Goodreads Ireland discussion

I'd agree with the women characters. Very 2 dimensional and of the time all right . Interestingly Clarisse is a more prominent role in the movie version of the book ( and also older)

Interesting. I might see if I can get a copy of the intro.

Cool . I'll keep an eye out.

I agree the women are very vapid. They reminded of the women early on in the movie Pleasantville. Mildred really bugged me. She is completely checked out. I really liked Clarisse and while I know her disappearance is necessary, I missed her as the narrative progressed. I don't know what I think of the Captain. I sometimes thought he was sympathetic towards Guy and then he went and burned Guy's house. I wonder why Guy assumed he wanted to die?? Was the captain becoming tired of being an agent of destruction? I don't know

He is quite the enigma. He seems to enjoy taunting Guy by quoting all these books at him. But if he was so disdainful of books why would he have bothered to read and remember them? And was his goading of Montag outside his house an act of suicide?

It's entirely possible. I did find it strange when Montag had his Eureka moment of " Beatty wanted to die"

I read this book 50 years and enjoyed it.

I finished this morning and I really liked the first half of the novel but the second ,for me lost steam. It didn't ring true and felt rushed.
I couldn't believe Montag would start reading poetry to those women . Why would he do that ,there was so much at stake.It was also very odd that the War bombed the city as soon as Montag left.
I'll have to think more about it .

I'm not crazy about this one. The whole premise is off. Many dystopian books have a "this could happen" feel to them. This one doesn't. For example, I don't think anyone would ever approve of surgery done by a doctor who never read a medical book.Why are there schools? Even advanced math calls for books. No one really needs to know how to read. If we burn every book in existence what do schools do? If the kids aren't reading then what they're going to is aYMCA/YWCA, not school. Montag just hauled off and killed those people. That made no sense to me. Also, I know its sacrilegious in goodreads to say that I would never be burned alive for books. I just didn't like the book. It was a good choice for a group read. It's a classic. I've heard the title a million times and never knew what it was about. I'm glad I now know!

@ Colleen I agree that the first half of the book definitely had more appeal and momentum than the second half where things turn darker.

I liked the first half of the book it had a feel of it could happen and a few quotes that hit home for me . The second half it so much . It bothered me how fast montag fell apart . Why did he involve his wife ? I never got the feel that she cared about anything expect her family in the walls . The women in general were ridiculous. I got the feeling that the woman that burned herself with her books was because she had nothing else . It was a very isolated world . The main objective of the country seemed to be to keep the people happy and divided . Books promote thoughts and give a variety of ending with some being sad by eliminating the books you have happy people who in reality are just mindless sheep with a high level of depression
In the edition I had Bradbury said that it came to him the chief was so well read because when he was young he loved books but then they let him down and now he collects them but doesn't read them ....
I don't get where montage thinks the chief wanted to die

Sherry, like you I had heard about this book a hundred times and wanted to read it to see what all the hype was about. I found some of the themes and ideas in it thought provoking. Why do we value books? What would society be like without them? I think some of things that bugged you are the things Bradbury was trying to highlight. I think by going to the extreme he is pointing out the futility of just sitting in a classroom being fed information rather than thinking for yourself. The same point is being made about TV. The subject matter is inane and yet people are entertained by it. I think Bradbury feared the dumbing down of society by over exposure to TV and other technology. And I think what worried him most was this was the choice of people themselves, it was not something that was initially imposed on them

We have been dumbed down by TV and technology. That's a very important point, Trelawn. I'm glad our schools still teach cursive for now. I suppose some kids "don't no Y." Texting shortcuts are a great way to dumb "ppl" down!

Ha ha very true

There is a dumbing down all over the place. No doubt about it. But these aspects of our fast paced lifestyle will be left behind soon enough as of necessity. Being "dumb" nowadays is a tough one for survival, so of necessity we are forced to keep apace of things. When cars became popular it was feared that people wouldn't walk at all.
As for the book, yeah, the language is not my kind of thing, which is probably the reason that I did not read it until now. However, censorship is a dangerous thing in any society, be it auto-censorship or State-sponsored censorship.

This was my first reading of this classic and I thought for it's time, it was thought provoking but not one of my personal favourites.

I am actually surprised by how many of us hadn't read it before. Love it or not, from now on when someone mentions it we can nod sagely and say that we have also read that classic :-)

Thats true Trelawn. For me it's a nod without a recommendation.
Thomas, you're right about censorship. It's dangerous.

