Les Misérables discussion

Many people think that Grantaire and Enjolras like each other as more than friends. I think that there is some minor implication of it, but not enough to go around raving about how they "should totally be a couple" like some readers do. I found the fact that they died together a powerful demonstration of their bond either way and it is clear that Grantaire admires Enjolras greatly, but is this enough to claim romantic attraction between the two? What are your thoughts?

To be polite, there is no trace of intelligence in the brains of those readers who claim that there is a "romantic attraction" between Grantaire and Enjolras.

(Digression: It is an example to show that homosexual trending, supporting, advertising, patronising etc. are hazardous to Mankind.)

In my opinion, Grantaire's philosophy was similar to nihilism, he negated everything and believed in nothing. He adored Enjolras as dogs look towards their owners, as medieval knights loved their ladies, as believers worship their God(s).

Enjolras, on the other hand, was extremely aggressive, a far-left republican. If I remember correctly, he DID have a mistress and during the insurgency he bethought himself of his mistress, didn't he? So, Could anyone give me a lucid explanation of his behaviour?

They died together didn't mean they were homosexual. (I don't know how people can come into this imagination.) In the battlefield, soldiers fight and die in the hands of their comrades, but did that justify they are homosexual?

I didn't think in the book they were portrayed as having any kind of close relationship, but the way they are portrayed in the 2012 film I think shows a very close friendship - more so than the book in my opinion.

@Tirzah: I have checked and confess that I'm a fool on the matter of Enjolras' mistress.

There is a part where Enjolras mentions that his mistress is "Patria," which is a metaphor for his dedication to the republic.

I didn't make this clear in my previous post, but my thoughts on the matter were more of a "wouldn't that make an interesting twist?" after I read the line about Enjolras being Grantaire's one dogma and that he loved and admired him. Since I'm a teenager my mind did briefly go there, though I didn't put a whole lot of stock into it. I recently saw in an online article that George Blagden, who plays Grantaire in the new movie, thinks that his character is attracted to Enjolras. Also, when Hadley Frasier and Ramin Karimloo played the roles, they portrayed them with a similar angle. This got me thinking about it a little more.

I think it's obvious Enjolras isn't interested in Grantaire romantically, Hugo makes it pretty clear that he doesn't have much time for Grantaire due to his light treatment of their cause and nihilistic views. His passion is for his country and their cause, and he doesn't seem to have room to love anything else! Again as Lauren said, his mistress was 'Patria'.
On the other hand though, I don't think it's a stretch to say Grantaire has feelings for Enjolras. He obviously loves and admires him for his belief and leadership and idolises him in that regard. As Hugo says, Enjolras is the sole reason Grantaire is one of the Friends. I think there are some hints that his feelings went beyond that though, for example in the original description of their relationship Hugo compares them to Achilles and Patroclus. Also, for someone as nihilistic as Grantaire, I think it would take a lot for him to give up his life for a cause as he did, perhaps something more than admiration?
So I do think the people who read into the relationship aren't being overly imaginative!Though the master/dog relationship would also fit as Pndasmile suggested. Either way though, I feel it doesn't overly change their relationship, Enjolras being as he is, and their deaths are always going to be a fantastic illustration of the strength of belief and friendship.

I just wanted to make a comment. Two guys who are "more than just friends" don't have to be attracted to each other in a sexual way. Ever heard of a "bromance"? That's just another term for "bosom buddies." Guys in a "bromance" are fully heterosexual--they just share an unusually close bond, like David and Jonathan in the Bible.

As for Grantaire and Enjolras, I personally found it difficult to care about any of the members of the ABC Society for the most part. :)

IIRC most of the time Enjolras's principal feelings towards Grantaire were exasperation and irritation, neither of which is a good basis for claiming a romantic relationship. There is a moment before they die but I read that more as an expression of great understanding of each other's motives for their actions rather than they're in love with each other.

Mike - David and Jonathan in the Bible were homosexual lover's but over the centuries the story has been supressed and lost in all the translations. Duh. Didn't you know?

I personally think that Grantaire was in love with Enjolras and that Enjolras's was either a late bloomer or asexual, and he definitley was fond of Grantaire but not in that kind of way. Hugo mentions how Enjolras had virgin lips, that the only 2 kisses he bestowed in his life were to the 80 year old hero of the barricade.

But also that he had a mistress. One must assume that he spent time with this women in a none sexual way if his lips were virgin, probably he enjoyed her company or something like that

So in short, it's a one way relationship that makes me very :(.

