The Sword and Laser discussion

Sorry if this has been discussed before. The only books I've read that combine Sci-fi and Fantasy are Star Wars Novels, I tried looking up books but I usually get Fantasy books with some science thrown in. I want to read a book that combines magic with hard Sci-fi elements like Aliens, Spaceships, etc. There are a lot of comic books that do that but I can't think of any novels.

The Warlock in Spite of Himself by Christopher Stasheff begins a fun series, though you will find it a bit dated now. He has another series that mixes magic and science also - Her Majesty's Wizard starts that one.

Piers Anthony also has one major series that mixes the two, though I always hesitate to suggest him because he has some issues - one being a major fixation on women's body parts - so keep that in mind. Split Infinity starts the series.

And of course, recent club pick All the Birds in the Sky by Charlie Jane Anders is very popular right now and nominated for a Hugo.

The Solar Cycle by Gene Wolfe. The first book/omnibus, The Book of the New Sun, is more fantasy (sci-fantasy), and it delves into sci-fi land later in the series.

Hyperion (Dan Simmons) and Perdido Street Station (China Mieville)

Mass Effect has a nice mix of Fantasy and sci-fi, clearly derived from Star Wars.

Another series in a similar vein is the Mageworlds books by James D. Macdonald and Debra Doyle. The first one is The Price of the Stars.

I find that most steampunk falls under the "science fantasy" label, as does the majority of superhero novels. For the latter, try Ex-Heroes and Prepare to Die!

The Man of Gold by M.A.R. Barker is set on a world that "reads" like fantasy, but has underlying SF explanations for much of it, plus plenty of very weird alien races &c.

There were also the Weis & Hickman Starshield novels (The Mantle of Kendis-Dai & Nightsword), although they kind of end right in the middle of things -- didn't sell well enough to continue the series, apparently.

And Michael Swanwick's The Iron Dragon's Daughter might be worth a gander.

The Dying Earth by Jack Vance is considered by many to be the granddaddy of the Science-Fantasy lot, and it also contributed to the "Vancian" magic system used in Dungeons & Dragons.

Thank you for all the recommendations, I haven't read any of these but I can't wait to start

Anne McCaffrey's Pern series.

I just read a self-pubbed book Salvage Trouble that was set in space with space ships and space stations and such - but magic provided some of the "tech" of the universe - gravity on ships, the ability to travel deeper into that universe's version of hyperspace or subspace or whatever.

The magic was controlled by wizards - dark cloak wearing, glowing staff wielding, spell chanting wizards.

It was kinda cool.

I guess most people think of it as just sci-fi, but Dune has a lot of fantasy elements in it.

I'm quite a fan of the Freedom's Landing by Anne McCaffrey. The whole Catteni series actually. The later books become more Sci-fi where the first book or two is more survival focussed.

The Fifth Season. Combines geology and magic!

The Saga of the Exiles by Julian May which begins with The Many-Coloured Land.

A group of people who just can't fit into a future utopia are allowed to travel through a one-way time portal into the pre-human past to live a frontier life (so they think). What they imediately discover is a castle and a lot of beautiful tall people with powers that look very much like magic and many things that seem spookly similar to a lot of mythology...

Without spoiling everything, I can't explain just why this is just so excellent, but it has survived so many rereadings that my original copies are now so delicate that they have been moved to "holy relic" status.

William wrote: "The Saga of the Exiles by Julian May which begins with The Many-Coloured Land."
Agreed - though it does rather support my position that SF and Fantasy are not two genres that can be combined, they are a spectrum with F at one end, SF at the other - and a gradation in between, albeit with not that many examples near the middle!
The Many-Coloured Land is dressed up as SF, with cerebral enhancement (scientific) of mind powers (basically magic!). That, for me, puts it near (slightly over to the SF end) the middle of that spectrum.
Whatever - that argument is not really worth having. What matters is that it is a pretty good, and definitely epic series - 8 volumes, over a shelf-foot, covering four 'Pliocene', one 'Linking' and three 'Galactic Milleu' books. My review here

Erik wrote: "I guess most people think of it as just sci-fi, but Dune has a lot of fantasy elements in it."

