Q&A with Josh Lanyon discussion

I'm about halfway through this story, and it's made me realize something about myself as a reader.

Characters with chronic diseases make me squirm.

I'm not talking about permanent disabilities like blindness or deafness or quadriplegia. I'm not talking about addictions or mood disorders or OCD. Just physiological diseases, like Adrien's heart defect and Tim's epilepsy. Like AIDS.

My discomfort has no influence whatsoever on how I view a story's craftsmanship. It's purely a personal issue -- but why, I'm not sure. Life experiences, maybe? Buried fears?

Do any of you have a similar problem? I think it's imperative that characters suffering from more than heartbreak appear in fiction. (I had no problem tackling heroin addiction in Visible Friend or PTSD in Xylophone or bipolarism in Mongrel.) Then why, I wonder, do certain physical afflictions make me so uneasy?

I think it makes the characters more human, and when integrated properly into the story, as it obviously is for Adrien, Tim, Perry, and Swift, for example, it can reveal a lot about the character, how they deal with it internally and externally, it shapes them, and it provides sort of like anchor points for the story.
Personally i prefer not to read about people doing hard drugs and the ordeal of trying to get out of it. When reading CUTYS i was absolutely terrified that Swift might have a relapse. I view AIDS as different from something like heart disease or epilepsy, maybe because it carries with it such pain and fear and history, and because it is still a fatal disease.
I guess it comes down to different types of fears.

I don't mind, but don't preach to me. don't make your story a platform for an agenda.

In the beginning, I thought what time is this written, who tries to get around L.A. by transit? did I miss this was a period piece? The story developed, and Tim's epilepsy unfolded instead of bludgeoning the reader. There also was no magic cure.

There was a book I considered reading about a wheelchair-bound MC and an able-bodied man. In the reviews, spoilers revealed that the MC in a wheelchair magically walks down the aisle. And so I lost interest in buying it.

KC wrote: "I think it makes the characters more human, and when integrated properly into the story, as it obviously is for Adrien, Tim, Perry, and Swift, for example, it can reveal a lot about the character, ..."

Oh, definitely! But certain kinds of "humanness" make me cringe. As I said, this is by all means a personal issue. Maybe the older I get, the more vulnerable I feel. Don't know.

Na wrote: "I would classify Adrien's heart disorder or epilepsy as disabilities. AIDS as well. All illnesses that prevent an individual with 'normal' daily life moves or habits are disabilities, aren't they ?..."

Hm. I never thought of Adrien or Tim as having a disability. They need to be careful about taking their meds but otherwise they seem to me to be having pretty normal lives. Of course Tim still needs to adjust, but that's completely understandable, this is new to him.

I like the way the illness or disability has an effect of the character's psychology, whether it's a recent problem they are still getting used to, or a more long standing one. And I think Josh does this well.

The effects can be subtle. Like with Adrien's assumption that Mel didn't want to be stuck with looking after an invalid. But Mel never said that to him, so he might be right, or he might be projecting his own fears about his illness. And also using his illness as an excuse for why Mel decided Adrien wasn't someone he wanted to stay with. Psychological self defence to make the rejection about something other than apparently not being lovable enough to make the other person stay.

Na wrote: "Perhaps my understanding and perception of a disability is different. :) What I was thinking about is that they needed to adapt their life. I believe that from the moment your condition prevent you..."

I didn't mean to sound flippant towards that at all, i hope it didn't come across that way. Of course there is a lot of suffering, sometimes physical, sometimes psychological with "invisible disabilities", a lot of adjustment. However, at least my understanding of Adrien (or Tim, or Perry) is that they view themselves as living normally around their afflictions.

KC wrote: "Na wrote: "Perhaps my understanding and perception of a disability is different. :) What I was thinking about is that they needed to adapt their life. I believe that from the moment your condition ..."

That's an important aspect, I think. Because everyone wants to live as "normal" a life as possible.

I think Tim is angrier than a lot of my characters because he hasn't been dealing with his disability as long and because his disability was caused by someone else's carelessness.

Same with Ridge in Just Desserts.