Enjolras was probably asexual, "chaste" like Hugo said, completely uninterested of sex. Grantaire "loved" Enjolras, who didn´t like this badly behaving drunk - except "lofty pity" - before in the end. I find their dynamic fascinating.

Pndasmile wrote: "To be polite, there is no trace of intelligence in the brains of those readers who claim that there is a "romantic attraction" between Grantaire and Enjolras.

(Digression: It is an example to show..."

Way to go with insulting people. Enjolras never had a mistress. He did say his mistress was Patria, a.k.a. France. And Victor Hugo did compare both Enjolras and Grantaire to several homosexual classical figures, call them the obverse of one another, inseperable, and two sides of the same coin, along with stating Grantaire admired, loved and venerated Enjolras. It's not their death scene. It's that and every other interaction in the book.

I think Grantaire's fancy of Enjolras (as others have said) is more of a 'hero worship'. It went FAR beyond sexuality. It was a true "love" not a lust.

Enjolras was written asexually but it doesn't mean he was asexual. Could have been (in my dreams he is because I am, too and I like the thought of being able to adore someone and them not think I want to puruse them sexually) but just because his sexuality wasn't mentioned at all just means it really wasn't important to the story. It's like they didn't mention he went to the toilet and ate meals either - it just wasn't important in the long run.

I like the 'mystery' of Grantaire and Enjolras. I know the fan fiction clubs have had a field day with it and if that's what they want, have fun. I just hope they don't overtake the mystery and that become the accepted.

Pndasmile wrote: "To be polite, there is no trace of intelligence in the brains of those readers who claim that there is a "romantic attraction" between Grantaire and Enjolras.

(Digression: It is an example to show..."

Lord Almighty at your "the gays are hazardous to mankind."

Pushing that aside, Enjolras and Grantaire, especially Grantaire, being read as queer is a legitimate interpretation, just as Dorian Gray being read as queer is.

Enjolras was not interested in women, but regardless of that there's the allusions of homosexual Greek figures, Grantaire's love for Enjolras, Grantaire as an artist (artist was a word commonly used for homosexual in this period), etc. I think it's definitely fair to believe Hugo meant their dynamic to be homoromantic.

Also, you realize Patria is France....? Enjolras does not have a mistress.

Pndasmile wrote: "To be polite, there is no trace of intelligence in the brains of those readers who claim that there is a "romantic attraction" between Grantaire and Enjolras.

(Digression: It is an example to show..."

Wow, you're right: this was so polite I almost took it as a compliment.

Not only are you being unnecessarily rude in insulting a (fairly significant, you'll be sorry to hear) proportion of readers, you are also being arrogant and egotistical in suggesting that any interpretation of the text other than your own is not even worth consideration.

The theories of those readers to whose intelligence, or supposed lack thereof, you so "politely" referred are in fact very valid and well-founded. I would like you to consider that Grantaire "admired, loved and venerated Enjolras", and clings to him--not, unlike, perhaps, some of the other Amis, for his ideals and political values, but for the person he is--"as to a spinal column"; that Hugo describes Grantaire's relationship to Enjolras with references to numerous pairs of male lovers from mythology and history. Consider also that despite his apparent disdain towards Grantaire, Enjolras does not turn him away from their meetings: he does not hate Grantaire; he wants him to reach his potential, to pull himself up and to soar alongside him, because he knows that he could. Enjolras never gives up on him or kicks him out, even though Grantaire seems to be the only person who causes him to truly lose his well-controlled temper. His feelings towards Grantaire are certainly not dismissive or indifferent.

Now consider their deaths: Grantaire has gone to the barricade and remained there, despite not believing in the ideals they are representing. When he wakes up, he could easily have tried to remain unnoticed and potentially survived, yet he decides he would rather die by Enjolras' side. Enjolras is glad--one might almost say proud--of the way Grantaire eventually fulfills Enjolras' hopes for him, proving himself "worthy" of Enjolras' attentions, and he therefore chooses to use his last moments to smile at Grantaire and take his hand.
Enjolras chooses. To die. Holding Grantaire's hand.
In case that wasn't clear for you.

I am not saying "Enjolras and Grantaire were in love and you are wrong." I am simply saying that Hugo includes some very deliberate homoerotic subtext in writing these characters and their relationship to each other, and that those who choose to see it as evidence of an attraction between them are very well-founded in doing so. You are free to interpret the text how you like! but grant the same privilege to your fellow readers.

(P.S. As other commenters have pointed out, yes, Enjolras naming Patria as his "mistress" refers to his devotion to his country. Also, when Enjolras places a kiss on the forehead of M. Mabeuf, we are told this is the first kiss he has ever given in his life.)

