The Old Curiosity Club discussion

Chapter 32 opens with Pip receiving a note from Estella saying she is coming the day after tomorrow by the midday coach and that Miss Havisham told her Pip would meet her at the station. Pip tells us on the day she was to arrive he was waiting the arrival of the coach well before it had left his town, he knew he was being unreasonable but couldn't help himself. While waiting Wemmick is walking by and sees him and stops. He tells Pip that the aged is soon going to be 82 years old and he would like to fire the cannon 82 times if the neighbors don't mind. He is on his way to Newgate to see one of their clients they didn't seem to be able to help, and asks Pip to come with him. Having hours before Estella actually arrives, Pip agrees to go along. He describes Newgate - or Dickens does, it sounds more like Dickens than Pip, this way:

"At that time jails were much neglected, and the period of exaggerated reaction consequent on all public wrongdoing—and which is always its heaviest and longest punishment—was still far off. So, felons were not lodged and fed better than soldiers (to say nothing of paupers), and seldom set fire to their prisons with the excusable object of improving the flavor of their soup. It was visiting time when Wemmick took me in, and a potman was going his rounds with beer; and the prisoners, behind bars in yards, were buying beer, and talking to friends; and a frowzy, ugly, disorderly, depressing scene it was."

Wemmick seems to be quite popular amoung the prisoners, but what happened when he tells Pip to pay attention to the prisoner he shakes hands with surprised me:

“Colonel, to you!” said Wemmick; “how are you, Colonel?”

“All right, Mr. Wemmick.”

“Everything was done that could be done, but the evidence was too strong for us, Colonel.”

“Yes, it was too strong, sir,—but I don’t care.”

“No, no,” said Wemmick, coolly, “you don’t care.” Then, turning to me, “Served His Majesty this man. Was a soldier in the line and bought his discharge.”

I said, “Indeed?” and the man’s eyes looked at me, and then looked over my head, and then looked all round me, and then he drew his hand across his lips and laughed.

“I think I shall be out of this on Monday, sir,” he said to Wemmick.

“Perhaps,” returned my friend, “but there’s no knowing.”

“I am glad to have the chance of bidding you good-bye, Mr. Wemmick,” said the man, stretching out his hand between two bars.

“Thankye,” said Wemmick, shaking hands with him. “Same to you, Colonel.”

“If what I had upon me when taken had been real, Mr. Wemmick,” said the man, unwilling to let his hand go, “I should have asked the favor of your wearing another ring—in acknowledgment of your attentions.”

“I’ll accept the will for the deed,” said Wemmick. “By the by; you were quite a pigeon-fancier.” The man looked up at the sky. “I am told you had a remarkable breed of tumblers. Could you commission any friend of yours to bring me a pair, if you’ve no further use for ‘em?”

“It shall be done, sir.”

“All right,” said Wemmick, “they shall be taken care of. Good afternoon, Colonel. Good-bye!” They shook hands again, and as we walked away Wemmick said to me, “A Coiner, a very good workman. The Recorder’s report is made to-day, and he is sure to be executed on Monday. Still you see, as far as it goes, a pair of pigeons are portable property all the same.”

Executed? When he said he will be out of this on Monday, I thought he was going to be released not executed, they must have taken forgery- at least that's what I think his crime is - rather serious. On their way out the turnkey asks Wemmick what Mr. Jaggers is going to do for that "water-side murder" is he "to make it manslaughter, or what’s he going to make of it?”" I thought what does it matter around here it is pretty easy to get executed. Now that they are out of Newgate they seperate and Pip goes back to wait for the coach. Once there he is sorry he had gone to the prison for now Newgate was on his breath and his clothes. While he is worrying about being contaminated by the prison Estella arrives. The chapter ends with:

"What was the nameless shadow which again in that one instant had passed?"

In Chapter 33 Estella has arrived and tells Pip that she is going to Richmond, which is ten miles from London. She is to go in a carriage and he is to take her.

