Chaos Reading discussion

2014 Group Read #3: SCARY, NO SCARY by Zachary Schomburg
By popular demand, we are doing a poetry group read next up, to be moderated by the lovely and knoledgeable Whitney. Of his work, Schomberg apparently says, “Mostly I want my poems to generate their own energy through confusion. I want my poems to confuse the reader. Not a confusion in a cognitive or narrative sense, but in an emotional sense.” So..... good luck with that. :)

GROUP READ DETAILS
*Reading starts: As soon as you're able. Let us know if you get finished really early & want to start discussing, or if you're not going to get done in time. I've allowed a bit longer than we should need, mostly to allow people to find a copy.
*Discussion Starts: 17 May 2014
*On the day, I'll add a note to the title of this thread to let people know the discussion's started. In the meantime, people can stop by this thread to chat, and read/post bonus material about the book - but please flag or hide any spoilers until discussion opens.

FACTS & TRIVIA
*Length: 80 pages
*First published: 2009
*Author: Zachary Schomberg (US)
*This is Schomberg's second book of poems.
*Interview with the author,including how this book was written: "How A Poem Happens": http://howapoemhappens.blogspot.com.a...

Available from the publisher (Black Ocean for $14.95--free shipping in the U.S.; looks like $12 shipping for anything outside the U.S.--that seems steep to me--is it?).

Whoo hoo!

Also: why can't I keep my mouth shut?

Marc wrote: "Available from the publisher (Black Ocean for $14.95--free shipping in the U.S.; looks like $12 shipping for anything outside the U.S.--that seems steep to me--is it?)."

Yep, it's always steep buying from an overseas publisher. Book Depository have it cheaper, ($19 + free shipping), but they're out of stock.

I love that I misspelled "knowledgeable" in the first post. Think I'm going to leave it like that though.

Ruby wrote: "I love that I misspelled "knowledgeable" in the first post. Think I'm going to leave it like that though."

At first I thought it was intentional.

Whitney wrote: "Ruby wrote: "I love that I misspelled "knowledgeable" in the first post. Think I'm going to leave it like that though."

At first I thought it was intentional."

I wish I was that funny.

I also wish I could find a copy of this book that was reasonably priced. It looks like the only option for me would be via the publisher. Not keen to pay that much for a book though. I may end up sitting this one out entirely :(

I didn't actually know we were going to do this particular read... I thought we were talking about doing a to-be-determined poetry selection, but I wanted to read this so it seemed just as well. Now I'm fixated on how to get a cheaper copy to those outside the U.S.

Maybe Caracal-eyes will come through the way she did with War & War.

Marc wrote: "I didn't actually know we were going to do this particular read... I thought we were talking about doing a to-be-determined poetry selection, but I wanted to read this so it seemed just as well. No..."

Sorry - I just thought since I'd been slack with setting up the next poll, this might be a good shortcut. I've checked all my usual book sites and it just isn't in stock, plus there's no Kindle version.

I'm not all that disappointed though - while I'd love to read this at some point, things have been a bit hectic at this end with the re-opening/renovation of my Etsy shop. Unfortunately, when I'm logged in to Etsy, it boots me out of GR (my Facebook account sign-ins are pretty messed up).

Is anyone else wanting to do this read and struggling to find a copy, or is it just me?

Ruby wrote: "Sorry - I just thought since I'd been slack with setting up the next poll, this might be a good shortcut. ."

No big deal. I'm looking forward to reading it (my copy arrived over the weekend) and I always like supporting a small publisher putting out interesting work. Plus, I never buy poetry even though I enjoy it.

Marc wrote: "Ruby wrote: "Sorry - I just thought since I'd been slack with setting up the next poll, this might be a good shortcut. ."

No big deal. I'm looking forward to reading it (my copy arrived over the ..."

What Marc said.

So how is everyone going with this? Did people manage to get copies okay?

I got a copy. I was thinking of trying to scan it so I could send it out to those not in the US. it's not that many pages. Or maybe we should pick something more available for our first group poetry read?