James wrote: "@Tama - ... Every reader may interpret the text as he finds it, but I would urge readers to consider multiple interpretations rather than to fix upon one. -
"

Of course! That's the best part about things being ambiguous: that you can try out different interpretations, different theories, look at it from a different perspective each time, etc.

Again, I was not arguing that there is no question of there being romantic implications. I simply took offence to the way Pndasmile insulted a large proportion of fans, myself included, and stated they had no basis for their opinion, which is simply not true. :)

James wrote: "@Tama - Male friendships were idealized by the Romantics and they talked about these relationships in terms that strike a 21st century reader as homoerotic or something more than mere friendship - ..."

Hugo describing a homosexual relationship in other than explicit terms is more interesting than "the Romantics had an understanding about male friendships that is different thans ours" because there is an extreme lack of queer inclusion in media whereas same sex friendship is abundant.

Manning wrote: Hugo describing a homosexual relationship in other than explicit terms is more interesting than "the Romantics had an understanding about male friendships that is different thans ours" because there is an extreme lack of queer inclusion in media whereas same sex friendship is abundant.


Yes this! Besides that, "male friendships" is hardly some complex social construct that requires an "understanding". Certainly, in the past, relationships may have been viewed differently, but that doesn't mean they necessarily were.
And besides that, if you're trying to say Enjolras and Grantaire fit into this "are they just friends or something more" dynamic, it... really doesn't work.

(PS @Manning do I recognise you from tumblr???)

For this discussion i think we must separate the feelings of Enjorlas towards Grantaire from the vice versa an look at them individually.
Enjorlas has no mistress. "Patria" was a reference to his cause which he is completely devoted to. He is asexual, he only loves his cause. Grantaire is a nonbeliever, the reason he never kicked him out and showed him such kindness was because Enjorlas felt himself a missionary, trying to convert Grantaire to his political religion. When they were about to die he took Grantaire's hand because the fact that even a nonbeliever was willing to fight proved to Enjorlas that their cause was justified.
Grantaire may or may not have been homosexual, depends on how one interprets the book. personally i got the feeling that he was from the way he worshiped Enjorlas. French romantic novelists in that time wrote about homosexuality (Danglar's daughter Eugenie in The Count of Monte Cristo for example) so it would not be surprising if that was Hugo's original meaning...

Jess took the words right out of my mouth. Enjolras is referred to as a well-known homosexual from the classical era, though I can't remember his name. Also both Grantaire and Enjolras are likened to Pylades and Orestes, homosexual lovers from Greek mythology. Though there may have not been any actual evidence in the novel towards a love affair between the two (since Enjolras so vehemently abhors Grantaire until their deaths), these two allusions to other classical characters points to homosexual tendencies. And as for Pndasmile saying those who think there may be an affection for each other doesn't have any brains in their heads in beyond rude. Obviously, if one researches the names Grantaire and Enjolras are likened to, they must have some sort of brain and intelligence since they decide to look into the deeper meaning of Hugo's allusions.

Oh, and by the way, if you're going to state a fact, such as Enjolras's mistress, do your own research about who Patria is. Because it's not a woman. It's an ideal. How about that for brains?

Tara wrote: "Jess took the words right out of my mouth. Enjolras is referred to as a well-known homosexual from the classical era, though I can't remember his name."

Assuming you are referring to Antinous (lover of the Roman emperor Hadrian) :)

My opinion is that Grantaire was in love with him. Hugo writes that Enjolras's mistress was 'Patria' (France) and that 'He did not seem to know that there was on the earth a being called woman'. But Grantaire is deeply in love with him, and you see that by how he watches him and how he answers to his questions.
Grantaire proves him his love the day of their death. I think it's beautiful...

People, Enjolras's mistress was Patria,Patria is France. So unless if France suddenly became a real women he does not have a real mistress. It refers to France as his mistress to show his dedication and love for his country. Also, I believe Enjolras and Grantaire have a beautifully tragic relationship that with more time could have become romantic if they had survived that day at the barricade. Especially if after Grantaire had gone up there fully prepared to die with him and somehow someone else survived and shot the squad that was about to kill them. (I might make that story now..) The point is, they would be a beautiful couple if given the chance and that it is obvious Grantaire was in love with Enjolras.

Pamela wrote: "People, Enjolras's mistress was Patria,Patria is France. So unless if France suddenly became a real women he does not have a real mistress. It refers to France as his mistress to show his dedicatio..."

We already established the point about Patria. :)
I can't say I'd afree they would have been "a beautiful couple if given the chance"; their personalities put them at odds, as demonstrated by... well, every mention of them in the book, bar OF&PD. Unless both of them, but especially Grantaire, modified themselves a lot post-"not-death", not much would have changed, I think.

