A Song of Ice & Fire Fans discussion

Coldhands is Benjen Stark yes/no?

I made myself the same question as I was reading!!!

That's what I thought but beside the fact that he was north of the wall and that his body was not found there isn't any real evidence (as far as I can tell) to suggest that it is Benjen

He's familiar with the castles of the Nights Watch, suggesting he's in someway associated.

This is exactly what I thought too! Benjen is coldhands!

I wondered that through Bran's entire trip North of the wall. It felt right, (wearing black + knowing castles = night's watch, seeming warg with deer = possibly Stark, Benjen has been gone a couple years now, so plenty of time to turn).
It may as easily be some historic figure too. But I like it being Benjen, until proven otherwise.

Agree with Stephanie :-)

Stephanie wrote: "I wondered that through Bran's entire trip North of the wall. It felt right, (wearing black + knowing castles = night's watch, seeming warg with deer = possibly Stark, Benjen has been gone a couple..."

I totally agree! "Your monster, Brandon Stark," struck me as a more personal comment than necessary from a guide leading people through the forest.

I've thought he was benjen but it seems a bit too obvious. I dont know who else it could be but I guess we'll find out.

I don't think it's possible. When they ask the children of the forest about Coldhands they say he was killed long ago. Benjen doesn't fit that category.
But he might have suffered a similar fate like Coldhands, considering we never saw him die for real.

Perhaps Coldhands is one of the ancient Starks?

Anna wrote: "I don't think it's possible. When they ask the children of the forest about Coldhands they say he was killed long ago. Benjen doesn't fit that category.
But he might have suffered a similar fate li..."

Yeah that comment doesn't really fit with it being Benjen. I think there's a theory that he could be the Bloodraven, but I just don't like that so many different characters are being added this late in the story. I'd much rather it be someone we thought was dead come back to life! (And it doesn't hurt that it would be Stark helping Stark, either.)

James wrote: "Perhaps Coldhands is one of the ancient Starks?"

I thought this as well James.

I've thought from square ones that something magical happens to the Starks who die in winter. Especially after that scene where they talk about the swords in the crypts keeping the spirits inside or whatever.

In my mind it would fit perfectly, explains why they are called the Kings of Winter and why they have that uber creepy mantra instead of something braggy like the rest of the houses.


Maybe when Bran removed some of the swords, Coldhands was resurected? /endcrackpottery

Amber wrote: "James wrote: "Perhaps Coldhands is one of the ancient Starks?"

I thought this as well James.

I've thought from square ones that something magical happens to the Starks who die in winter. Especia..."

"...that something magical happens to the Starks who die in winter." ohhh my godd that's my new favorite theory!!!

I think Coldhands could be Bran the builder one of the first men and first king of the north built both winterfell and the wall died a long time ago

for me is not Benjen, Bran should have recognized him the first time he saw him. Come on is his uncle!! and there's the fact that the children of the forest said that coldhands died a lot of time ago. maybe he's a Stark, but not uncle Benjen...

That would be legit if he was Bran the Builder.

I really hope it isn't Benjen, I'd love for him to come back. Though it'd also be pretty badass if he turned out to be the Great Other, then Jon was brought back by Melisandre and he had to choose which side to stand on. That'd be some interesting conflict.

Benjen is more likely... Then a resurrected Stark from the crypts... He called Sam brother when they first met and why would an unsworn Stark do that.... Besides, how would he have passed the wall??

Umm if its bran the builder he could pass through the wall since he built it and the night's watch protect the wall. I'm unsure of who started the nights watch but if bran the builder built it he may have also started the nights watch hence calling him brother.

Plus, even if it isn't Bran - It could easily be a number of Starks. They've been Night's Watchmen since it started.

Pretty sure the Starks founded it. Doesn't Old Nan tell Bran that?

Speaking on this subject, I've been rereading Dance With Dragons and how possible is it that the Great Other and Brynden Three Eyed Crow are the same thing?

His body is pretty dead when Bran finally meets him.

Maybe if he is bi-polar, those two seem to be working at oppisite goals

James wrote: "Perhaps Coldhands is one of the ancient Starks?"

That is what I think. Maybe the Night's King. Old Nan said that he was a Stark.

Amber wrote: "Speaking on this subject, I've been rereading Dance With Dragons and how possible is it that the Great Other and Brynden Three Eyed Crow are the same thing?

His body is pretty dead when Bran final..."

As far are I can see there isn't a Great Other. He is probably another misinterpretation by Melisandre.

I think Coldhands is probably one of the ancient Starks. Benjen may still show up again (I hope).

I also thought that Benjen is Coldhands, but wasn't sure, mostly because of the comment about his death being long ago. Brynden Three Eyed Crow is Bloodraven, though. The birthmark on his face is the definitive clue, as we meet Bloodraven in the Dunk & Egg novellas, and see his birthmark there.

I really liked Benjen I hope he reappears.
I'd also love to see Serio reappear somehow, as well as J.H. and Jory ( sob!)
( am I in mourning?) maybe....
G.R.R. M. really has a way of developing characters that we fall in love with, or admire so much, that we miss them when they are ripped out of our consciousness, (and out of the lives of the others we have grown to love in his stories.)
Sheize!