"This is my purse, and you are to pay my charges out of it. O, you must take the purse! We have no choice, you and I, but to obey our instructions. We are not free to follow our own devices, you and I.”

Pip somehow finds encouragement in these words, I'm not sure why. They wait in a private sitting room and Estella tells Pip of why she is going:

“Where are you going to, at Richmond?” I asked Estella.

“I am going to live,” said she, “at a great expense, with a lady there, who has the power—or says she has—of taking me about, and introducing me, and showing people to me and showing me to people.”

“I suppose you will be glad of variety and admiration?”

“Yes, I suppose so.”

Pip tells us Estella's "manner was more winning than she had cared to let it be to me before, and I thought I saw Miss Havisham’s influence in the change." Estella asks how Pip is doing at Mr. Pocket’s:

"How do you thrive with Mr. Pocket?”

“I live quite pleasantly there; at least—” It appeared to me that I was losing a chance.

“At least?” repeated Estella.

“As pleasantly as I could anywhere, away from you.”

“You silly boy,” said Estella, quite composedly, “how can you talk such nonsense? Your friend Mr. Matthew, I believe, is superior to the rest of his family?”

“Very superior indeed. He is nobody’s enemy—”

“Don’t add but his own,” interposed Estella, “for I hate that class of man. But he really is disinterested, and above small jealousy and spite, I have heard?”

“I am sure I have every reason to say so.”

“You have not every reason to say so of the rest of his people,” said Estella, nodding at me with an expression of face that was at once grave and rallying, “for they beset Miss Havisham with reports and insinuations to your disadvantage. They watch you, misrepresent you, write letters about you (anonymous sometimes), and you are the torment and the occupation of their lives. You can scarcely realize to yourself the hatred those people feel for you.”

Estella is amused by the things they say because they always fail and they are the ones tortured by it.

“It is not easy for even you.” said Estella, “to know what satisfaction it gives me to see those people thwarted, or what an enjoyable sense of the ridiculous I have when they are made ridiculous. For you were not brought up in that strange house from a mere baby. I was. You had not your little wits sharpened by their intriguing against you, suppressed and defenceless, under the mask of sympathy and pity and what not that is soft and soothing. I had. You did not gradually open your round childish eyes wider and wider to the discovery of that impostor of a woman who calculates her stores of peace of mind for when she wakes up in the night. I did.”

My questions is why, why do they hate Pip so? I don't understand their motive, do they think it is Pip who one day inherit Miss Havisham's estate? And why would she, wouldn't she leave it all to Estella?

Later, when they have arrived at the house where Estella will be living Pip describes it this way:

....."a staid old house, where hoops and powder and patches, embroidered coats, rolled stockings, ruffles and swords, had had their court days many a time. Some ancient trees before the house were still cut into fashions as formal and unnatural as the hoops and wigs and stiff skirts; but their own allotted places in the great procession of the dead were not far off, and they would soon drop into them and go the silent way of the rest.

A bell with an old voice—which I dare say in its time had often said to the house, Here is the green farthingale, Here is the diamond-hilted sword, Here are the shoes with red heels and the blue solitaire—sounded gravely in the moonlight, and two cherry-colored maids came fluttering out to receive Estella. The doorway soon absorbed her boxes, and she gave me her hand and a smile, and said good night, and was absorbed likewise. And still I stood looking at the house, thinking how happy I should be if I lived there with her, and knowing that I never was happy with her, but always miserable.

We end the chapter with Pip arriving back at the Pocket's leaving Estella with a bad heart-ache and arriving at the Pocket's with a worse heart-ache. This chapter ends with this surprising event:

"Mr. Pocket was out lecturing; for, he was a most delightful lecturer on domestic economy, and his treatises on the management of children and servants were considered the very best text-books on those themes. But Mrs. Pocket was at home, and was in a little difficulty, on account of the baby’s having been accommodated with a needle-case to keep him quiet during the unaccountable absence (with a relative in the Foot Guards) of Millers. And more needles were missing than it could be regarded as quite wholesome for a patient of such tender years either to apply externally or to take as a tonic.

