Science Fiction Aficionados discussion

hi everyone! this thread is for discussion of Lois McMaster Bujold's The Vor Game. this novel continues the adventures of Miles Naismith Vorkosigan and chronologically follows the novel The Warrior's Apprentice.

this thread is also for any discussion regarding the Hugo and Nebuala-winning short story "The Mountains of Mourning", which takes place between the events of The Warrior's Apprentice and The Vor Game. the story is included in the collection The Borders of Infinity (also available on kindle).

Finished Young Miles, which is an omnibus edition. I think of the three I liked The Warrior's Apprentice best. But I thoroughly enjoyed them all. I am glad we are doing this series read, otherwise I may have just put this series off for several more years. And I am glad to be reading it now.

This was a great read! It was good to see the Dendarri fleet again! I also was glad to get to know Gregor a little better.

I thought "The Vor Game" was where Miles and Gregor finally take over the story from the previous generation. Gregor is an interesting character and we only catch glimpses of him throughout the series. He has so much pressure put on him all his life; it's nice to see him realize he can count on Miles to make things even more interesting. As for Miles, he just never keeps still.

Yes, it was fun to see Gregor grow into his role in this book. Nicely done on Bujold's part I thought.

The whole series seems to explore the ways children of famous parents deal with their own lives. I like the Gregor and Miles approach, though I have to confess to having a soft spot for Ivan.

From Miles descriptions of Ivan, it would seem that Ivan should be a jerk, but he does seem quite likable. But we really haven't seen all that much of Ivan yet in the series. He shows up enough to whet your appetite wondering, "Where is the author going with this character?"

I liked him in "The Warrior's Apprentice". Mile's image of him is coloured by a tint of envy for his physical perfection and disdain for his lack of drive, I think.

i also have a soft spot for Ivan, even though i've only seen him in one book so far. he just seems so well-meaning and also endearingly clueless.

i wonder if he is the lead character in Captain Vorpatril's Alliance. something to look forward to!

mark wrote: "i also have a soft spot for Ivan, even though i've only seen him in one book so far. he just seems so well-meaning and also endearingly clueless..."

That is a good description!

I just catch up with you guys, and I'm going to star reading The Vor Game, couldn't find "The Mountains of Mourning", but I guess it wouldn't matter, story wise. Let you know my impressions in a couple of days, I hope.

sorry, i gave the wrong link to the eformat of Mountains of Mourning. here's the right one ($4 on kindle):

http://www.amazon.com/Mountains-Mourn...

I read the Mountains of Mourning this weekend. Highly recommend.

Bungluna wrote: "The whole series seems to explore the ways children of famous parents deal with their own lives."

Spot on with that. It makes me wonder where she will go with the series once she's finished with the current character group (if anywhere).

I will save my thoughts from Mountains of Mourning for when we read Borders of Infinity: The Mountains of Mourning / Labyrinth / The Borders of Infinity, but I do agree there is a large part of Miles and the others coming out from under their parents shadows

i just read the novella and liked it a lot. a moody and rather sad but still uplifting piece. i'm really glad that Bujold revisited this particular topic (including Miles' feelings about his grandfather).

I enjoyed the novella too and am about 1/3 through the book. Miles is such a fun character. Just way too smart for his own good - and still that strong tendency to speak before he thinks. I am liking seeing more of Gregor too.

I find Gregor very interesting as a character. He's supposed to be all-powerful in Barrayar, but really he's the ultimate prisoner. It's in this book that he starts to appreciate both his privilege and responsibilities and come into his own. He also starts to develop his own coping skills.

Just finished the book! (view spoiler)[

Really liked the Cavilo - Miles's interactions. That piece of dialogue when he's her prisioner (I'm paraphrasing) "The key to strategy isn't in choosing one road to victory, but in doing the choice in such a way that all roads lead to it"

Does Miles see himself becoming Cavilo in the future? Is there any tragedy waiting to be unfold upon him that will deviate him in such a way that all his intellectual power will be devoted to scheming, betraying and becoming a machiavellian con-man?