OK, my musings:
Hugo wrote sympathetic characters having sex outside marriage - even polyamorous trio Joly and Bossuet with same mistress Musichetta! - but he had special thing for virgins. They are Purest - Marius, Cosette, Enjolras. Like Cosette is not so much a young girl than a symbol of hope for bullied, oppressed and tortured, Enjolras is not so much a real young man but a symbol of Republic ideal: beautiful and pure, enemy of poverty and injustice. Enjolras´ is compared - at least partly because of his looks - to Antinous, handsome young lover of Roman Emperor Hadrianus (or Hadrian in English), who was deified after his death: "He was angelically handsome. He was savage Antinous." Enjolras is also compared to other ancient god, Apollo.
Enjolras doesn´t seem to notice that there was women on Earth - NOT because women or love were unclean but because he was so driven by Republic; he was even compared to Greek figure Harmodus who attacked tyrant; he is rejecting flowers (symbol of love) and "bare bosom" of Evadne.
Enjolras life was tied with Grantaire who "admired, loved, and venerated Enjolras". According to Hugo: "One might almost say that affinities begin with the letters of the alphabet. In the series O and P are inseparable. You can, at will, pronounce O and P or Orestes and Pylades." It is 19th century tradition of Romantic friendship (idea of love without sex) and although Enjolras rejected R at first, Enjolras accepts him in the end.
Note: Homosexuality was legal in 19th century France and writing queer characters was happened long before Les Misérables.

Gothicromantic wrote: " "One might almost say that affinities begin with the letters of the alphabet. In the series O and P are inseparable. You can, at will, pronounce O and P or Orestes and Pylades." It is 19th century tradition of Romantic friendship (idea of love without sex) and although Enjolras rejected R at first, Enjolras accepts him in the end. "

Can't have an OTP with out an O and a P. ;)

But, in all seriousness, I don't think that homosexuality would cheapen their relationship. If anything, I think it would add another dimension to it. Reading it without slash-goggles I still felt that there was more to their relationship that was stated explicitly in the text.

Sebastian wrote: "Gothicromantic wrote: " "One might almost say that affinities begin with the letters of the alphabet. In the series O and P are inseparable. You can, at will, pronounce O and P or Orestes and Pylad..."

Actually, I find their book dynamic fascinating and also homoromantic. Too bad there is not any interesting fanfiction about this two! (I am all for fans having fun with their fandom but E/R fanfiction... does not work for me.)