Mr. Pocket being justly celebrated for giving most excellent practical advice, and for having a clear and sound perception of things and a highly judicious mind, I had some notion in my heart-ache of begging him to accept my confidence. But happening to look up at Mrs. Pocket as she sat reading her book of dignities after prescribing Bed as a sovereign remedy for baby, I thought—Well—No, I wouldn’t."

Kim wrote: "My question is why, why do they hate Pip so? I don't understand their motive, do they think it is Pip who one day inherit Miss Havisham's estate?"

I believe they think that he's already benefitting from Miss Havisham's generosity -- he's already got a new wardrobe, a place in town, an allowance, and "gentleman lessons" - not bad for someone whose expectations have not even been met yet.

"Mr. Pocket was out lecturing; ... his treatises on the management of children and servants were considered the very best text-books on those themes."

What a riot! I wonder what Dr. Spock's babies were like. :-)

Kim wrote: "He describes Newgate - or Dickens does, it sounds more like Dickens than Pip"

I thought the same thing as I read it.

Kim wrote: "Mr. Pocket was out lecturing; for, he was a most delightful lecturer on domestic economy, and his treatises on the management of children and servants were considered the very best text-books on those themes. ."

To which I would say, physician heal thyself.

But I'm not surprised. The woman who was the counselor that the elementary school used most when my wife was teaching there, who was supposed to help the troubled children, had herself two of the most undisciplined, hostile, unstable children in the school. They didn't have any medical issues, they had just been horribly parented.

Interesting chapters, and not only because there was a mention of birds ...

What a great description of Newgate - "Wemmick's greenhouse." The two chapters we are discussing both hinge on the presence of Newgate and the wearing of clothes. In Chapter 32 we have Wemmick and Pip in Newgate and watch as Wemmick tends to the flowers of crime that he and Jaggers act as gardeners for. Death seems to be taken lightly by the Colonel who Wemmick and Pip visit in Newgate. Then, at the end of Chapter 32, Dickens brings the reader's focus to Pip's clothes. Pip attempts " to beat the prison dust of [his] feet" and to shake it "out of my dress." Pip tells us he feels "contaminated " and does not feel free "from the soiling consciousness of Mr Wemmick's conservatory." This emphasis on clothes will be carried on in the next chapter.

The end of Chapter 32, however, presents a puzzling final sentence. Pip wonders "[what] was the nameless shadow which again in that instant had passed. It is important to note that Pip makes this comment immediately after he sees Estella. And, if we look very carefully at how Dickens frames these final words, we note that they are made after Pip sees Estella's face "at the coach window and her hand waving."

Chapter 33 continues to evolve both the prison and clothing motifs of the previous chapter.

First, the chapter begins with a description of Estella's clothes, thus linking the clothing motif to the end of the previous chapter which focussed on Pip's clothes. The difference is that while Pip's clothes are tainted with the air and dust of Newgate prison, Estella's clothes are "furred" and reflect Estella's "manner" and "winning" style and presence.

Later in the chapter Pip and Estella travelling in a post-coach pass by Newgate prison and Estella demands of Pip "What place is that!" Estella's destainful dismissal is obvious as she declares "[w]retches!" On the one hand, it could be that their route to Richmond did pass Newgate. On the other hand, however, one has to question why Dickens would overlap two motifs in two consecutive chapters. Clothes and prisons. How do they fit into our story? And what are we to make of this "nameless shadow" that appears to be stalking Pip's subconscious mind? Psychologically, one's conscious reacts to stimulus that may be unacknowledged. If so, what triggered Pip's "nameless shadow?

The trigger was Estella. We know that Pip believes Miss Havisham is his benefactoress. Pip believes that he is meant for Estella. In Chapter 33 Estella tells Pip "we are not free to follow our own devices." What then are the unknown and unseen devices that are in operation?