These aren't health issues they've had a lifetime (or at least many years) to come to terms with. And there is also something about being harmed by someone else that (I think) is harder to get past than being born with a particular vulnerability.

A different mind set, I think.

Josh wrote: "KC wrote: "Na wrote: "Perhaps my understanding and perception of a disability is different. :) What I was thinking about is that they needed to adapt their life. I believe that from the moment your..."

Yes, Tim has that additional aspect to deal with, knowing that what happened was avoidable, so his anger is well justified and is probably working against him a bit. We meet him so soon after his accident though, how could he be otherwise given this life changing situation?
(Ridge, well, Ridge is different, he's a bit scary, he's lonely and embittered, but i'm still holding some hope for him)

KC wrote: "(Ridge, well, Ridge is different, he's a bit scary, he's lonely and embittered, but i'm still holding some hope for him)
..."

Ridge will be okay. Before too much longer he'll be eating out of Tug's hand -- and only occasionally nipping.

I can't type today to save my life.

Josh wrote: "I can't type today to save my life."

Hu?

Calathea wrote: "Josh wrote: "I can't type today to save my life."

Hu?"

:-D

I just mean I'm making as many errors as I am typing what I mean to say.

Oh, one of those days... ;-)

Josh wrote: "KC wrote: "(Ridge, well, Ridge is different, he's a bit scary, he's lonely and embittered, but i'm still holding some hope for him)
..."

Ridge will be okay. Before too much longer he'll be eating..."

Aha! Yes, good to know :-)

K.Z. wrote: "I'm about halfway through this story, and it's made me realize something about myself as a reader.

Characters with chronic diseases make me squirm.

I'm not talking about permanent disabilities li..."

I don't know if any kind of sickness makes me uneasy, but I would think some hit more close to home than others, are more likely to happen to me, so therefore have greater emotional impact, it talks to my own sense of vulnerability. After I had three fractures in my over-arm and shoulder app 10 years ago, I definitely feel a twinge when a character in a book break bones. And I get very irritated if the author lets him have mind blowing sex or do heroic things two days after. Give them a week at least ;) It is very painful...

And I definitely agree that it is good to have protags struggle with sickness and health like ordinary people. But the author needs to know a little about what it entails in limitations on what one can do and how to work around it. Many does of course, but I have seen examples that doesn't.

Anne wrote: "K.Z. wrote: "I'm about halfway through this story, and it's made me realize something about myself as a reader.

Characters with chronic diseases make me squirm.

I'm not talking about permanent di..."

Well, if the disability or illness isn't going to have any real impact on the character, then it's just window dressing. Like giving them a love of country music (now THERE is a disability) or freckles.

And if it's just window dressing, then it's kinda, sorta mildly offensive, in my opinion.

Josh wrote: "And if it's just window dressing, then it's kinda, sorta mildly offensive, in my opinion."

Definitely.

I've been giving this a lot of thought re. Cards On The Table, which I thoroughly enjoyed aside from the seizure scenes. Eons ago, I frequented a dance club in downtown Milwaukee. A very sweet young man occasionally asked me to hold his eyeglasses before he disappeared into the men's room. After the first time, when he was in there for more minutes than the average pee requires, I asked what was going on. He told me he was epileptic and could tell when he was going to seize.

I was only 16 or so, and my family had a poodle with epilepsy -- which freaked me out enough, although I made every effort to comfort the poor thing as I cried. But a person with a seizure disorder? Yikes! Imagining what that boy was going through in the bathroom was profoundly disturbing to me.

Just another example, I guess, of how personal experience colors each book we read.

Josh wrote: "And if it's just window dressing, then it's kinda, sorta mildly offensive, in my opinion."

Absolutely. Sometimes it is also about authors not knowing enough about what they write about. Not that you should experience broken bones yourself before writing about it, that might be a tiny bit extreme, but maybe talk to someone who has?

I love the character layers all these 'not perfect' characters have, whether it's epilepsy, heart problems, alcoholism, or being shot in the knee. The way the characters deal with these issues personally or as a partner adds so much dimension to the characters. That is why I love each of these books, and have read them over and over. They are about people and love and going the distance together and not about sex or the disability or whatever.

