Catholic Thought discussion

We're nearly done with the current read, Vision of Fatima, and what a wonderful read that turned out to be. It's time we started nominating for our next read. Let's take a week or two to gather up some nominations. One nomination per person, but before you actually nominate you can "test the waters" with some suggestions for reaction. I kind of enjoy that interplay. :)

For the new members and those that haven't followed recently, our unofficial rule is that we alternate between a regularly priced book and a discounted price book. This helps make it more affordable. We are in the discounted price book turn. I don't recall if we set a price limit to the discounted price book, but let's go with $5 limit, but if someone recalls please correct me. Usually there are a whole bunch of ebooks on Amazon that are two dollars or less, if not even free.

We can use this thread to collect nominations and "test the waters."

Loretta wrote: "Well, it looks like I'll be sitting out on suggestions/nominations this time around and most probably the up coming read because I don't read ebooks. I only read real books.

Hope you all suggest/n..."

Loretta, you don't have to get the ebooks format. You're not limited to how you buy the book. We just need an option available for those on a budget. Perhaps I should have made that clear.

Loretta wrote: "Manny wrote: "Loretta wrote: "Well, it looks like I'll be sitting out on suggestions/nominations this time around and most probably the up coming read because I don't read ebooks. I only read real ..."

LOL, I don't know. Actually I recently did a search of "Catholic books" on Amazon Kindle and came up with stuff. I bet any Catholic classic book will have a kindle format.

Let me test the waters with this one I've been contemplating for a while. It's not even a Catholic book per se. It's Mark Twain's Personal Recollections of Joan Of Arc. It's actually a novel but supposed to be historically accurate. Twain actually considered it to be his best work. You can read about it on Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona...

But this is probably not something that will interest many here. It is free in ebook at Kindle.

Reading over the reviews at Amazon, a good number of people loved the book.

Loretta wrote: "Manny wrote: "Loretta wrote: "Well, it looks like I'll be sitting out on suggestions/nominations this time around and most probably the up coming read because I don't read ebooks. I only read real ..."

Here's what I just did. I went to Amazon, on the drop down menu went to Kindle Store, did a seach for "Catholic Classic Books" and on the right corner sorted by "Price: Low to High." A ton of stuff came up and I believe all ebooks have paper book formats.

Manny wrote: "Let me test the waters with this one I've been contemplating for a while. It's not even a Catholic book per se. It's Mark Twain's Personal Recollections of Joan Of Arc. It's actually..."

I actually own this book and have been meaning to read it for quite awhile. Now if only I can find it!

Loretta wrote: "Well, after doing some research on Amazon this afternoon, these are a few suggestions, which came up under $5.00 in some form or fashion:

1. The Way of Perfection by [author:Teresa o..."

I'll second St Augustine, either book will be fine! I haven't read them yet, and one should know them :)

Oooh I am partial to The Way of Perfection suggestion!

All of these are great suggestions,. It's going to make it difficult to choose which one to vote for!

Have people heard of the The Cloud of Unknowing? It's a medieval text about trying to know God. It's another of those books on my to read list. Here's the Wikipedia entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Clo...

Loretta wrote: "Well, after doing some research on Amazon this afternoon, these are a few suggestions, which came up under $5.00 in some form or fashion:

1. The Way of Perfection by [author:Teresa o..."

I am reading City of God and would be delighted to start over again with the group, but a couple thoughts - it is a very long, very difficult book. I have been working on it for better than a year. I could be going faster, but I am reading a lot of other things as well. Perhaps of greater concern, the budget ebook version that I started with at Amazon turned out to have only the first 13 books (chapters) of a work that actually includes 22. That turns out not to be such a bargain. Of course, if we read one book per week (given the difficulty of the material, that is actually a pretty aggressive schedule) we will be reading it for about 5 months - the Penguin paperback is under $12, so perhaps still a bargain. And that includes all 22 books. (At least the TOC says it does - I checked.)

Manny wrote: "Have people heard of the The Cloud of Unknowing? It's a medieval text about trying to know God. It's another of those books on my to read list. Here's the Wikipedia entry:
https://en...."

Yes, a long time ago. It was one of the texts that led me from an atheistic agnosticism to deism, the conviction that God must exist. It would be interesting to revisit.

John refreshed my memory about a recent purchase I made that does have an inexpensive Kindle format. I would love to read Lord of the World. It too has a wikipedia entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord_of...