Peter,

I have been asking myself what this fleeting memory of Pip's concerning Estella's face might be based on. It's now the second time that Pip has made that reference, the first time being a couple of chapters before - when Pip sees Estella for the first time after her being sent away to make a lady of her. Maybe, it is a sign that he sees something of his own person reflected in her? After all, their relative positions are not dissimilar: Estella has been adopted and brought up to be a fine lady (with ulterior motives) by Miss Havisham. We also learn during that talk between her and Pip that her early days in Satis House were anything but happy as she was regarded as an intruder by the scheming relatives. Pip, in the same way, has been sort of "adopted" by his unknown benefactor/benefactress and he is to be brought up as a gentleman, i.e. an idler. Both depend on their benefactor for everything they have got, and whereas in Estella's case it might have been a blessing - her prospects as an orphan girl not being too alluring -, in Pip's case I am sure that it was not so. After all, he was on the brink of learning a useful and respected trade that would later have granted him a living and independence in life, whereas now, he does not learn anything useful and is weaned from any pretence to self-reliance.

I was also struck by this passage from Pip and Estella's dialogue:

"She answered so carelessly, that I said, 'You speak of yourself as if you were some one else.'

'Where did you learn how I speak of others? Come, come,' said Estella, smiling delightfully, 'you must not expect me to go to school to you; I must talk in my own way. [...]'"

Does this not somehow link with Pip's impression that there is somebody else reflected in Estella? At the same time, it is a clever psychological touch suggesting Estella's estrangement from her own self, the consequence of how she was brought up by Miss Havisham in order to slake the old woman's thirst for revenge. As a result, Estella is not really within herself because the old woman's hatred, arrogance and maybe even - just remember her statement about self-destructive love as the only form of genuine love - masochism have been thrust upon her. That's why Estella warns Pip against herself in one of her better moments, and that's why there is always a kind of contradiction within Estella that makes her indifferent towards herself.

Tristram wrote: "I was also struck by this passage from Pip and Estella's dialogue:

"She answered so carelessly, that I said, 'You speak of yourself as if you were some one else.'

'Where did you learn how I speak..."

Tristram

The more I re-read GE the more brilliant it becomes. Estella, Pip, and all the mysteries continue to tumble about and, as readers, we know that Dickens has an entire warren of rabbits up his sleeve. One by one, we will see how everything connects.

For now, I think your comment "Pip's impression that there is somebody else reflected in Estella" must be a compass for us on our reading journey.

For now, our path is marked by clothes - and don't forget boots - residences, Estella, Joe and other characters, and perhaps most especially, Pip's Great Expectations.

Oh my but I love this novel! And a few more ... !!!

"If I say yes, may I kiss the cheek again?"

John McLenan

1861

Text Illustrated:

“Two things I can tell you,” said Estella. “First, notwithstanding the proverb that constant dropping will wear away a stone, you may set your mind at rest that these people never will—never would, in hundred years—impair your ground with Miss Havisham, in any particular, great or small. Second, I am beholden to you as the cause of their being so busy and so mean in vain, and there is my hand upon it.”

As she gave it to me playfully,—for her darker mood had been but Momentary,—I held it and put it to my lips. “You ridiculous boy,” said Estella, “will you never take warning? Or do you kiss my hand in the same spirit in which I once let you kiss my cheek?”

“What spirit was that?” said I.

“I must think a moment. A spirit of contempt for the fawners and plotters.”

“If I say yes, may I kiss the cheek again?”

“You should have asked before you touched the hand. But, yes, if you like.”

I leaned down, and her calm face was like a statue’s. “Now,” said Estella, gliding away the instant I touched her cheek, “you are to take care that I have some tea, and you are to take me to Richmond.”

Commentary:
McLenan makes the setting of the intimate scene fairly obvious by including the horse-racing prints on the walls of the parlour at the coaching inn where Estella and Pip await their change of coaches. McLenan regards the propriety of the situation, and envisages such a scene as being likely only in a private space, whereas other illustrators have set the scene outside, in the inn yard, to establish the travel context. In this respect, McLenan reveals that he has read this week's instalment correctly, for Estella is attired in "furred travelling-dress," and the interview does indeed occur in a private room at the inn, but one that is evidently used for public dinners: "with a dinner-table for thirty."

