Heathens, Pagans and Witches discussion
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Animism
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I would say I include animism as part of my spirituality.
Animism is intricately entwined with my shamanic practice, and as such informs all of how I perceive the world and almost all of my practices.
Although I must add that I don't care much for the Wiki attempt at describing it.
I would say I have strong animist tendencies as well.
Ditto me. And I agree Sara, a poor description.
I believe in animism
I haven't read any books that cover animism. Are there any suggestions? I have seen some animated animism movies which were enjoyable but I am not a big movie goer, much preferring books. I am a tactile person that likes the feel of pages and using my imagination when reading.
While I've banged on about the difference between the traditions of Himachal hill folk religion and Hinduism, it's not as wide a gap as the one between the Northeast hill states (Mizoram, Tripura, Arunachal Pradesh etc.) and mainstream Hinduism. The tribes from the northeast hill states are usually classified as animist although they have been hit quite hard by xtian missionaries.
Aaron wrote: "While I've banged on about the difference between the traditions of Himachal hill folk religion and Hinduism, it's not as wide a gap as the one between the Northeast hill states (Mizoram, Tripura, ..."I am feeling, oh so ignorant!
Laureen, don't worry, Aaron lives in India and has up-close knowledge. I don't watch much on screen either but am a book person. My research interest is Inner Asian religion, before the world religions. (Notice I am trying not to use a name for the indigenous religions). Have I mentioned in this group a gorgeous book about how Mongolians today live with, in a community with, their herds? I loved this book, which is a case study in how differently people can live in the world, outside the Judeo-Christian tradition which (the book explains) has so affected our view of 'us and animals' -- even in science, which has a strong hangover from the Judeo-Christian religious ideas. Living with Herds: Human-Animal Coexistence in Mongolia
I am an animist if I am anything. I can't say I have beliefs (I have interests, I have sympathies), except I strongly believe in the life, equivalent to human life -- that is, equal in worth, equal in every real way -- of other beings, animals, plants and of course species we have yet to meet. And I am most sympathetic to religious views where there are spirits in the landscape. I have spent so much time in research of Mongols, to whom this is so, and then, every day I walk in Aboriginal spiritual landscapes.
Bryn wrote: "Laureen, don't worry, Aaron lives in India and has up-close knowledge. I don't watch much on screen either but am a book person. My research interest is Inner Asian religion, before the world reli..."
You are too kind Bryn. I have put that book on my "to read" list. I love to explore other cultures and belief systems. I was told once by a "sensitive" that in a past life I was a Mongolian Overlord (my apologies if I was) but although it probably isn't true, I have a special interest in Mongolia.
They say animals behave strange right before an earthquakes - they can sense it before it happens. Birds use unknown means of navigation and dogs like to line up with the north south poles when they poop. There apparently are range of senses that humans don't have and animals do.
Laureen wrote: "I haven't read any books that cover animism. Are there any suggestions? I have seen some animated animism movies which were enjoyable but I am not a big movie goer, much preferring books. I am a..."I think there's a misunderstanding forming in this thread.
Animism (from Latin anima, "breath, spirit, life") is the worldview that non-human entities—such as animals, plants, and inanimate objects—possess a spiritual essence.
Animals are certainly included in this belief, but the word "Animism" is not related directly to the word "Animal".
In many Eastern beliefs, including Taoism, everything has 'Spirit'; rocks, plants, etc.
There are some good books on the bookshelf for this group on this subject.
Robert wrote: "..."Is that Spare on your icon sir?
:)
Robert wrote: "Laureen wrote: "I haven't read any books that cover animism. Are there any suggestions? I have seen some animated animism movies which were enjoyable but I am not a big movie goer, much preferrin..."Robert, I am so appreciative of your post. I did think Animism was an ancient belief system unrelated to animals but my lack of confidence in how much I know had me think maybe I have it all wrong. I did some minor study of different belief systems but not enough to be thoroughly conversant with the subject. I must re-visit the subject.
When I joined a movie stream, I thought the genre Anima (I think that's the spelling) was very interesting but it had nothing really to do with animals but animation. See, I don't mind admitting I am naive. My knowledge is mostly life experience but I do love to understand concepts of human interaction.
Robert wrote: "Animism (from Latin anima, "breath, spirit, life") is the worldview that non-human entities—such as animals, plants, and inanimate objects—possess a spiritual essence."Thanks for the clarification, Robert. This is how I've always viewed animism. Animism as in animated or anima, the inherent soul in all things. I've had some close, personal, spiritual relationships with animals, trees, rocks, cars... :-)
Peejay Who Once Was Minsma wrote: "Robert wrote: "Animism (from Latin anima, "breath, spirit, life") is the worldview that non-human entities—such as animals, plants, and inanimate objects—possess a spiritual essence."Thanks for t..."
I pat my car every time she starts, as she has a habit of not doing so, and of stopping suddenly, in odd places, to enjoy the view. Can't begrudge her, beautiful scenery here.
I also complement rocks .I have a thing for them. :)
Little wrote: "I pat my car every time she starts, as she has a habit of not doing so, and of stopping suddenly, in odd places, to enjoy the view. Can't begrudge her, beautiful scenery here. I also complement rocks .I have a thing for them. :) "Oh yes, I definitely have a thing for rocks. It must be my close relationship with crows. "Ooo! Shiny pebble! Must take it back to my nest."
And I had a VW Bug that I'd swear was animate. It saved my bacon many times. It nearly killed me when it finally gave out after I'd driven it for 13 years. Trading it in felt like a betrayal. I can only hope Tin Lizzie forgave me.
