Vampires, Werewolves, and Zombies. discussion

Okay, here's how this conversation started in the topic "5 Vampires Who Need a Holy Water Baptism"....


message 11: by David


Feb 08, 2013 06:06am


Lamprini wrote: "thank god someone fan of gothic horror. i was very glad david that you liked carmilla but why don' t you try something more horror and atmospheric like varney or the mysterious stranger or even WAK..."

Hi, Lamprini. I'm a big fan of Varney and The Mysterious Stranger too. I feel the Fiend of Klatka may possibly have been partial model for Stoker's Dracula.
I love the poem Christabel, by Samuel Taylor Coleridge. You have probably read it, but if you haven't then you should check it out.
Don't know anything about Wake Not The Dead, but it is now on my to do list.


message 12: by Lamprini


Feb 08, 2013 07:33am


to tell you the truth i think that stoker only wrote draculla after having read the mysterious stranger and the land beyond the forest. besideds in his novel says that transilvania is a land beyond the forest and you can see that the mysterious stranger is an early count dracula.i have also read cristabel and please do read the novel of Johann Ludwig Tieck. there are so many early vampire novels that you could not even imagine.
if you can not find it tell me so and i will send it to your mail. see in my wall what i have read.nice talking with you.



message 13: by David


Feb 08, 2013 08:03am


Yes, nice talking with you, too. And I agree with your comments re Stoker. I will check out JLT's novel. Thanks.



message 14: by Dan, Desecrated Dan


Feb 08, 2013 03:17pm


Lamprini wrote: "to tell you the truth i think that stoker only wrote draculla after having read the mysterious stranger and the land beyond the forest. besideds in his novel says that transilvania is a land beyond..."

Yes, Stoker read those for Dracula. He also used Curious Myths of The Middle Ages, The Book of Werewolves, The Origin of Primative Suertitions, and . For Gothic Horror he used a number of novels such as Mille et un Fantommes (A Thousand and One Ghosts) by Alexander Dumas, and by Jules Verne. He ues a shit load of books,stories, articles, etc. for his research. His major influence though seems to be Carmilla. I am going by the term paper I wrote on Bram Stoker in college here. LOL.



message 15: by Lamprini


11 hours, 18 min ago


Lamprini wrote:hi dan, i don't think that carmilla has something to do with dracula(well only it's lesbian part).on the other hand the mysterious stranger is indeed an early one and what is more stoker did not need dumas' novel since he and everybody else had as cornerstone father's Augustin Calmet, "Treaty on the Apparitions of spirits and Vampires, or ghosts of Hungary, Moravia, & c.", published in 1751 which means years after dumas .As far as vern is concerned, well he had everything he needed in the novel "the land beyond the forest" by Emilly Gerard.



message 16: by Dan, Desecrated Dan

(last edited 7 hours, 50 min ago)
7 hours, 53 min ago


When I wrote that paper, I primarily used a chapter in the book Dracula, Prince of Many Faces: His Life and His Times called "Stoker's Count Dracula, The Vampire". It was written by Radu R. Florescu and Raymond T. McNally, they were considered to be Dracula experts. Those were just a few of the books that are listed in there that it says Stoker used. That one book you mentioned isn't talked about in there, but yes, it does say he relied heavily on "The Land Beyond The Forest" by Emily Gerard..



message 17: by Lamprini


7 hours, 12 min ago


dear Dan the book you mention and its writters are indeed EXPERTS, is based on the actual count dracula:his life, story, death, and legacy in literature and films and not on the vampire story Stoker wrote.
i do not know if you have read the mysterious stranger but the "first" impression is that stoker was practically inspired by it.in fact took a great story and made it a masterpeiece.of course if you want to write a book you use many sources but the story itself remains the same and i do not think that carmilla has something to do with draculla.what is more, if you want to learn everything about vampires then you go to the source.Father's Augustin Calmet investigation on the subject is the one that all the others have read and just retell.




message 18: by Dan, Desecrated Dan

(last edited 3 hours, 42 min ago)
3 hours, 50 min ago


Lamprini wrote: "dear Dan the book you mention and its writters are indeed EXPERTS, is based on the actual count dracula:his life, story, death, and legacy in literature and films and not on the vampire story Stoke..."