I agree with @Gothicromantic when s/he says that Enjolras is almost more of a symbol than a real person in the dynamic of the book: he is the spirit, the "logic" of the revolution, a man almost one-dimensionally devoted to his cause, to his people, to his country (Patria ;) ). The aspect in which is is mostly considered is this burning devotion that accompanies him to his death, and the characters that are associated to him (directly, before Grantaire is introduced) are characteristically revolutionary figure, Saint Just and Graccus. Saint Just in particular is repeatedly compared to him, and even if Hugo probably had a romantic view of his character, he was Robespierre's right hand, the youngest of the pack of Jacobins during the French Revolution, and one of the fiercest supporters of the Terror: a person usually defined as handsome, hard, ambitious, austere to the point of cruelty. Enjolras is inspired by the great, romanticized figures of the French Revolution, Robespierre "The Incorruptible", Saint Just, the young devoted. Such figures were known to be undaunted by any form of "earthly" distraction, individual love first of all. If you look at his behaviour during the book, Enjolras doesn't show any love for anyone, except his cause, his country and his people. Even when considered together with his friends, we don't really get to see any real display of affection from his side (I'm not implying of course that he didn't love them all, since the best part of his character is that much is left to our imagination, but there's not an actual scene in which he actively shows love).
As far as his relationship with Grantaire goes, Hugo tells us that "Enjolras, croyant, dédegnait ce sceptique, et, sobre, cet ivrogne. Il lui accordait un peu de pitié hautaine". From what we can get of his character from the book, he doesn't love Grantaire, he comes close to despising him because of what he is, or pretends to be. He doesn't hold back from actually hurting him when he could, hitting exactly where it would hurt the most, when he cries at him "Grantaire, tu es incapable de croire, de penser, de vouloir, de vivre et de mourir". He only shows some humanity toward Grantaire when he actually takes a stand next to him, when he decides to actually take a side in his fight and adhere more to his idea of a fighter, of a person.
My impression from Hugo (which is not the mental image that I have of Enjolras, but still) is that Enjolras is a person so consumed from his ideal love for abstract concepts like Freedom, The People, Equality, Patria and so on that he comes close to neglect or even despise everything that is not actively related to, or working in favour of, these concepts.
On the other hand, Grantaire is a person called out since the beginning for his incapability to believe and his need to love. He is the perfect opposite of Enjolras, a person incapable of idealistic sentiments but very much capable of any sort of earthly love (alcohol, women...). That he loves Enjolras, I think is beyond doubt. It is continuously reaffirmed throughout the book that he adores Enjolras, he stays there only for Enjolras, he is the one that appreciate the most his passion, his focus, his character in general. As Hugo says, it's not uncommon to find a cynic helplessly attached to the passion of a devoted, it's almost natural. Devotees can give a cynic back some of his trust in the world, something among the lines of "if people like them are possible...".
I can't say whether Grantaire was sexually attached to Enjolras or not. It's possible. But I don't think that, even if he did, he would ever consider it possible, or even just noticeable: he puts Enjolras on too high a pedestal for that. Grantaire "needs" Enjolras because he restores his faith in the world, he brings some of his passion for life back, he gives him a reason to believe that something is still possible.
As for their deaths, partly it is symbolic (even the cynics can't stay out of a fight for some high ideal or something like this), and partly is their reconciliation: Grantaire, as a nihilist, doesn't have a reason on his own to go on, while he can have "a beautiful death" next to the last person capable to have him feeling something; Enjolras, as a believer, prefers to die alongside a person who believed in him and potentially in what he did, a person that can potentially symbolize all of those that had not participated the struggle but still decided to face its consequences.
In the end, Enjolras dies for his ideals and Grantaire dies for Enjolras. Enjolras stays upright against the wall and Grantaire stays at Enjolras' feet. They both represent two things worth dying for, ideals and love.
I think that their dynamic is beautiful, even if maybe a bit too one-sided for my liking. I'm not sure Enjolras would ever have gone to "like" Grantaire as he was (I like to think they would have sorted it out, but I'm not really sure they would), but I like the way their relationship is portrayed in the musical and in the movie - it makes Enjolras "real", more human, and therefore more "likable" in a sense, and I still think that they would have made great sparring friends, if any.

To me, it is clear that Grantaire has more than friendly feelings towards Enjolras. Even though throughout the story, examples of his admiration and veneration of Enjolras are demonstrated, I feel that the primary example of the depth of his feelings are found in the death scene. Grantaire is sleeping, passed out drunk and awakens shortly before Enjolras was to be executed by the National Guard soldiers. I feel that although it would've been sad, and even cowardly, Grantaire could've stayed silent, and could've found a way to escape the carnage. However, instead, he rises up and declares, "Vive le Rupublique!" I found this very intereseting, seeing as Grantaire held no stock in this cause. He, the cynic, did not believe in anything. It is one thing to admire Enjolras and think of him in a godly manner, but it is an entirely different thing to willingly go to his death to be by his side when the guns sounded. This, to me, proved that the reltionship there had much more than Hugo made obvious. I mean, Grantaire dies for somethign he doesn't even care about at all, but he dies to be with Enjolras. Enjolras never gives any signs of seeing Grantaire as more than a drunken cynic, which caused me to think more about if the relationship was one sided. However, at the end, when Grantaire asks, "do you permit it?" Enjolras takes his hand with a smile. This is very subtle, and it may mean nothing at all, but I feel like this implied a deeper relationship than Hugo had let on.
I am also a hopeless romantic, so in my mind that's how I wanted it to be. There are defintely arguements for them having no relationship at all, and there are some for a one sided relationship as well. In my heart, I would like to believe that there was something there. If only we could as Hugo himself. This question will probably plague me for the rest of my life; I'm crazy about Les Miserables.

Megan wrote: "To me, it is clear that Grantaire has more than friendly feelings towards Enjolras. Even though throughout the story, examples of his admiration and veneration of Enjolras are demonstrated, I feel ..."
I too find their relationship intriguing. I think it was one-sided till the end, and I like to think that they ended together in Heaven. :)

Back in the 1800s when Les Miserables was written, homosexuality was a very "taboo" subject. Hugo could not advocate it. His book would have been banned. It is my personal opinion that Grantaire and Enjolras were more like brothers.

Oh, I don´t think Hugo advocated homosexuality, although homosexuality was not unknown in 19th century literature (Balzac, for example, wrote about the theme). I THINK - I may be wrong - that Hugo had idea of Romantic friendship - pre-20th century idea of sexless love between people of same gender. Joly and Bossuet has this kind of relationship, if I remember right - weren´t they so close that they slept together? I don´t think Hugo uses "sleep" as euphemism for sex. Hugo comments Enjolras´virginity and chastity approvingly: "That chaste, healthy, firm, upright, hard, candid nature charmed him (Grantaire), without his being clearly aware of it, and without the idea of explaining it to himself having occurred to him. He admired his opposite by instinct." Just something to ponder...

