can look at it later.

Ballantine Adult Fantasy

One of my son's friends is reading the Malazan series. He is 14, most likely gifted. He did say there was violence and sex in it and seemed kind of proud of it!

How about Ray Bradbury?

I suggested that to Bobbie privately. I thought SF's are great, too.

I would recommend Ender's Game, a book for all no matter who you are or how old. The book works on so many levels.

Aloha wrote: "Also, you have to consider that he should be reading at a level that not only challenges him, but is enjoyable to him. so Lexile level is not what it's all about. Some books may have complex idea..."

I think that's the key point here. School books that are passing information along needs to be at the 'appropriate level.' Books for enjoyment are another thing altogether--you'll find many adults that read books from the 'young adult' genre, and its is not because they want 'easier' books.

And what is the goal for him here--challenging reading comprehension? Vocabulary? Ideas? Science fiction does a much better job of challenging conceptions and thought processes, in my opinion. Ursula LeGuin is a great one for exploring ideas in a revoluationary way.

It's funny, I've never heard of this awarding points to reading level thing, but I was actually thinking of it the other way too. I did alright in school but I was in no way one of the brains, although I've always had a love for reading. So my actual score would probably have been lower than what I was reading, and what I wanted to read, at the time. And then there's a grey area, books that might be difficult to read but aren't very "deep", and books that are easy to read but are. I'm not sure what I think of this point system...

@ Bobbie-I'm not attacking you for asking, actually I'm glad you did because I haven't heard of it before.

Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid

Gee. Aloha, did you want to make a sugggestion?

Have you ever heard of some book about a Golden Braid?

;)

Bobbie wrote: "Ok I really need help, My 13 year old grandsons Lexile reading level score is 1500. He is a Epic Fantasy & Fantasy genre fan. We are having a difficult time finding books for him that are age appropriate yet reading level challenging for him. The gifted counselor is sending him to Lexile.com because the middle school doesn't have any books for his level but all we find there is college text or medical text type books but nothing that would interest a 13 year old boy. Any suggestions? "

His school obviously doesn't understand how lexiles work. He isn't really going to find much fiction written at that level, but he might find scholarly discussions of fiction, like this analysis of Tolkien

http://lexile.com/book/details/978031...

or this collection of Nobel lectures by some of the prizewinners in Literature:

http://lexile.com/book/details/978981...

A lot of fans of the Fantasy genre are also fans of history, and he might find that reading some history at that level not only helps him meet his school reading goals, but enriches his experience of reading fantasy, much of which is filled with allusions to history and mythology.

I seriously doubt that the counselor has any idea just how high a 1500 lexile level is, so I'd suggest that you ask the counselor to go to Lexile.com with your grandson and help him pick out some appropriate titles. When the counselor sees that there are literally no fiction titles at that level there, perhaps the ridiculous requirement to read fiction at his "challenge level" will be dropped. With that kind of reading comprehension, the opportunity for discussion of fiction at a deep level is going to do more for his intellectual development than "harder books."

Carol, you heard of that book, too?!!! Wow, it's getting famous.

Carol wrote: "Gee. Aloha, did you want to make a sugggestion?

Have you ever heard of some book about a Golden Braid?

;)"

I wanted to say something like this, but I'm glad somebody was able to put it much better than I would have. I have friends who are scientists and physicists reading Sanderson, etc., so to have him read fiction at the 1500 lexile level is off the mark. He would get more with analysis and history of the work of fiction or of an author's work.

J.D. wrote: "Bobbie wrote: "Ok I really need help, My 13 year old grandsons Lexile reading level score is 1500. He is a Epic Fantasy & Fantasy genre fan. We are having a difficult time finding books for him tha..."

J.D. wrote: "Bobbie wrote: "Ok I really need help, My 13 year old grandsons Lexile reading level score is 1500. He is a Epic Fantasy & Fantasy genre fan. We are having a difficult time finding books for him tha..."

I could not agree with you more! I just discuss this with my daughter. I think the teacher needs to provide a more challenging discussion. What 13 yo boy is interested in college text books.

I really appreciate everyone's input and recommendations, keep them coming.

These may not be high fantasy or complex reading levels, but they are all adult fantasy books that he might enjoy:

In the Garden of Iden and the rest of the series about children turned into time traveling cyborgs
Connie Willis- any of her time travel books - favorites are
To Say Nothing of the DogBlackoutAll Clear

Blood Price
Mainspring
Midnight Riot
Heart of Veridon
Into the Storm
The Lord of Castle Black (elves & Magic)
The Phoenix Guards (the 3 Musketeers with magic)
The Very Best of Charles de Lint
The Eyre Affair
Good Omens: The Nice and Accurate Prophecies of Agnes Nutter, Witch
The Color of Magic
Pandemonium
Havemercy
His Majesty's Dragon dragons used as fighter planes during Napoleonic wars
Gil's All Fright Diner
Souls in the Great Machine
Snake Agent

Here is a book list, Entry Level Drugs for YA, that I generated for pre-Xmas shopping a couple years ago:
http://bookviewcafe.com/blog/2010/11/...