Don't worry about it on my account. It's probably a good thing to have someone else lead a group discussion for a change and keep things fresh. And I wouldn't mind skipping just the one book. :)

Well, not JUST your account. I suspect Marc and I are the only ones with the book. It's a pretty cool book, mind, but maybe something to hopefully get more people involved? Not that it wouldn't be a fascinating discussion, but It'd be nice if I could hide my ignorance of poetry among a larger number of comments.

Here is the first poem from the book, let's talk about that!

SCARY, NO SCARY

One night, when
you return to your childhood
home after

a lifetime away,
you'll find it
abandoned. Its

paint will be
completely weathered.

It will have
a significant westward lean.

There will be
a hole in its roof
that bats fly
out of.

The old man
hunched over
at the front door
will be prepared
to give you a tour,
but first he'll ask
Scary, or no scary?

You should say
No scary.

That's pretty awesome. Did you want to discuss now, or when the discussion opens?

Ha! very cool poem :-) I see he has a book called Fjords Vol.1 as well! Don't think I'll have time to participate on this one but will certainly spy in on your insightful discussions! ;)

DIscuss now! It's a warm-up.

Okay - what do we think the old man represents?

I like this one just for the imagery on the surface of it. Digging deeper, since you made me, would it be too obvious to say the old man was in a sense the future 'you' of the poem? I interpreted it as saying something about which kind of memories from our past we choose to dwell on. The 'scary' tour maybe showing some of the horrific things that have been repressed or that happened when the subject was too young to process them.

I had the same reaction as Whitney--that the old man might be the future you as you give yourself a tour of the past. The past is an abandoned property and our memories may merely be a rundown, uncared for semblance of how they once were or they may be a veritable haunted house. Or perhaps the old man is a manifestation of memory giving you the option of choosing which past (the good or the bad) you wish to visit.

Schomburg uses a free verse form, which gives this poem (as well as the rest) a very approachable narrative style. The effect to me is a readable narrative whose form in terms of pauses, breaks, and gaps, mirrors the off-kilter world he presents.

Is returning to one's "childhood home" simply a return to the past? What different readings did you make of finding it "abandoned"?

Out of curiosity, other than Whitney, how many others have read the whole book? If not many (or any), would others be interested in continued postings of content (I'm happy to scan or type up some selections)? No pressure.

Marc wrote: "Out of curiosity, other than Whitney, how many others have read the whole book? If not many (or any), would others be interested in continued postings of content (I'm happy to scan or type up some selections)? No pressure. ..."

I'm up for it if others are.

I've just opened the discussion thread in the header too..

Pgs. 7 to 9...

NEW KIND OF NIGHT

There is a new kind of night.
It is never-ending

and nothing can be seen
like when we are in a cave
and I make
inappropriate gestures
toward my sex-parts
while you tell me
you can hear my heart beating,
and about your fear
of being crushed into a tiny cube
from walls moving slowly in.

I can pretend
I am stabbing myself
repeatedly in the chest or
pulling my intestine out
through my navel
and using it
to mummify myself or
pulling my intestine out
through my navel
and tying it
like a lasso to toss
around your torso.

I am a tree
you can't see.
------------------------------

NEW KIND OF TREE

There is a new kind
of tree.

It bleeds.

It grows one meter per minute.

One boy played
too long
in this new kind of tree.
He is too high in the tree
to get down.
His family is busy
blowing kisses.

They look like
tiny insects.

How do you tell someone
their family is
tiny insects?

How do you tell someone
their boy is
a hummingbird?
------------------------------

NEW KIND OF LIGHT

I move my hands
in these woods
to find her sex-parts.

We discover our sex-parts
make heat
and blue light.

We become outlines of ourselves--

long scratches
in the sky.

We have a daughter
who was never born.

She lives in the house
we never built,

but in this new light,
you can almost see
its tattered roof.

Wow. I don't even know where to start with all this! I do love the imagery, but I feel like I could be here all day picking it apart.