Those were really interesting question, that I'm hoping the next books will try to answer.
(hide spoiler)]

Bernardo - that was a great quote! And good questions too - I'm looking forward to the future books and more Miles adventures.

Bungluna wrote: "I find Gregor very interesting as a character. He's supposed to be all-powerful in Barrayar, but really he's the ultimate prisoner. ..."

Poor Gregor. I'll spoil, just in case:

(view spoiler)[That concept of Gregor as Prisoner is really integral to the characterization of Miles and Ivan (and Aral, too) because, although they love Gregor as friend and cousin, and they honor him as Emperor, they try their darndest not to be the imperial Him! A great deal of the black humor from the series is based on that, I think, and on the potential for that power to lead to real madness. (hide spoiler)]

I'm glad to finally be on board for this series read - this and the previous were the first my library carried. I have to say that I loved them both!

Suzanne wrote: "Bernardo - that was a great quote! And good questions too - I'm looking forward to the future books and more Miles adventures."

Thanks for the input! I'm pretty excited myself as well.

I got a bit of a late start this month, but I'm about half way and really enjoying this. So far this one is faster pace and more action. I am really beginning to like Miles.

I somehow managed to finish this one this weekend amidst all the gay pride celebrations here in san Francisco. my gosh, what a dedicated nerd I am.

so Megan wrote a great review about an omnibus edition of several Vorkosigan novels where she encapsulates my feeling perfectly. there is just something so pleasant, so relaxing and fun about opening up a book that you are confident is going to be enjoyable because it is clear that the author knows what they are doing. that's how i'm beginning to feel about this series. each book is such a great little mini-vacation. The Vor Game was such a book. I may not be dazzled or startled by the prose or the ideas, and the books may end up being mainly 3 star books (I take the GR rating system literally i.e. "I Liked It"), but I know I am going to be enchanted by the plot and the characters. it's such a great feeling knowing that i'll be able to visit people like Miles again and again.

one thing that I found to be a little off was the idea that what'sherface, The Mercenary Villain of the piece, is somehow supposed to be a negative mirror image of Miles, specifically in the way she thinks & plots. I guess I can see why. but yet Miles, to me at least, is not just defined by the brilliant improvisatory style of his thought process - if he was just that, it IS an obvious parallel. and I would be less taken with Miles. I think that Miles is equally defined by his compassion and the way he takes death & suffering very seriously. he takes things to heart in a very meaningful way. and that isn't at all present in Mercenary Captain.

still, she was a great character. i'm sure we'll be seeing more of her.

the last two-thirds was page-turning full-throttle excitement that I really liked. but my favorite part of the novel was actually the first third set in the arctic station. a great location and it was pretty cool seeing Miles being Miles, practically bouncing off the walls, in such a bleak and dreary setting.

forgot to mention that I agree with the comments above about Gregor. he really comes into his own with this novel and is as richly developed as Miles, Cordelia, Aral, and Bothari. very intriguing and sympathetic person. I practically cheered when he completed Miles' plan by stepping right up to the cannon and the barriers slammed shut behind him. Miles & Gregor are a great team and I love the relationship between the two of them.

Hey, thanks, mark!

And I completely agree about that moment with Gregor. It was such a fantastic sequence of events, and I love it when characters know and trust each other enough to do crazy stuff like that.

Finished The Vor Game on the plane to Venice but had no time to catch up with the discussion while in Italy! Now that I'm back, just want to weigh in on this one. First, I thought all the stories in Borders of Infinity were excellent and it is my favorite book so far. As to the Vor Game, I enjoyed it alot. I've not yet been taken by Ivan - so far he seems the not-so-bright playboy type. It was good to see Gregor coming into his own. Miles was as frantic as ever. He cannot help but be insubordinate! But I did like the introspective aspect of this book.