If I were you I would not work on finding books that are difficult enough (as measured by your scale). I would concentrate on finding really good books that he will love to read. Even smart people, with massive vocabularies and annoyingly large libraries, enjoy reading all kinds of stuff. In other words, you want his heart, and his mind will follow.

Lol, Brenda! "Entry Level Drug for YA." Just the good kind. :D

Tasula wrote: "These may not be high fantasy or complex reading levels, but they are all adult fantasy books that he might enjoy:

In the Garden of Iden and the rest of the series about children turned into time ..."

Thank you, these look awesome.

Brenda wrote: "Here is a book list, Entry Level Drugs for YA, that I generated for pre-Xmas shopping a couple years ago:
http://bookviewcafe.com/blog/2010/11/...
..."

For his recreational reading, he reads whatever he likes but the challenge he's posed with is to find something within his lexile range or the teacher will get it for him from the lexile site. Barnes and noble site allows you to search by lexile score and have a more but short interesting selection.

I didn't know B&N do that! I'll have to do that for Xuan if they'll ever test her for her true lexile score. All I get is that she's off the chart and they're not allowed to test her for more. But that's elementary school level. She just entered middle school, so maybe it'll be different. OTOH, this area is having a major problem with the city misplacing millions of dollars and the schools is where they're slashing, which is dumb. I hope she'll get a teacher that will pay attention.

You're in an interesting situation, Bobbie! A good one, though...

You might try George MacDonald's two older fantasies: Lilith and Phantastes. They don't have any sex, minimal violence. Those two are the most complex and difficult fantasies I've ever read. Good, too. Lewis was a big fan.

Other thoughts:
Thomas Malory's Le Morte D'Arthur
Edmund Spenser's The Faerie Queene
John Ruskin's The King of the Golden River

I haven't read those three, but they're typically referred to as some of the main grandpas of modern fantasy. If your son does tackle 'em, let us know how it goes!

Last thought: does he have any other genres he enjoys?

Aloha wrote: "I didn't know B&N do that! I'll have to do that for Xuan if they'll ever test her for her true lexile score. All I get is that she's off the chart and they're not allowed to test her for more. B..."

Aloha,

If you know of some books that she thinks are interesting and some that she thinks are a little too hard, then you can look up the lexile scores of those selections, and it might give you a general idea of where she is now. It's not unusual for gifted kids with access to challenging material to jump up several grade levels in comprehension a few months, though, so even formal testing might not give a guide that is terribly useful in anything more than the very short term.

Thanks, J.D. She's 10 years old and just finished and enjoyed The Hobbit. I'll have to find out the lexile score for that. That was my reading choice for her, BTW. She had more fun reading the Hunger Games series because her friends were all excited about the series.

A website said the lexile score for The Hobbit is 1000.

Christopher wrote: "You're in an interesting situation, Bobbie! A good one, though...

You might try George MacDonald's two older fantasies: Lilith and Phantastes. They don't have any sex, minimal violence. Those two ..."

Thank you Christopher
I'll pass them along BTW he is my grandson LOL

Another interesting site I found for book search by Lexile score http://www.scholastic.com/bookwizard/
I think the best I've found so far but still limited

Wow...
There's a Barnes and Noble search you can do online.
I tried it out of curiosity, only 4 books came up in the scifi/ fantasy section.
One was King Arthur....,
another was Tolkien discussions, and Gulivers Travels in another language.
The fourth I forget.
Maybe he would enjoy some classics...sort of ...
Ivanhoe for example...not quite fantasy...but I remember reading these types before fantasy writers became so prevalent.

I think he's open to other genre's other than romance LOL My daughter said he panicked when she told him she was going to solicit my help LOL

Fifty Shades of Grey

I'm not real big into romance either..LOL

Aloha wrote: "Fifty Shades of Grey"

Naughty suggestion!

That or GEB should stimulate his mind.

Oh no he cant read that LOL I on the other hand read it 3 times LOL

Ok these are a few he picked if this gives you any ideas what he might like

A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess
His Majesty's Dragon (Temeraire #1-7) by Naomi Novik
Lorien Legacies, #1-3 by Pittacus Lore
Erewhon by Samuel Butler

I still need to look at the lexile scores but He will read these regardless

A Clockwork Orange contained explicit and disturbing materials, Bobbie.

If he's REALLY smart, I recommend John C. Wright The Last Guardian of Everness (and the sequel The Mists of Everness). Complex, great characters, clean and wonderful message.

NO Clockwork Orange. Seriously? Not even close.