John wrote: "Manny wrote: "Have people heard of the The Cloud of Unknowing? It's a medieval text about trying to know God. It's another of those books on my to read list. Here's the Wikipedia entr..."

Now you increased my interest in that one.

Under $5 - The Complete Ante-Nicene & Nicene and Post-Nicene Church Fathers Collection: 3 Series, 37 Volumes, 65 Authors, 1,000 Books, 18,000 Chapters, 16 Million Words.

I'm not suggesting we read the whole thing, but perhaps pick a single work from the collection to read. I am tempted to buy this just to have it, but my wife has an embargo on my buying more books that I don't "need." I interpret that as meaning I don't have firm plans to read it in the next month. Or so. Say, firmish. If we selected, say, the Didache, or the Shepherd of Hermas, that would justify buying this extraordinary "book." Just a thought.

Loretta wrote: "John wrote: "Loretta wrote: "Well, after doing some research on Amazon this afternoon, these are a few suggestions, which came up under $5.00 in some form or fashion:

1. [book:The Way of Perfectio..."

Not too long ago, last year I think, we read The Interior Castle. It was a fine read. The discussion is in the archives.

Loretta wrote: "Manny wrote: "John refreshed my memory about a recent purchase I made that does have an inexpensive Kindle format. I would love to read Lord of the World. It too has a wikipedia entr..."

I bought the book in my one of those sales I mentioned the other week and it does come in an inexpensive ebook format.

Loretta wrote: "Manny wrote: "Have people heard of the The Cloud of Unknowing? It's a medieval text about trying to know God. It's another of those books on my to read list. Here's the Wikipedia entr..."

Yes you can. I have it in paperback.

We've got some good suggestions. I can go with any of the suggestions, though I have to admit that the 700 pages of City of God would be a chore. It's a book I want to read but I'd hate to bite off that big task.

Oh my gosh, I just remembered. One of the books I've been dying to read is Pascal's Pensées. It's both in ebook and paperback formats. Here's the wikipedia entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pens%C3...

I have had City of God on my shelf for years. After struggling through the Confessions, I have been terrified of it. A group read of it might get me beyond my fear.

I read The Cloud of Unknowing about 30 years ago.

Great suggestions in this thread.

Loretta wrote: "I'm just curious if we'll be reading anything for the month July considering it's already the 13th of the month."

Well, let's project here Loretta. I'm thinking out loud with my typing fingers. If we use next week (16 - 22 July) to formally nominate books, and the following week (23-29 July) to vote, and then at least a week (30 July to 5 Aug) for members to acquire the book. It would seem the earliest we could be reading is August 6th.

I like to see some substance why someone wants to read a book. I don’t expect anyone to have read it already though I consider this a good reason to read it again if a book has that much depth. There are several deep books I read a second time and even few again a third time. “City of God”, suggested above is a good candidate for a second reading. It was probably the most difficult one I read once. Thomas Merton, whom we have read in this group, wrote this about it: “The City of God”, for those who can understand it, contains the secret of death and life, war and peace, hell and heaven.” But I would caution to be prepared for a long reading journey with this one.

Suggestion by Mark Twain above sounds interesting to me. I just finished a rather irreverent travelogue of his “Innocents Abroad”. He describes in detail a journey to the Holy Land in 1867 with a grain of irony, I thought. I am curious what he wrote about Joan of Arc late in his life when he was rather negative about life in general.

It has been about a year since we've read a papal document.
What would y'all think starting with the trilogy of
God Is Love: Deus Caritas Est
and reading the following ones some time later
Saved in Hope: Spe Salvi
Lumen Fidei: The Light of Faith

Very open Kristen. I thought we read Lumen Fidei here but I couldn't find it in the discussion archives. I must have read it on my own. The other two are definitely worth reading. Actually anything by Pope Benedict is worth reading. God is Love looks like a real fast read.

Manny wrote: "Actually anything by Pope Benedict is worth reading."

My sentiments exactly! :)

Kerstin wrote: "Manny wrote: "Actually anything by Pope Benedict is worth reading."

My sentiments exactly! :)"

I almost completely agree. With the greatest possible respect, sometimes Pope Benedict let his inner academic get away from him. I thought Deus Caritas Est was brilliant and would absolutely be up for a re-read.

John wrote: "Kerstin wrote: "Manny wrote: "Actually anything by Pope Benedict is worth reading."

