UB Libraries Book Group discussion

Hi all,

You might be interested in this interview with Neil Gaiman from To the Best of Our Knowledge: http://www.ttbook.org/book/ocean-end-...

Thanks Stacy, that was definitely worth a listen.
To start off our discussion, I pulled from the Reading Group Guide that Ellen posted earlier in the month.
I thought they had some discussion questions that would make for an interesting conversation.
Two really grabbed my interest, but feel free to wander. :-)
The first one is:
It would be easy to think of the Hempstocks as the "triple goddess" (the Maiden, the Mother and the Crone) of popular mythology. In what ways do they conform to those roles? In what ways are they different?
The second one is:
One of Ursula Monkton's main attributes is that she always tries to give people what they want. Why is this not always a good thing? What does Ursula want? How does Ursula use people's desires against them to get what she wants?

In answer to question number 1, I had to look up the reference of the "Triple Goddess". It made for interesting reading. One of the aspects it mentioned was the ruling of each goddess of one of the realms of earth, underworld, and the heavens.
I definitely get that reference when in the book, one of the women mentions that Lettie, the daughter, takes care of that.
I found the book fascinating. My only complaint is that it leaves you wanting more. Any good entertainer knows that rule, as a participant it is frustrating in a good way.
On the second question, I definitely found it novel how the author twists helping into such dark avenues.
What does everyone think about these questions?
Becky

Those are good questions. I didn't know about the triple goddess, so thanks for doing the research, Becky! I think the thing that struck me about Lettie and her mother and grandmother was that they each had different skills (or whatever you'd call them -- powers?). And they would automatically know which of them could handle what. Of course, I guess that would become second nature after living for thousands of years :-)

I guess that what we want isn't always what we need or what is good for us or for those around us. And Ursula didn't seem to discriminate, she just delivered what sprang into a person's mind. I thought she was very scary and felt so bad for the boy, since the adults in his life were under her spell.

Ellen,
That's an interesting point about the adults in his life. The author brings up in the interview on the Goodreads guide and again on the audio excerpt that Stacy found, that as a child he didn't want the adults to know what was happening, that "they" would be too scared. :-)

I read this book a few months ago, so the details aren't crystal clear in my mind. It was my first-ever Neil Gaiman book, and I ADORED it.

My first Neil Gaiman book too...and I loved, loved, loved it. I have two more of his books on my nightstand now.

I didn't know about the triple goddess reference - it's interesting, and definitely fits. I'd like to learn more about that. Being a lit major (back in the stone age), I think I automatically jump to the Christian allegory interpretation. The number 3, the good/evil aspects, the water...yadda yadda.

I found Ursula extremely scary. I really liked Gaiman's descriptions of the "storm" when Lettie first goes deeper into the woods. I read this a few months back too, so I might not have all my facts right.

Lori

This book club read a couple other Neil Gaiman books I think. Please correct me if I'm wrong. (1) Neverwhere and (2) Good Omens, co-authored with Terry Pratchett. I remember liking Neverwhere a lot, but not so much Good Omens.

This is probably the Gaiman I liked best of the 3 I've read. It really grabbed me and I read it super quickly. There is something about the way Gaiman mixes in the fantastical with regular life and it all weaves together naturally.

I recently read Stardust and loved it as well. It had a female character with the last name of "Hempstock" as well, and I was hoping there would be a connection with this book, but there really wasn't.

I've read a few Neil Gaiman books and marvel at how he has such a way with creating a creepy atmosphere, but one that enchants and enthralls -- love it! I think you hit on it, Ellen, with your comment on how he weaves the fantastic with the reality; the scene where the father holds the son under the water was terrifying, especially watching/reading it happen to such a young child (regardless of the assumption the father was under control of some otherworldly thing)! Horrifying to imagine how that would tilt all of a child's expectations of the world and destroy the idea of family and security. So awful and felt so real.

I think the consequences of Ursula's fulfillment of peoples' desires was the chaos of a world out of balance on some level. A random quote popped up in a friend's facebook feed today that reminded me of the Ursula question and Ellen's response. The quote is from a Cormac McCarthy story and is “I got what I needed instead of what I wanted and that's just about the best kind of luck you can have.”

I also echo Becky on how Gaiman leaves behind some unexplained mysteries in his stories. It is frustrating in a good way and let's your imagination keep pondering the story a bit.

I loved his voice in the interview that Stacy found. If he narrated the book, I have to say it would be even better.Even the women's voices he did were great.

An interesting, sort of related quote on the topic of desires, from The Goldfinch (which I just finished):

"We can't choose what we want and what we don't want and that's the hard lonely truth. Sometimes we want what we want even if we know it's going to kill us."