Bryan wrote: "I also thought that Benjen is Coldhands, but wasn't sure, mostly because of the comment about his death being long ago. Brynden Three Eyed Crow is Bloodraven, though. The birthmark on his face is..."

Yeah, there are a lot of convincing theories that Three Eyed Crow is Brynden Rivers aka Bloodraven.

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/...

I don't think it's very likely that Three eyes crow is also The Great Other (If such a thing actually exists)

As for Coldhands, I have no idea, Benjen sounds like the likeliest theory but again how did he end up like that? And because I really like Benjen, I hope he will return to series alive and well.

Forgive an obvious observation but if Coldhands isn't Benjen then why is he dressed in Nights Watch clothing, if he died 'long ago' then his clothes would have rotted, magic/evil may work on flesh but cloth is different? Like I said could be a stupid thing to notice but if nothing GRRM is a stickler for details. My vote Benjen is Coldhands and the Others aren't the baddies the Wights are and they are controlled by something else.

Eyehavenofilter wrote: "I really liked Benjen I hope he reappears.
I'd also love to see Serio reappear somehow, as well as J.H. and Jory ( sob!)
( am I in mourning?) maybe....
G.R.R. M. really has a way of developing char..."

Some people flirt with the idea that Serio Forel was Jacquen Hagar (sp?) and that is why he was in the black cells

I thought Jaquen was 'the kindly man' at the temple who is training Arya?

No currently jaquen has presumably taken the form of a boy named Pate at the citadel. The one who sam meets

Yes, he is undercover at the Citadel.

How did I miss that? Must flick back over that chapter.

I wonder if he's there to 'steal' knowledge of dragons from Marwyn the Mage... so he can fulfill his contract to assassinate Danaerys (sanctioned by King Robert before his death)... Hmmm...

N, it is kind of hard to miss. When jaqen changes his face in front of arya, that description is later givrn at the citadel in a prologue and that man kills someone named pate. Then later sam meets pate at the citadel. This pate is presumed to be jaqen. The kindly man is just anothrr faceless man

First, everyone thinks the faceless men are only assassins, but I think they are players more than pawns. I am of the opinion marwyn/J'ghar are a team set up against certain people at Oldtown aiding the Great Other. Coldhands is super old. So I m thinking about the Stark that married the Other in the Old Nan story.

Thanks for the information Adam but 7, 000+ pages and approximately the same amount of characters I'd say things are very easy to miss.

It miss-able, it doesn't say outright, technically it's a theory. Strong theory, and most likely correct, but theory none the less.
Daario Naharis has a similar description just with blue dye in his hair. So, *shrug*

Also, Coldhands his sentient enough, I assume he could easily change his clothing if he so desired. Plenty of Crows have died beyond the wall. Not that crazy.
Outside that, clothes don't rot that easily, especially when they are preserved by freezing cold temperatures. (real life example: http://www.nbcnews.com/science/pre-vi... ) Also, Sam found the dragon glass wrapped in a cloak, and it's assumed it wasn't put there during recent times, so supports the idea they these artifacts of clothing can last.

I really hope it's Benjen, but i'm leaning twoards some sort of Other.

Amber, Amber, Amber. Jon found the dragonglass. I recently re-read this passage & noticed four things. First, Ghost would not enter the fist of the men. Second, later Ghost come in & Jon notices a restlessness. Third, Jon follows Ghost. notices a flash of green (Child of the forest?) Fourth, Ghost leads Jon to a freshly dug area. my opinion Bloodraven was warging Ghost so Jon could find the dragonglass, recently placed there. I didn't make the conection until I started to look for Bloodraven's possible influence

OH GOD STEPHEN! WHAT IS HAPPENING TO ME!!

*cries* I used to know this all like the back of my hands, it's slowly fading out as I intake Lynch and PVBrett all at once. :/

But those are some interesting ideas, I should probably do a recap of the series again so I can hate myself when S4 of GOT comes out. LOL

Not sure I like the idea of Ghost being polluted by another Wrag - I prefer the thought that the Dire Wovles just 'know stuff'. Also as Ghost is the 'silent one' he could easily have watched the cloak being buried with the Dragonglass. However it is made clear several times by several characters that 'in the Game of Thrones you are a player or a piece' and perhaps Bloodraven is the biggest player! Something to think about.....perhaps the 'green dreams' that brought the frog siblings (forget his name) to Bran are Bloodravens human wraging skills?!?

Go back & read the Dunk & Egg #3 Mystery Knight. Bloodraven is Sir Badass.

Yeah I think he is.

Sorry for reanimate an old thread, but i don't think, that coldhand is Benjen. It's too easy to think that, and i agree with the idea that Bran would have to recognise his uncle. But i agree of Coldhand being an Nightwatchmen. I'm doing a re-read of the whole series at the moment, and i'm coming to this scene soon. I think after reading this now i'm going to be more observant, so maybe i'm going back here to give more detailed ideas of mine.

Piru wrote: "for me is not Benjen, Bran should have recognized him the first time he saw him. Come on is his uncle!! and there's the fact that the children of the forest said that coldhands died a lot of time a..."

Except that bran may not have known his uncle and cold hands kept his face hidden behind a scarf I I remember correctly

I origionally that that cold hands was Eddard Stark but I doubt it

Coldhands is one of those mysteries I hope will be revealed in Winds......