Love it. :) Yes, strangely enough, when my car stops I usually find it's been a good thing. I bump into people I should have been talking to, or I'm suddenly in a spot that is beneficial to me. She starts up again just as randomly. Last time I simply got out and had a beer at the local, got back in twenty mins later, and up she started. She also has a habit of discarding one of her doors when people try to open it (it falls off and I have to placate the would be car-door-opener, then reposition the door and bump it back into place with my hip). Also one of my dogs, a border collie-kelpie cross, is madly in love with her, and so when my car finally stops altogether I'm going to have to park it somewhere on the property, so he can continue his love affair. :):)
What I do like in the Wiki description is this, on the difference between pantheism and animism: Animism is not the same as pantheism, although the two are sometimes confused. Some religions are both pantheistic and animistic. One of the main differences is that while animists believe everything to be spiritual in nature, they do not necessarily see the spiritual nature of everything in existence as being united (monism), the way pantheists do. As a result, animism puts more emphasis on the uniqueness of each individual soul. In pantheism, everything shares the same spiritual essence, rather than having distinct spirits and/or souls.[32][33] Additionally, Pantheism posits a source of this "monism". This source may or may not have agency. In contrast, in Animism, the soul or essence or spirit of objects and living things are novel and separate from the whole, while still seen as irrevocably intertwined with one another in a community.
Do people agree?
My understanding is that animism can be without gods. As I have no divinities, but see individual existences, of whatever shape, as how the world is made up, I identify most with animism.
Yes, I can agree with that Bryn, except I identify with Pantheism.
Good clarification Bryn. I figure my belief structure is a mongrel mix, a bit of many ideas, and constantly fluctuating. Basically everything is comprised of stardust. Everything is sacred. In keeping with a buddhist worldview, I do believe in the existence of divinities, or devas, yet also believe that they are not the pinnacle, but a part of the whole.
I'm impressed by the ideas of Biocentrism at the moment, who knows what will capture my attention tomorrow. I grow more uncertain by the day, but I'm happy with that uncertainty. :)
I'm happy in uncertainty too. It's about the journey, I guess you can say, for me.
I hadn't met Biocentrism. At first glance it seems quite animist to me.
Yes, the journey is it. :) It is. Learning more as I go about a Biocentric universe, but so far it fits in with so many world faiths.
Little wrote: "Love it. :) Yes, strangely enough, when my car stops I usually find it's been a good thing. I bump into people I should have been talking to, or I'm suddenly in a spot that is beneficial to me. She..."Back when I was putting myself through college and coming back past midnight from my night job, Tin Lizzie died dead as dead on a lonely stretch of dark road in a not-great neighborhood. I couldn't get her to start for anything and didn't have a cell phone. I sat there for a long time trying to get up enough nerve to get out and start walking, when I said to the car, "Please start, Lizzie. Just get me home and I promise I'll take you to the mechanic first thing tomorrow." I turned the key and she started right up. I drove the few miles home and I swear as soon as Lizzie's wheels hit the driveway at home she died again.
No one could get her started again. In the morning I had to call a tow truck to get her to the mechanic. When he looked at her engine, some vital wire had been completely disconnected. "Once this car stop, you couldn't have driven it again with this wire disconnected like this," said the mechanic. But I did. So yeah, I think Lizzie had a soul. :-D
Little wrote: "Good clarification Bryn. I figure my belief structure is a mongrel mix, a bit of many ideas, and constantly fluctuating. Basically everything is comprised of stardust. Everything is sacred. In ke..."
Yeah, I'm a mongrel mix myself. I have both animist and pantheist tendencies with a whole lot of different influences. I tend to resist formalization because while I've found wisdom in many different teachings, I find it hard to swallow any one discipline whole. I know that I do not know, having a limited human perception, so I do try to respect all faiths—even those I strongly disagree with—but I rely a whole heck of a lot on intuitional approaches to the universe.
That's it in a nutshell. Respect for all. Also formalisation can create a closed mind, and then you miss out on new concepts or information.
Old-Barbarossa wrote: "Robert wrote: "..."Is that Spare on your icon sir?
:)"
It is. I'm sure he would be horrified.
Bryn wrote: "What I do like in the Wiki description is this, on the difference between pantheism and animism:Animism is not the same as pantheism, although the two are sometimes confused. Some religions are both pantheistic and animistic. One of the main differences is that while animists believe everything to be spiritual in nature, they do not necessarily see the spiritual nature of everything in existence as being united (monism), the way pantheists do. As a result, animism puts more emphasis on the uniqueness of each individual soul. In pantheism, everything shares the same spiritual essence, rather than having distinct spirits and/or souls.[32][33] Additionally, Pantheism posits a source of this "monism". This source may or may not have agency. In contrast, in Animism, the soul or essence or spirit of objects and living things are novel and separate from the whole, while still seen as irrevocably intertwined with one another in a community.
Do people agree?
My understanding is that animism can be without gods. As I have no divinities, but see individual existences, of whatever shape, as how the world is made up, I identify most with animism. "
So close and yet...
Ask a Roman or Greek of their pantheon is anything but individual personalities and they would look at you with confusion. Pantheism is belief in a pantheon of gods. More religions have maintained them as separate than as a whole.
"Animism (from Latin animus "soul, life") is the worldview that non-human entities (animals, plants, and inanimate objects or phenomena) possess a spiritual essence...Animism encompasses the belief that there is no separation between the spiritual and physical (or material) world, and souls or spirits exist, not only in humans, but also in some other animals, plants, rocks, geographic features such as mountains or rivers, or other entities of the natural environment, including thunder, wind, and shadows."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animism