Actually, there is a chapter in there that deals with Stoker and his influences on writing Dracula. Yes, it is mostly about "Vlad the Impaler", but there is a chapter in there that talks about Stoker's vampire.

Yes, you are right, he was also influenced by "The Mysterious Stranger". I just looked at an article on Vampires. com about that...
http://www.vampires.com/did-anonymous...
I have read Carmilla and I think I am with you in your opinion on it's influence (or lack of influence) on Dracula. It's very different, however most people who research and write about Bram Stoker swear that it was Carmilla that gave Stoker a good kick in the ass to write his own vampire story. I don't know, they also say the whole thing is a mess beacause there are very few records left behind on Stoker's research. I would have to email Dracula expert Elizabeth Miller or Dacre Stoker and ask them more about this. I will also have to check out the Father Augustin Calmet investigation you just mentioned. LOL...I should start a seperate thread on here called "Dracula" so we can continue this discussion further.

P.S.-just curisous, why do you keep spelling "Dracula" with two L's?

It's not fair to Greg to change the subject of his article on the thread he created, therefore we will continue this discussion here.

Just to add my two pence worth. Bram Stoker was obviously influenced by a number of works, and although I don't feel Carmilla played a major part (at least insofar as some of the other stories mentioned), it is worth noting that in his original drafts Dracula was to be based in Styria. This could be related to Carmilla, although it could also be because Styria was once considered (by its residents) to be an area plagued by vampires.

David wrote: "Just to add my two pence worth. Bram Stoker was obviously influenced by a number of works, and although I don't feel Carmilla played a major part (at least insofar as some of the other stories ment..."

This is true. Stoker was originally going to set his story in Styria. The title of the book was originally going to be "The Un-Dead" and the vampire was going to be "Count Wampyr". He changed the name to Dracula because he had read about Vlad Dracula, he also knew that "Dracula" was a Whalchian word for "Devil" and he remembered a Gaelic word drochfola (pronounced Druk-UL-A) which meant "Bad Blood". He liked the word because he thought it had a muscical ring to it. Therefore, in his notes, he crossed out Count Wampyr and wrote over and over again, "Dracula-Dracula-Count Dracula!" as if he were savoring the sound of it. He was going to go ahead and publish the novel under the title "The Un-Dead", but his publisher changed the title to "Dracula" according to Dacre Stoker (Bram Stoker's great grand-nephew).

" dan, i did not know that the above site was yours since i was a member in it as xerxis and it is a very good site indeed. the reason that stoker was first influenced by carmilla to begin his story is because it was more famous than the mysterious stranger was.you must know than even in our days is unknown for most of the people.
please read "tha Phantom world " by Calmet and you will see that even Summers is deeply influenced. nice talking to you.
P.S. you will see the two lls in many old readings.

so, where could they have found the slavic word wampyr, he and le fanu? because until then only few people had visited those countries.

Lamprini wrote: "so, where could they have found the slavic word wampyr, he and le fanu? because until then only few people had visited those countries."

I'm guessing he got the word from Arminius Vambrey, the orientalist from Budapest University, the night they had dinner together at The Beefsteak room. Many people who have researched Stoker argue that he never learned anything at all form Vambrey since it is unknown what they talked about.

Fascinating. I've enjoyed lurking. Thanks.

dear dan, you must know that Calmet and his work precedes by far that to Arminius Vambrey.

Lamprini wrote: "dear dan, you must know that Calmet and his work precedes by far that to Arminius Vambrey."

Hi, Lamprini, just a quick shout out to say that I took your advice and read Wake Not The Dead, and I thought it was a fantastic story. Considering when it was written, then I would have to say it is up there with the very best of them in terms of the tension and atmosphere it creates!

Thanks for the tip:-)

David wrote: "Lamprini wrote: "dear dan, you must know that Calmet and his work precedes by far that to Arminius Vambrey."

Hi, Lamprini, just a quick shout out to say that I took your advice and read Wake Not ..."
good morning david, glad you liked it. now, if you want horror, try alexey tolstoy's The Curse Of The Vourdalak
try it and you will remember me.kisses

Lamprini, you are a star!

Consider it added to my to-read list :-)