For goodness sake, what is the absolute obsession with having to know if a character is Homosexual or not? I have read more questions than enough about different characters in different books! Especially when it really does not matter! I found no hint of Grantaire and Enjolras being anything other than great friends. I just find it so tiresome that characters are torn apart by people obsessed with whether they were gay or not. Get over it!

I always thought of Enjolras as asexual. He really doesn't seem too interested in either sex. It states clearly in the book that he was not interested or fond of women, he would not even look at them. Nor did he show any preferences for men. I don't think it's a far stretch to say that Grantaire was in love with him. He clearly greatly admired him and showed up to the meetings and died for a cause he did not believe in simply because he idolized Enjolras. Also, they are compared to quite a few homosexual partners from history and mythology. This could imply they shared a homosexual relationship, or it could just mean that they are not complete without the other. Truthfully neither one of them functions as a well put together person. Both are too different extremes. Enjolras is too idealistic and puts faith in unrealistic beliefs. Grantaire is too cynical and believes in nothing, not to mention he is an alcoholic. However, pairing the two up makes a well put together person who can function in society. I think Hugo was probably aiming towards that more than anything romantic between them. That being said they are an easy pair to ship and I understand how people pick up that context. I myself am a huge E/R shipper.

Penny, I am not "obsessed" with these characters - I am not really even in this fandom - but if people discuss about books and characters, so what? Just ignore the discussions you dislike.
I see Enjolras as asexual and I THINK Hugo had in mind idea of Romantic friendship, pre-20th century idea(l) of love without sex - if I remember right, Joly and Bossuet were so close they slept together and I don´t think it was euphemism for sex. But I´m not sure.

Mimi, I agree that fans in aný fandom can be disgustingly "OMG, you have DIFFERENT opinion!" For example, I disliked the 2012 movie and saying that in certain circles...

I think that Enjolras was so focused on France that a relationship wasn't even on his mind. As far as Grantaire goes, I think he admired Enjolras as someone he wished he could have been. Think back to your childhood about someone you looked up to. Maybe a celebrity or a family member. For me, I always wanted to be them. I would dress, talk, and act like them but I knew that I could never BE them.

I'm actually fairly certain that currently at least, the strongest advocators for this (beautiful glorious) ship are greatly influenced by the musical or the movie. If you've watched the 25th concert, then you'll probably remember Drink With Me being filled with so much romantic? platonic? subtext between the two. As in it's impossible to miss because they actually did a close up on it in the dvd ( I believe it's on youtube as well but the filmer didn't record the whole thing between Karimloo and Fraser) it was more text than subtext (and a few switches from butt sex im so sorry but anagrams its hilarious) The movie was much more subtle but it was there or at least the one sided pining present in the novel and as any performance there's also quite of nuance which can be perceived differently depending on one's preference.

Personally, I've always though Enjolras as while neither aromantic nor asexual just uninterested? Or perhaps demisexual to be honest I'm not quite sure how to categorise it without going it over extensively because of the time period and such. But at the same time, please understand that shippers don't just see who has the most possibly romantic subtext but also who has or could have the most important dynamic. As Hugo said, they were different sides of the same coin, one could easily think that if perhaps some little thing event had changed or shifted the quiet disdain and worshipping might have changed. Also to Robyn, even if it was a taboo subject, I don't think that necessarily wouldve stopped Hugo, after all if you liked a subject considered taboo there would be some fun in dancing around it right?

Also in reply to the first post, it's not necessarily that, personally I don't believe there was one in the novel (but I can't say the same as in the musical and movie as I felt like while it's the same characters but there are some definite differences I can't ignore) but there is a lot of subtext/ust/pining/possibility/interesting dynamics. There's a lot of reasons why they aren't, bookjolras and bookR (and I say this because again, eR has a lot of facets and I'm assuming most of us are thinking of the book) are too different and the foundation-veneration and disdain- is so entirely one sided, both of them, that I just don't thinking it happened in canon as things currently are. Not only that Enjolras was wholly devoted to Patria, he had no time nor interest in pursuing love or anything not Republic oriented. Even if he had feelings I doubt he'd try to dwell on it, he'd push it down until his dreams have been realized. Grantraire on the other hand. well his Apollo is just that, Apollo. A distant god, blinding in beauty and utterly unreachable in a way. That's why I disagree with Millie, kinda, R didn't want to be him, he was stupefied by Enjolras' radiance and passion and he kinda wanted to soak in the rays you know? But if he can't well, getting burnt is close enough

Hugo wrote Enjolras as chaste and virginal, comparing him favorably to promiscuous Grantaire: "That chaste, healthy, firm, upright, hard, candid nature charmed him (Grantaire), without his being clearly aware of it, and without the idea of explaining it to himself having occurred to him. He admired his opposite by instinct." I think Enjolras smut (apt word) is oxymoron and extremely OOC, although very popular fanon.