K.Z. wrote: "I'm about halfway through this story, and it's made me realize something about myself as a reader.

Characters with chronic diseases make me squirm.

I'm not talking about permanent disabilities li..."

I actually like this, if it is handled well. I especially like it when the disorder is mental or emotional (which epilepsy only kind of is). I have a shelf called "brain kismet" for just that.

Tim and Jack Christmas Coda 2012:

http://joshlanyon.blogspot.fi/2012/12...

Ooh, this is strange. The first ever Lanyon book I had was a paperback, Collected Novellas #2. I got it out tonight with a view to rereading Snowball in Hell sometime soon. And I realised Cards on the Table is in that book. But I bought and read the ebook of COTT last year and definitely didn't get any deja vu sense of having read it before. I can't imagine I'd forget it so entirely that I wouldn't even realise it was familiar when I read it again. Especially as I like it a lot. So why the heck did I not read it in the paperback? It's not like I was swimming in m/m books at the time, since I didn't have the Kindle yet and the paperbacks are v. expensive in the UK. How very odd.

Becky wrote: "Ooh, this is strange. The first ever Lanyon book I had was a paperback, Collected Novellas #2. I got it out tonight with a view to rereading Snowball in Hell sometime soon. And I realised Cards on ..."

Maybe you got the book to read Snowball in Hell, set the book aside after reading Snowball in Hell to save COTT as a treat for later, and then forgot later after other things intervened.

It's got Dangerous Ground in it too, which I definitely read. Maybe like you say I was intending to save Cards on the Table for later and somehow never got back to it.

Cards on the Table now in audio!

Audible.com:
http://www.audible.com/pd/Fiction/Car...

Audible.co.uk:
http://www.audible.co.uk/pd/Crime-Thr...

Johanna wrote: "Cards on the Table now in audio!

Audible.com:
http://www.audible.com/pd/Fiction/Car...

Audible.co.uk:
http:..."

This is so cool! I love the book so much and it's narrated by Sean Crisden, yay! :-) Wow, what a lovely day for audiobooks! Both this and Haunted Heart all in one day!

I'm in audio book heaven! I'm currently listening to Cards on the Table and LOVING it. I think I've read the book two or three times already, but there are so many cool details I've managed to forget. Like Tim's faded cinnamon-colored Abercrombie & Fitch T-shirt with the slogan I had a nightmare I was a brunette. :-D

I love the dynamics between Tim and Jack! And I didn't remember how witty Tim is! He rocks! :-)

Yup, wonderful story and the audio is very good! Love it :-D

It turned out well, didn't it? I think this might be my favorite narration by Sean.

Johanna wrote: "I'm in audio book heaven! I'm currently listening to Cards on the Table and LOVING it. I think I've read the book two or three times already, but there are so many cool details I've managed to forget. Like Tim's faded cinnamon-colored Abercrombie & Fitch T-shirt with the slogan I had a nightmare I was a brunette. :-D..."

Yes! I heard that yesterday in the car and laughed out loud. I'm loving this audiobook too!

Josh wrote: "It turned out well, didn't it? I think this might be my favorite narration by Sean."

I have to agree. And oh gods, the way Sean 'reads' those sex scenes... so SWEET. I didn't remember how tender and sweet and caring those moments were in this story! Heart-melting, really. This was one of my very first Josh Lanyon books and I have such a soft spot for these two men.

Thank you once again, Josh.

I had a joyful moment today under my apple trees while raking and listening to Cards on the Table because I rediscovered one of my favorite Josh quotes. This is Tim asking Jack about his sign of the zodiac:

"What's your sign?" I asked, curious.
His smile was wry. "Yield? I don't know. What's yours?"
"Stay alert. Expect new traffic patterns."

I love it! So funny and meaningful at the same time.

Johanna wrote: "I had a joyful moment today under my apple trees while raking and listening to Cards on the Table because I rediscovered one of my favorite Josh quotes. This is Tim asking Jack about his sign of th..."