"Oh, you must take the purse!"

Chapter 33

F. A. Fraser

c. 1877

An illustration for the Household Edition of Dickens's Great Expectations

Text Illustrated:

"“I am going to Richmond,” she told me. “Our lesson is, that there are two Richmonds, one in Surrey and one in Yorkshire, and that mine is the Surrey Richmond. The distance is ten miles. I am to have a carriage, and you are to take me. This is my purse, and you are to pay my charges out of it. O, you must take the purse! We have no choice, you and I, but to obey our instructions. We are not free to follow our own devices, you and I.”

As she looked at me in giving me the purse, I hoped there was an inner meaning in her words. She said them slightingly, but not with displeasure.

“A carriage will have to be sent for, Estella. Will you rest here a little?”

“Yes, I am to rest here a little, and I am to drink some tea, and you are to take care of me the while.”

Commentary:

Because of the simple coincidence that Jaggers has acted for Miss Havisham and Magwitch, Pip has assumed that his "great expectations" emanate from the demented heiress rather than the convict on the marches. This scene at the inn yard is crucial in furthering Pip's delusion when Estella seems to hint that they are both Miss Havisham's creatures: "We have no choice, you and I, but to obey our instructions. We are not free to follow our own devices, you and I” (Chapter XXXIII, 122). The artist shows Pip as deferential and Estella clearly in charge as waiters, porters, carriage drivers, and baggage-handlers support the workaday inn-yard setting so removed from pip's romantic dreams.

Through illustrating this significant piece of dialogue Fraser marks an important shift in Estella's development. No longer will she simply be Miss Havisham's assistant at Satis House; henceforth, she will be raised as a member of upper-class society at a finishing school in Richmond-on-Thames.

Pip and Estella in London

Chapter 33

Charles Green

c. 1877

Dickens's Great Expectations, Gadshill Edition

"'I am going to Richmond' she told me'"

Chapter 33

H. M. Brock

Text Illustrated:

"In her furred travelling-dress, Estella seemed more delicately beautiful than she had ever seemed yet, even in my eyes. Her manner was more winning than she had cared to let it be to me before, and I thought I saw Miss Havisham’s influence in the change.

We stood in the Inn Yard while she pointed out her luggage to me, and when it was all collected I remembered—having forgotten everything but herself in the meanwhile—that I knew nothing of her destination.

“I am going to Richmond,” she told me. “Our lesson is, that there are two Richmonds, one in Surrey and one in Yorkshire, and that mine is the Surrey Richmond. The distance is ten miles. I am to have a carriage, and you are to take me. This is my purse, and you are to pay my charges out of it. O, you must take the purse! We have no choice, you and I, but to obey our instructions. We are not free to follow our own devices, you and I.”

As she looked at me in giving me the purse, I hoped there was an inner meaning in her words. She said them slightingly, but not with displeasure.

“A carriage will have to be sent for, Estella. Will you rest here a little?”

“Yes, I am to rest here a little, and I am to drink some tea, and you are to take care of me the while.”

Four illustrations of Pip's encounter with Estella! I quite like Brock's drawing because we share Pip's perspective on Estella, whose mien and posture are graceful but also a bit languid. Fraser's illustration strikes me as clever not so much because of the two main figures - just notice how much like a milksop he makes Pip look - but because of the servile and busy people around those two. One porter is busy carrying luggage, and there is a waiter waiting behind Pip, with a rather skeptical face, I think. Nevertheless, the Pip and Estella never pay heed to what goes on around them.

The two other illustrations are less convincing to me. Green's picture is very static (and again, a bit like an old photo), and I cannot help thinking that McLenan's scene of the stolen kiss imbues a lot of shadows and claustrophobia, and the faces of Pip and especially Estella look like those of conspirators. I felt reminded, a bit, of the illustration in A Tale of Two Cities where Miss Pross and Mr. Lorry burn the doctor's shoemaking equipment.