I find the differing opinions humorous. Everyone understands the love for France, but it seems that showing love for a man to another man MUST be sexual in nature.

There are also many assumptions, but not one person I found addressed the simple fact the Victor Hugo lived in France during the 3 Day Rebellion. He actually was caught in the middle and the characters were based on real people.

Victor Hugo also had strong religious convictions and this can be seen through out the book. The views of the Church of France would have been Anti-Homosexual...

Meaning, the chances of Victor Hugo trying to be coy and hint to a homosexual relationship would not be a reasonable assumption, unless you ignore the times, the writer and every other message in the book.

BTW, you can be a man and have severe admiration. Many men look up and admire other men, and Victor Hugo drives on the point of mercy, grace and true love, NOT sexual passions.

Note how the prostitutes are described, versus other women.

"Everyone understands the love for France, but it seems that showing love for a man to another man MUST be sexual in nature."
False equivalence. Are you saying there would even be a chance of Enjolras being sexually attracted to a country?

"Victor Hugo also had strong religious convictions and this can be seen through out the book. The views of the Church of France would have been Anti-Homosexual..."
He did, but given the nature of the message of the book, given the nature of the symbols used for Enjolras and Grantaire, the Greek homosexual figures, it seems reasonable.

There's no "relationship" and I have a doubt Enjolras felt love for Grantaire (though his chastity was due to being religious, rather than not being able to feel sexual desire), but I'm certain Grantaire is clearly portrayed as homosexual.

Penny wrote: "For goodness sake, what is the absolute obsession with having to know if a character is Homosexual or not? I have read more questions than enough about different characters in different books! Esp..."

Queer representation is important! Besides, analyzing books is fun and interesting. People do it all the time, plus academically, in school, etc, yet when it comes to the topic of homosexuality it's suddenly weird and obsessive? Come on, now. Also, no, Enjolras and Grantaire were not friends. You might want to do a reread.

Robyn wrote: "Back in the 1800s when Les Miserables was written, homosexuality was a very "taboo" subject. Hugo could not advocate it. His book would have been banned. It is my personal opinion that Grantaire an..."

Never heard of The Picture of Dorian Gray? Sure, homosexuality was taboo, but subtext in literature DID happen. Not to mention, France was the first country to legalize sodomy (in the 1700s.)

Marina wrote: "Everyone keeps mentioning the Greeks, forgetting one little thing - Grantaire était un Pylade point accepté - Grantaire was an unacceptable Pylades.

So how much more unacceptable he would have bee..."

The point being that Grantaire wanted to be the Pylades to Enjolras' Orestes, the Patroclus to Enjolras' Achilles, etc, these iconic homosexual Greek companions, but was unacceptable, his love and admiration wasn't returned. It only adds to the idea that Grantaire has a one-sided homosexual love/desire for Enjolras.

I never got the impression that they had any romantic feelings for each other. To me, they shared a deep, brotherly bond- sort of like David and Jonathan. The first time I ever heard of Enjolras and Grantaire being "shipped" was from teenage Les Mis fangirls who'd only seen the musical or movie.

Let's reflect on their relationship a bit. I've been reading through the comments and some I agree on, some I don't, and some offended me, considering I do happen to be a 'fangirl Les Mis' shipper but I have read the book quite a few times actually, not just the movie and musical. But anyway, back to E/R.

When some of you guys say that Enjolras hated or disliked Grantaire, I believe that's entirely untrue. Enjolras did not hate Grantaire, though it may seem like it through dialogue, he just hated Grantaire's cynicism, skepticism, his drunkenness, and the fact that Grantaire has so much potential but just sits around and squanders it. Not much is mentioned about Grantaire's past, but it was mentioned that Grantaire studied painting as a child, danced, did gymnastics, and kickboxing, but seeing him now(in the book), Grantaire is nothing more than just a drunk.