:-D

Johanna wrote: "I had a joyful moment today under my apple trees while raking and listening to Cards on the Table because I rediscovered one of my favorite Josh quotes. ..."

I haven't reached that part yet, but it's wonderful! Thank you for the quote, and I'll think of you when I hear it.

I'd like another story with these guys, pretty please :-)

Idamus wrote: "I'd like another story with these guys, pretty please :-)"

You read their Christmas Coda already?

http://joshlanyon.blogspot.fi/2012/12...

HJ wrote: "Johanna wrote: "I had a joyful moment today under my apple trees while raking and listening to Cards on the Table because I rediscovered one of my favorite Josh quotes. ..."

I haven't reached that..."

:-)

Johanna wrote: "Idamus wrote: "I'd like another story with these guys, pretty please :-)"

You read their Christmas Coda already?

http://joshlanyon.blogspot.fi/2012/12..."

I have :-)
I still want mooooore

Buying this today to listen to on my way to San Antonio for my grandson's baptism. Lucky me. :-)

Johanna wrote: "I had a joyful moment today under my apple trees while raking and listening to Cards on the Table because I rediscovered one of my favorite Josh quotes. This is Tim asking Jack about his sign of th..."

One of my favorites too. Thanks for the coda reminder.

I just re-read it. Isn't that a wonderful two sentence description of Sam and Rhys? And "Yes, Virginia..." Smiling again. : )

That's one of those mostly forgotten stories. I did like the characters a lot. And I enjoyed writing a conflict that wasn't the same old thing.

Barbra wrote: "Josh wrote: "That's one of those mostly forgotten stories. I did like the characters a lot. And I enjoyed writing a conflict that wasn't the same old thing."

Cards on The Table was the first Josh ..."

It is so good, that it would be a shame, if you don't get it!!

Oh it is such a sweet story. I loved it. And loved catching up with them in the Coda

Felice wrote: "Oh it is such a sweet story. I loved it. And loved catching up with them in the Coda"

Thank you for reminding me of the coda! I enjoyed it all over again.

I can't wait to get to this audio. This was one of my favorites. I may need to listen to it next. I'm currently listening to Don't Look Back.

I don't usually have a problem with characters who have chronic diseases. I don't think. It might depend on what it is. There are some that are more "gross" I think, that I might not want to read about. I don't know.I guess if I read one, I'll let you know!

This story is one of my favorites mostly because I can identify with some of what Tim is going through, though my seizures were brought on by a nasty dairy allergy I didn't realize I'd had for a good portion of my life (and I do LOVE anything dairy). My therapist once commented that I wasn't reacting to the news that I had a seizure disorder the way she thought I would because I was so cool and calm about it. But for me, there wasn't much I could do about it, I had no one to blame or anything, so why bother getting into a tizzy over it? (This is why I would make a terrible character, btw.)I just had to figure out how I got the disorder and then how to get rid of it. Which I promptly did.

If it had been caused by another person or a specific event or whatever, that might have been a different story for me.

And gosh, K.Z., that kid's lucky he had time to get to the bathroom! I never had time for anything. Two seconds after I felt the signs I'd be down for the count. But only twice, was I in a room with other people when it happened.

I could also be cool and calm about mine simply because they didn't happen often (at most four times in one year, and always at 9am for some odd reason). I know my life would be very different if I got them as often as Tim! At the very least, I'd be more frustrated, if not angry on top of that. So, don't blame him at all for his feelings.

Talking about this, now I really can't wait to listen to the audio!

Omg, it’s been three years. Sad thoughts. I think the narrator had just done a bunch of poorly written books and he’s not my favorite narrator, so I had to wait awhile to really enjoy this one. I didn’t mean for it to take three years!

Anyway, I’m in the middle of it now, and loving it. I’d forgotten just how much I loved it. It’s such an enjoyable read. :-)

Jordan wrote: "Omg, it’s been three years. Sad thoughts. I think the narrator had just done a bunch of poorly written books and he’s not my favorite narrator, so I had to wait awhile to really enjoy this one. I d..."

Ah. I actually think this one is my favorite narration by Sean. I loved his Jack voice in particular.