Tristram wrote: "Four illustrations of Pip's encounter with Estella! I quite like Brock's drawing because we share Pip's perspective on Estella, whose mien and posture are graceful but also a bit languid. Fraser's ..."

I enjoyed reading your comments on the various illustrations. They all are remarkably different from Phiz. Generally, I complain about an illustration not being a Phiz but I confess to being intrigued with the more modern approach we find in these.

Kim. You deserve a medal for finding these illustrations.

The Green illustration is much more a picture. You are right. Almost a photograph wash.

I have read that readers' interest in illustrated novels was decreasing in the latter part of the 19C as was Dickens's own reliance on his illustrators. It will always be speculation of course, but I wonder what Boz would have to say about the new look of illustration.

Peter wrote: "I have read that readers' interest in illustrated novels was decreasing in the latter part of the 19C as was Dickens's own reliance on his illustrators. It will always be speculation of course, but I wonder what Boz would have to say about the new look of illustration."

I do wonder why people no longer wanted illustrations to go with their novels. Nevertheless, it's difficult to picture - if you pardon the pun - illustrations for Trollope novels or for writers such as Joseph Conrad, Dostoyevsky, George Eliot and the like - whereas writers like Dickens, Collins, Thackeray are almost congenial to illustrations. I wonder why this is the case. Maybe it has something to do with a writer's tendency to satire?

Tristram wrote: "
I do wonder why people no longer wanted illustrations to go with their novels. ."

The Folio Society produces exquisite editions of many works, almost all illustrated.

Thanks, Everyman. I just had a look at their website and wonder how I could have overlooked them up to now.

"Her calm face was like a statue's"

Chapter 33

A. A. Dixon

1905

Text Illustrated:

"It was no laughing matter with Estella now, nor was she summoning these remembrances from any shallow place. I would not have been the cause of that look of hers for all my expectations in a heap.

"Two things I can tell you," said Estella. "First, notwithstanding the proverb that constant dropping will wear away a stone, you may set your mind at rest that these people never will — never would, in hundred years — impair your ground with Miss Havisham, in any particular, great or small. Second, I am beholden to you as the cause of their being so busy and so mean in vain, and there is my hand upon it."

As she gave it to me playfully — for her darker mood had been but momentary — I held it and put it to my lips. "You ridiculous boy," said Estella, "will you never take warning? Or do you kiss my hand in the same spirit in which I once let you kiss my cheek?"

"What spirit was that?" said I.

"I must think a moment. A spirit of contempt for the fawners and plotters."

"If I say yes, may I kiss the cheek again?"

"You should have asked before you touched the hand. But, yes, if you like."

I leaned down, and her calm face was like a statue's. "Now," said Estella, gliding away the instant I touched her cheek, "you are to take care that I have some tea, and you are to take me to Richmond."

Commentary:

"The scene once again is an inn, but the backdrop only serves to underscore the social distance that Pip has travelled since we last encountered him at the Three Jolly Bargemen, where Jaggers first broke the news of his having received . . . Great Expectations in chapter eighteen, towards "the end of the first stage of Pip's expectations" (chapter 19).

Among the illustrated folio sheets of Harper's Weekly in serialization fopr 13 April 1861, and subsequently in various illustrated editions, including the Chapman and Hall 1862, 1864, and 1868 volumes with wood-engravings by Marcus Stone, readers of the novel during the nineteenth century would have encountered images of the grown-up Pip and Estella which underscore Pip's hopeless devotion and Estella's aloofness. Eytinge captures the severe, determined look in Estella's countenance admirably in his 1867 wood-engraving Miss Havisham and Estella, but not her elegance or demureness. The novel's other early American illustrator, John McLenan, gives one the sense of Pip and Estella equally being "fashion plates" in We walked round the garden twice or thrice more 30 March 1861, — and of Estella's being a petite beauty with drak ringlets (although her hooped skirt is more consistent with the fashions of the 1860s than of the 1820s). Her beauty and something of her reluctance to yield to Pip McLenan conveys adroitly in the same scene as Dixon's, "If I say yes, may I kiss the cheek again?" (13 April 1861). Like Dixon, McLenan clearly depicts Estella's smart "furred travelling dress" and even offers details of furnishing (particularly pictures involving horsemanship, suggestive perhaps of her ability to manage members of the masculine gender so effectively) to reinforce the setting of a coaching inn. But, whereas Mclenan's room merely situates two attractively dressed young people, Dixon's composition uses the details of the setting as a frame for a dual character study of unhappiness contrasting the outward signs of affluence.