It's true that homosexuality was not uncommon in those days, just look it Joly and Bossuet. They shared a woman, but it was most likely that they loved each other as well, especially since sharing a mistress with another man isn't exactly what a man wants, unless you look at it both ways: sharing a man with a woman. I'm not saying that Enjolras and Grantaire were romantically involved, I'm just saying that if they had not died, then it possibly could have lead to something. Hugo himself states that Grantaire 'loved, admired, venerated' Enjolras, but not in the way we expect it. Grantaire loved and admired Enjolras because Enjolras was exactly what he was not. The book said that around Enjolras, Grantaire felt like somebody again, and that Grantaire basically followed Enjolras around like a lost puppy.

I think that if Hugo made Grantaire actually fall in love with Enjolras, it wouldn't be because of the looks, seeing as Grantaire himself was described an ugly man, it would be because of the passion he carries and that fire that Grantaire could see inside of him, all the things that he doesn't have.

And about the whole mistress thing, I figured it would be obvious that he doesn't especially when Hugo states that the only two kisses in Enjolras' life were the ones he gave to the deceased Mabeuf, one on the forehead and one on the hand.

The 'hero worship' theory could be possible, but I think there was just a bit more to that. Their dynamic is intriguing and interesting and very easy and perfect for shipping.

Also, some say that the scenario during their death was pity or pride, but I disagree. The moment Grantaire recognizes himself to the guards and asks to die with Enjolras is heart touching. The thing is, Grantaire doesn't believe in the cause, or even care for it, and he could have just hidden and escaped afterwards but no, instead, he claims to be a revolutionary and chooses to die with Enjolras. This shows that Grantaire believed in him, he believed in Enjolras. Though he didn't understand or care for their cause, he believed that if one person could change the world, it would be Enjolras. Another thing is the fact that Grantaire actually asks Enjolras if he could die with him, showing that Grantaire believes he is not worthy of Enjolras and Enjolras is above him. Basically, Enjolras was a God and Grantaire was a Worshipper. I do believe that the fact that Grantaire thinks like this would bug Enjolras in the slightest because Enjolras doesn't want to be above anybody, he just wants to be an equal. Also, many of you were talking about the fact that they die together holding hands. If you read it carefully, it says "Enjolras took his hand with a smile". It's not the fact that they were holding hands as they died, but it was the fact that Enjolras took Grantaire's hand and smiled at him, Grantaire never offered his own. Enjolras probably realized in that moment how good of a person Grantaire is and how stupid he's been for not seeing it.

Also in general, their relationship was interesting because even Hugo himself stated that they complemented each other like complementary colors(which if you noticed in the musical and movie, Enjolras and Grantaire wear red and green, complementary colors. They were opposites and (shun me for saying this), but opposites attract. They balanced each other out and though Enjolras never realized it, Grantaire helped strengthen his arguments when they fight, just as Marius did when they debated on Napoleon. Enjolras and Grantaire were also compared to many famous homosexual relationships (the most famous being Orestes and Pylades) but also imagine Patroclus and Achilles, sounds similar to their relationship, correct?

So no, I'm not saying they were in love canonically, but it could have been a possibility. None of us knows what Victor Hugo's real intentions are, unless he rises from the dead or something, but other than that, we could only stick to the facts that we have.

I agree that we don´t know what Hugo meant. I think there is possibility that Joly/Bossuet was meant to be romantic friendship. The Greek homosexual references - after all, Enjolras and Grantaire aren´t Greeks - are full of political and revolutionary symbolism and - now don´t anybody get angry with me - forgetting that does horrible injustice to Hugo. I am not saying that you are forgetting it, Keana. But many do, and it irks me.

Anna wrote: "I never got the impression that they had any romantic feelings for each other. To me, they shared a deep, brotherly bond- sort of like David and Jonathan. The first time I ever heard of Enjolras and Grantaire being "shipped" was from teenage Les Mis fangirls who'd only seen the musical or movie.
Snores.
But seriously, yeesh, the homoromanticism between these two characters is an academic interpretation. It did not pop out of thin air from "fangirls." (Lay off the casual misogyny.)

Marina wrote: "Manning wrote: "It only adds to the idea that Grantaire has a one-sided homosexual love/desire for Enjolras. "

Yes, but the thing about not being aware of it himself?
Does it not mean that he'd be..."

Being attracted to a man who "looks like a girl" (leeeet's calm down with being gender role centric though) makes you no less queer if you're a guy, sorry. Grantaire obviously knew Enjolras was a man, anyway. I'm not really sure what your comment is going for though, honestly.

Marina wrote: ...(always bearing in mind, ofcourse, that academics, perish the thought, are people, just like everyone else, with their own sets of ideas and prejudices)."
THIS! Oh so much.