Hello, my 1st post on Goodreads.

This book has been on my to-read list for years so this was a good reason to finally cross it off.

I think it's very much of its time, back in the 50's I can only imagine how unbelievable it was to imagine a society like the one Bradbury creates. A lot of what he envisages has actually came to pass, he certainly foresaw the onset of 24 hour news!

I found the Captain very interesting in that he was far better read than Montag but still dismissed him as a snob. That was a pretty good representation of a general cynicism to intellectualism even from intellectuals.

I must say the portrayal of women didn't occur to me, would maybe have to read it again. All in all, it deserves to be read by as many people as possible but it didn't affect me in the way a 1984 or Brave New World did.

Brave New World is much more alarming Richard. I didn't like this book much. I never read 1984 but from things I've heard about it, that's our life now. BNW predicted a lot of how we live now as well.

Sherry I reread 1984 last year and it is more terrifying but I really think everyone should read it . I have never read A Brave New World but one of my friends told me to read Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand

Hi Colleen. Yes, I should read 1984. Atlas Shrugged is a new title for me. I'll look it up.

I have been avoiding this book as I didn't think I would like it. Turns out I loved it.

I have a paper copy of the 2008 edition that has the intro from the 2003 edition that Emma has spoken about above. In the intro Bradbury describes how he wrote the story initially on a rented typewriter (10c per half hour) in the basement of a library over the course of a week and a half.

"What a wonderful experience it was to be in the Library basement to dash up and down the stairs reinvigorating myself with he touch and smell of books that I knew and books I did not know until that moment"

Probably because I read this introduction I had an overwhelming sense urgency and excitement over the physicality of books throughout the story.

I think that books well written teach us in the least painful way, storytelling I mean. We learn beyond our limitations and probably storytelling down the millennia was how we developed and evolved as a species.
In a controlled society books/storytelling would be seen as a threat by the ruling order. Who wants a hero who does not conform if you are trying hard to get people to do just that? Stories usually involve a journey with danger in it. What autocrat would want people to like a hero who faces danger on his/her journey towards something better?

I am slightly ambivalent about this book. I agree that it is well written and carries a very powerful message about the dumbing down of society and the dependence on technology to entertain but some parts of the story left me puzzled. What was the deal with the 'War' do you think? I don't really see how its inclusion really helped the story in any way. Perhaps someone has a view on this that might help me understand. I also agree with others here that the portrayal of women was a bit ridiculous. I also found the epiphany about the captain was a bit unbelievable.

I thought the war was simply to demonstrate how people had become completely lulled into a shallow empty life by too much TV and too little questioning of their lives. The only person who seems to notice it is Montag but that is because he is the only one asking questions and wondering - well except for Clarisse, Faber etc.

The radio's announce it, jets fly over head and everyone carries on as normal and watch their parlour walls. Normal society would react differently.

'Every hour so many damn things in the sky! How in hell did those bombers get up there every single second of our lives! Why doesn't someone want to talk about it?'

Maria wrote: "I thought the war was simply to demonstrate how people had become completely lulled into a shallow empty life by too much TV and too little questioning of their lives. The only person who seems to ..."

That makes sense, Maria. I hadn't thought about that, I was thinking about the bombs destroying the city. But it is mentioned a fair bit throughout the book so that would be an explanation for it. Thanks!

There are definitely parts of the book that still don't sit well with me too. The war is one. I get what Maria is saying but it just jarred with me a little. And I still can't reconcile Montag's belief that the Captain wanted to die. It is a strange little book. It made me think and I am certainly glad I read it. There are sparks of genius to it but I can't honestly say I loved it.

I don't know why Montag tried to justify murder either. That's exactly what he did. It's a dangerous thing to think you know what another person thinks needs or wants. We can only guess. He wanted the captain dead and he wanted a clear conscience about it.

Trelawn wrote: "There are definitely parts of the book that still don't sit well with me too. The war is one. I get what Maria is saying but it just jarred with me a little. And I still can't reconcile Montag's be..."

Strangely, I felt that when Montag speculates that the Captain wanted to die - that Bradbury himself was also surprised by the revelation.

But that may just be because I had read his introduction and I knew Bradbury while writing the story, had not yet worked out why the Captain knew so much about books (more than Bradbury himself) and yet hated them enough to be a fireman.