Like the book's first illustrator, John McLenan, A. A. Dixon seems to have understood the anguish of Pip, so well graphed by his contemporary, Harry Furniss, in the frontispiece of the 1910 Charles Dickens Library Edition, Pip fancies he sees Estella's Face in the Fire. Never entirely comfortable in the high society to which his Expectations have miraculously translated him, Pip is always something of an outsider in illustrations such as "Why should I look at him?" returned Estella; a pretty twenty-year-old with a certain undermining hardness in her face, she is always immaculately dressed in the height of Regency fashion, whereas Pip (as in Fraser's frontispiece for 1876 Household Edition seems stilted and awkward. What Dixon adds with almost photographic precision is the flat affect and deadened gaze of Estella, and the deep unhappiness of Pip. Everything about Dixon's Estella, from her fur muff to her elegant millinery and flounced silk skirt is gorgeous, but within this elegant frame is the emotionally-scarred face of an extremely depressed young woman.

Not all illustrators of the nineteenth century editions have chosen to depict this pivotal moment: Marcus Stone in his 1864 Library Edition wood-engraving A Rubber at Miss Havisham's, for example, does not depict Pip as a melancholy, thwarted lover or Estella as a belle dame sans merci, but rather as gamesters, trying to determine what is in the other's hand. Perhaps the illustrations that come closest to the moods of the figures in Dixon's illustration are those in Charles Green's Pip and Estella in London and H. M. Brock's inn-yard portrait of the couple, in which Pip is turned away from the reader so that one must surmise from the text what he is feeling in "I am going to Richmond," she told me. Dixon's treatment of his subject is, however, far more psychological as he attempts to convey through their postures and expressions what these adopted members of the upper-class feel about the positions in which their guardians have placed them."

I am deeply impressed with how Dixon managed to put that suppressed, depressive anguish into Estella's face, and yet make her look immaculately beautiful. She looks like someone who feels that there is something lacking in her life, something she could have had but can never now achieve. - As to Pip, he seems very insecure and yet eager to please and make the best of this situation.

Tristram wrote: "I am deeply impressed with how Dixon managed to put that suppressed, depressive anguish into Estella's face, and yet make her look immaculately beautiful. She looks like someone who feels that ther..."

Now that I came across Dixon there are a few more illustrations which I will put in their threads, but there is also this title-page. I can't figure out who the man in the illustration is. Any ideas?

Maybe it is just a general symbol of a reader?

I really liked the above analysis/commentary. Lots to think about and consider.

Kim. I would agree with Haaze regarding the illustration. I can't think of an appropriate parallel in the novel. Pip's London residence would be a possibility but the man depicted is much older than our London Pip. Whoever it is I wonder if he would sell me the bookcase-desk situated behind him. I've always wanted one like that.

I like the small piles of books on the floor! It makes the illustration very endearing. But, yes, Peter, that bookcase/desk is indeed attractive!

My first thought was that it's Wemmick's father, but even though he and Wemmick are my favorite characters, I can't imagine anyone choosing to put Aged Parent on the cover.

Tristram wrote: "I am deeply impressed with how Dixon managed to put that suppressed, depressive anguish into Estella's face, and yet make her look immaculately beautiful. ."

But why is Pip wearing an overcoat indoors?

They're both wearing outdoor dress, Estella too! Perhaps the between maid had been sent away for finding herself in a delicate condition, owing to the publican's unwelcome attentions, so as a consequence no fire had been lit?

(I seem to be inventing a whole new backstory here ...)