I did find the NEW KIND OF TREE one a little confusing, so maybe somebody can explain it to me? I don't know what the tree represents. I get that there's something there about distance between the son and his family. The fact that they're "too busy blowing kisses" could refer to that sort of forced affection and going through the motions. I'm confused that the writer sets himself apart from both the boy and the family. Perhaps this is him "being the witness" to his past?

Here is a link to the next poem in the book in video / poem form, Your Limbs Will Be Torn Off in a Farm Accident , which continues with tree / hummingbird motif.

And here is a very personal response someone wrote after seeing it. It has its own poetry:
http://therumpus.net/2012/04/the-last...

I am doing what I do when I like something but don't feel like I really 'get' it, which is searching out other's opinions :-)

FALLING LIFE



You are in a very high tree.

If you jump
you will live a full life
while falling.

You will get married
to a hummingbird

and raise beautiful part-
hummingbirds.

You will die of cancer
in mid-air.

I will not lie.
It will be painful.

You are a brave little boy
or girl.

Ruby, once a week I start a reply to your question about the new tree poem and then I delete it in frustration. A lot of these poems sort of hint at multiple interpretations but don't fit too neatly into any one explanation especially the closer you look at them. It's almost like as soon as you start to get a grip on reality or nature it morphs on you (albeit, in a delightfully macabre way thanks to this writer).

Given how this selection kicked off, I was expecting much more of a narrative holding all these poems together. Did you expect this too, Whitney? Felt more like a thread or the use of a theme or image from a previous poem as the starting off point for the next poem and so on...

Marc wrote: "Ruby, once a week I start a reply to your question about the new tree poem and then I delete it in frustration. A lot of these poems sort of hint at multiple interpretations but don't fit too neatl..."

LOL - It's good that you tried to reply though! maybe you could start an "Interpretation of the Week" post? :)

Ruby wrote: "maybe you could start an "Interpretation of the Week" post? :) "

Oh, I can picture how that would go... Something like...
Week 1: I think the hummingbirds represent how fleeting it is to try and fight the cat vomit on my floor...
Week 2: The estranged way Schomburg treats Mother Nature reminds me of how I feel about my co-workers...
Week 3: I put my hands inside somebody else's chest once... It didn't go well...

I'm having similar problems. This is why I'm useless at poetry, my usual response is along the lines of 'it's got a god beat and you can dance to it'. I keep meaning to sit down and reread Scary in one sitting and hope that a larger connection between the poems becomes more obvious.

I do like the Interpretation of the Week. I hadn't seen the hummingbird / cat vomit connection before, but in retrospect it is completely obvious.

Wait, you fight the cat vomit on the floor? I hadn't though of trying that. Interesting..

Usually, I just end up stepping barefooted on the cat vomit, but its frequency has decreased lately allowing me more time to enjoy poetry.

Whitney, I think I was expecting more of a story based on the Chaos thread where this book was first mentioned. Certain themes do prevail... death/violence, the body, memory/sensation, mother nature... Others you noticed?

Marc wrote: "Usually, I just end up stepping barefooted on the cat vomit, but its frequency has decreased lately allowing me more time to enjoy poetry..."

If you get a dog, there is usually a dramatic reduction in the amount of cat vomit. It's like magic.

I will reread Scary, no Scary and pick out themes. I think that's a good way to approach it.

Oh, hey, that's probably why the frequency decreased (we adopted an older boxer over the last year that we recently had to put down). Our stalwart Shih Tzu does not clean the floors the way a good dog should...

Hey, do people remember this discussion? I recently pulled this book off my shelf, with about 20 pages left to read. Finished it! It officially took me 2 years and 10 months to read an 80 page book of poetry!

I was wondering if you were actually still reading that! Congrats on finishing. I really enjoyed this book.

I'm a slow reader, don't judge!

Like, a REALLY slow reader.

Poetry should not be rushed. It's just that I sometimes treat reading like a junkie and I'm on to the next fix before I'm even done with the current one.

True that.

And I don't think anyone can accuse me of rushing a book that took me an average of 12.5 days per page to read!