So I was reading it with half a mind that Bradbury didn't understand this character yet and what would be the problems with that.

However, I have to admit that the suicide attempt of Montag's wife being treated as common as muck at the beginning of the story establishes suicide as pretty common in the world of the novel.

That's true that suicide is treated as being an almost mundane event but I still feel if that was the Captain's aim, there are easier ways to do it. He had no way of knowing what Montag would do. I think Montag shocked himself with how easily he destroyed Beatty and was trying to justify it to himself. I know the captain goaded him but I think claiming that he wanted to die is going too far.

I agree that Montag in general was a bit OTT. The reading of the Poetry to the friends of his wives was a bit bizarre. I felt that was a bit of a device to move the plot along.

By the way has anyone seen the Christian Bale Movie Equilibrium -Christian Bale plays an enforcement officer in a future in which both feelings and artistic expression are outlawed and citizens take daily injections of drugs to suppress their emotions. Sean Bean plays his partner and all hell breaks loose when Sean Bean's Character reads Yeats' Cloths of Heaven to Bale.

The film has got to have drawn upon this book for it's inspiration?

Maria, that sounds like a good film to watch. I will try to get hold of it at the weekend to watch. Thanks.

Not a fan of Christian Bale but I did enjoy the film. Definitely some parallels to this book there.

Yes, I enjoyed it Bookworm. I think I caught on TV year ago and then bought the DVD as I was enchanted with the story and quite like both Bale and Sean Bean.

Have just finished the first section and gotten to really like it. True it is a bit depressing and that is offputting all right. but the story moves quickly and this holds the reader, me anyway.
"Must be something in books, things we can't imagine" to quote Montag. There is a magic in a good book that holds the reader and this book has it though the subject is a depressing one and the narrative language is a bit early 20th century.
Beatty's chat with Montag in which he explains the necessity for burning books reminds me of the Inquisitor in the "Brothers Karamazov". It is a plea against freedom. Freedom involves risk and probable hurt, thinking for oneself is dangerous and better left to those in authority, books offer "figments of imagination, you come away lost" to quote Montag. When you are lost you start to look and to question, and to take an unknown road towards a new discovery.

I have mixed feelings about dysopian books. They're usually well written but some of them feel all too real. Sometimes this world we live in feels dystopian. Theres a pleasant thought. LOL

The Scottish Herald TV section listed Trumps inauguration as the first part in a 4 year dystopic series so not far off the truth ;-)

He gives me a very cold and dystopic feeling.

Sherry Trump ? Yes . Kara had a nightmare the other night that trump was purging Democratics and they were on our street. This is not normal .

Colleen, his cabinet picks are all nazis and biggots and misogynists. His first thing willl be tearing health care away from people who need it. He claims that he will replace it. Common sense would be to tweek it.

I know it's so sickening I can't believe it's really going to happen tomorrow .

Avoiding reading this thread but my first coherent thought on this book occurred around chapter 4 in response to the firemans says " for the first I realised that a man was behind each one of these books". I know it's linguistics plus the product of the times etc but it underlines the fact that the knowledge and stories that are captured in book through history have come from men. It only women had been encouraged to be writers, philosophers, how much more advanced might we now be? How many deVinci s or Einstein's have we lost because they didn't have the right chromosomes? Let alone how many died in infancy.

Amen to that Margo!

Maybe someday Emma.

I always think those people who say women would do a great job ruling the world must know very different women to the ones I do.
The thoughts of my mother setting the rules and ruling a country could be as terrifying as Trump.

I would never dare say that. Not to a woman anyway ;-)

50% through - speechless :-x

My workspace is quite interesting. I work in a section in an Engineering company and opposite to the general STEM workspace my section is all female aside from me, I'm outnumbered 14 to 1.
For my wedding they are organising a hens for me .

Paul wrote: "My workspace is quite interesting. I work in a section in an Engineering company and opposite to the general STEM workspace my section is all female aside from me, I'm outnumbered 14 to 1.
For my ..."

As a feminist you should be chuffed :-p

Emma I'm flying through it. The start was pure Bradbury. Disjointed, scatty,maybe a bit of sustanse use involved, over written but with some beautiful phrases, but then - oh hell yes! The strenght of the ideas, the beauty of the vision. I finally get Bradbury! I have to stop and digest now. Pick it up again tomorrow :-D