Maybe, they have just arrived at the inn, and have not had time as yet to settle down. When I am inside a public building, I also often keep my coat on.

Kim wrote: "Tristram wrote: "I am deeply impressed with how Dixon managed to put that suppressed, depressive anguish into Estella's face, and yet make her look immaculately beautiful. She looks like someone wh..."

It could also be Pip the Elder, as a narrator - but then he would probably be at a writing desk.

Kim wrote: "Chapter 32 opens with Pip receiving a note from Estella saying she is coming the day after tomorrow by the midday coach and that Miss Havisham told her Pip would meet her at the station. Pip tells ..."

Wemmick seems to be quite popular amoung the prisoners, but what happened when he tells Pip to pay attention to the prisoner he shakes hands with surprised me:
There's a real altruistic quality to Wemmick which is also seen when he's tending to the Aged; he's a nurturing force for the convicts, by giving them encouragement. I enjoyed reading about Pip's observation of Wemmick making his rounds in Newgate and likening it to gardening.

It struck me that Wemmick walked among the prisoners, much as a gardener might walk among his plants. This was first put into my head by his seeing a shoot that had come up in the night, and saying, "What, Captain Tom? Are you there? Ah, indeed!" and also, "Is that Black Bill behind the cistern?...

Thus, we walked through Wemmick's greenhouse, until he turned to me and said, "Notice the man I shall shake hands with." I should have done so, without the preparation, as he had shaken hands with no one yet.

He tends to the prisoners in the same delicate manner a gardener takes taking care of his/her plants.

Kim wrote: "In Chapter 33 Estella has arrived and tells Pip that she is going to Richmond, which is ten miles from London. She is to go in a carriage and he is to take her.

"This is my purse, and you are to ..."

My questions is why, why do they hate Pip so? I don't understand their motive, do they think it is Pip who one day inherit Miss Havisham's estate? And why would she, wouldn't she leave it all to Estella?
I believe they are threatened by him as they were also intimidated by Estella. The following passage was rather telling of this...

"It is not easy for even you." said Estella, "to know what satisfaction it gives me to see those people thwarted, or what an enjoyable sense of the ridiculous I have when they are made ridiculous. For you were not brought up in that strange house from a mere baby. - I was. You had not your little wits sharpened by their intriguing against you, suppressed and defenceless, under the mask of sympathy and pity and what not that is soft and soothing. - I had. You did not gradually open your round childish eyes wider and wider to the discovery of that impostor of a woman who calculates her stores of peace of mind for when she wakes up in the night. - I did.

It was no laughing matter with Estella now, nor was she summoning these remembrances from any shallow place. I would not have been the cause of that look of hers, for all my expectations in a heap.

"Two things I can tell you," said Estella. First, notwithstanding the proverb that constant dropping will wear away a stone, you may set your mind at rest that these people never will - never would, in hundred years - impair your ground with Miss Havisham, in any particular, great or small. Second, I am beholden to you as the cause of their being so busy and so mean in vain, and there is my hand upon it."

Ami,

Your last quotation seems to show that Estella is capable of having heartfelt emotions, after all. Unluckily, these emotions are spite and schadenfreude.

Tristram wrote: "Ami,

Your last quotation seems to show that Estella is capable of having heartfelt emotions, after all. Unluckily, these emotions are spite and schadenfreude."

I believe she is capable of it...It's unfortunate, she's been so hardened by her environment.

I rarely think of her of having any emotions except coldness, if that can be an emotion. But that quote does seem to show that she is capable of more. Or she would be away from Miss H.

The only point is that emotions like those expressed by Estella here don't really make a person endearing, a young one even less so.

On second thoughts, however, you cannot really blame Estella only - because this spirit of vengefulness and spite, isn't it what Miss Havisham imbued her with, in regard to the male sex? After all, Estella grew up to be some kind of time bomb with the help of which Miss Havisham wanted to slake her thirst for revenge. Little wonder then that the only vivid emotions Estella seems capable of are connected with spite.