I think Dune has Fantasy tropes (sword fighting) but not elements like Magic, supernatural monsters, etc. I don't personally count it because you can see those tropes in non-fiction or historical fiction books. Don't get me wrong though I love Dune.

While I also consider Dune Sci-FI, I think the argument can be made about several elements that they go well past the whole "science so advanced it looks like magic" thing. I'm not convinced that genetics and soft science could do all that in any reasonable amount of time.

Christos wrote: "I think Dune has Fantasy tropes (sword fighting) but not elements like Magic, supernatural monsters, etc. I don't personally count it because you can see those tropes in non-fiction or historical fiction books. Don't get me wrong though I love Dune."

I would argue that there is magic. The book tries to sell it as advanced science and training, but...
(view spoiler)[The Bene Gesserit can control their bodies down to the cellular level, and can have access to the memories of their ancestors through the use of melange spice. Spice can also be used to gain precognition and other superhuman abilities. (hide spoiler)]

Erik wrote: "The book tries to sell it as advanced science and training, but... ..."
Response in spoilers - because you used spoiler tag above.
(view spoiler)[
The Bene Gesserit can control their bodies down to the cellular level . . . I had a friend who was seriously into stage magic. I have felt him stop his own wrist pulse (I won't say stop his heart!) - I suspect some sort of induced muscle cramp in/near the artery in the armpit, but I could never find out!

can have access to the memories of their ancestors . . . gain precognition . . . superhuman abilities
Those things were being looked at by serious scientists at the time the book was written. They have fallen out of fashion since, but several such things were on the verge of being taken seriously.
Should changes in scientific knowledge and/or fashions and fields of interest affect our opinions in evaluating such books? No opinion - but it is a point that should be considered. (hide spoiler)]

Alan wrote: "Erik wrote: "The book tries to sell it as advanced science and training, but... ..."
Response in spoilers - because you used spoiler tag above.
The Bene Gesserit can control their bodies down to th..."

racketball in the armpit is the most common method

Fresno Bob wrote: "racketball in the armpit is the most common method ..."
Nothing so obvious - I looked, as well as I could, discreetly - but he was seriously into stage magic, no reason he couldn't have been wearing something purpose-built. And owning such specialist equipment was very much his lifestlye (though I am not so sure he could have afforded it at the time . . .)

https://www.goodreads.com/series/6447...

My go to recommend is The Eyre Affair. It takes place in an alternate universe; the main character's father is a time agent, who may or may not exist; and various life-forms have been cloned. Then the main character has the ability to enter the book world and interact with characters there.

Misti wrote: "My go to recommend is The Eyre Affair."

That's my go to recommendation too. I encourage everyone to read Jasper Fforde's books.

I'm listening to the audio for the The Rise and Fall of D.O.D.O. and I think it fits in the sci-fi/fantasy mash-up category. I'm about 8 hours away from the conclusion, but so far I've enjoyed the story of the quantum physicist who makes a time machine used to travel to an era when magic is real. The story is pretty long...can't say with certainty if it could have been edited down a bit since I'm not finished...but I think people in this group are used to tomes and will forgive the authors for being so wordy.

Combining sci-fi and fantasy? *snorts* Madness!

Mark wrote: "Combining sci-fi and fantasy? *snorts* Madness!"

How do you snort Madness? Do you grind up the cassettes or what?

Trike wrote: "Mark wrote: "Combining sci-fi and fantasy? *snorts* Madness!"

How do you snort Madness? Do you grind up the cassettes or what?"

Cassettes? That brings me back to the 80s... oh, what fun we had! But, did it really turn out bad? But at the time it seemed so bad, trying different ways to make a difference to the days.

Reading a mix of Fantasy and SF worked for me ;-)

Trike wrote: "How do you snort Madness? Do you grind up the cassettes or what?"

Yes, but the recipe is very specific. You have to do it in our house. In the middle of our street....

and