My sentiments exactly! :)"

I almost completely agree. With the greatest possible respect, sometimes Pope Benedi..."

I think he wrote for different audiences. When he really goes deep, he loses me sometimes - and probably most people. But at the same time this gives him a command of our faith few have. And even if I don't understand something fully, I know he can be trusted completely.

OK, let's gather together our brainstormed ideas so we can now start a nomination phase. Ten ideas were put out, but remember we can nominate anything you still want, as long as there is a less than for $5 option for those on a budget.

Manny's Suggestions:
Personal Recollections of Joan Of Arc
The Cloud of Unknowing
Lord of the World
Pensées

Loretta's Suggestions:
The Way of Perfection
City of God
Confessions

Kerstin's Suggestions
God Is Love: Deus Caritas Est
Saved in Hope: Spe Salvi
Lumen Fidei: The Light of Faith

If I missed anything let me know. I'll set up a nomination thread tomorrow. But only one nomination per person, so Loretta, Kerstin, and I will have to pick one. If someone likes one of the others not picked, please step forward and nominate it. Also, again, we are not limited to these in the brainstorming session. Please nominate something that stirs your soul.

When I open the nomination thread tomorrow, I will also send out a group announcement for those who have not been following. May the Holy Spirit guide our selection! ;)

Don Quixote is available for free through Amazon. Brandon Vogt suggests this as one of the top 100 must read books for Catholics.

An aside to this, I did an online search for free Catholic books and there were many sources with a number a resources.

Great novel Andy. You're free to nominate it. I'm going to set up the nomination thread in a little while here.

Looking at some of the posts above, this concept of low cost books needs to be clarified. The objective was to make sure that people on a tight budget could participate in group reads. The $5 limitation was an arbitrary limit that was directed at availability. So if a book was available for $2.99 on Kindle or some other E-Book, it would be eligible for selection in any format. No one would be required to read it on Kindle; any member could use the format of their choice, hard cover, paperback or anything else. An individual member could use the format of their choice.

I hope this explanation is helpful. Also, the group can reevaluate this cost limitation at any time.

So beyond here are official nominations.

Quick rules: One nomination per person. We alternate between a full priced book and a lower priced book where there has to be an option for a book costing no more than $5. Most Catholic classic books come in a ebook format, which can be bought for less than $5 This turn is the lower priced book option. As Mike explains above, you are free to buy whichever format you feel comfortable with, but we want to give those on a budget an option to save a little. Those are all the rules.

If you read above, we had a brainstorming session where we threw out lots of ideas. We'll spend this week (up to Saturday night) to nominate, and the following week we'll vote.

So let me start and I'm going to nominate Mark Twain's Personal Recollections of Joan Of Arc.

Out of a love of history, I went back to nominations from prior polls.

In our last poll we had two books tie for the number two position behind “Vision of Fatima”; “Seeking God: The Way of St. Benedict” by Esther de Waal and “Introduction to the Devout Life” by Francis de Sales. Both books are good and each gained five votes in that poll.

I nominate “Seeking God” but would also enjoy the “Devout Life”.

I nominate God Is Love: Deus Caritas Est

Mike wrote: "Out of a love of history, I went back to nominations from prior polls.

In our last poll we had two books tie for the number two position behind “Vision of Fatima”; “Seeking God: The Way of St. Be..."

Mike - I couldn't find a ebook version of Seeking God: The Way of St. Benedict, and so I couldn't find a less than $5 option. Do you know of any?

Manny wrote: "Mike wrote: "Out of a love of history, I went back to nominations from prior polls.

In our last poll we had two books tie for the number two position behind “Vision of Fatima”; “Seeking God: The ..."

Yes, on Amazon there are used paper back copies for as low as $1.80. I have not found this title as an E-Book at all; I wish I could I am converting to Kindle more and more.

Mike wrote: "Manny wrote: "Mike wrote: "Out of a love of history, I went back to nominations from prior polls.

In our last poll we had two books tie for the number two position behind “Vision of Fatima”; “See..."

As a point of clarification, does the $5 apply to shipping? All of the books I saw that were under $5 included at least $4 shipping, bringing the total cost over $5.

John wrote: "Mike wrote: "Manny wrote: "Mike wrote: "Out of a love of history, I went back to nominations from prior polls.

In our last poll we had two books tie for the number two position behind “Vision of ..."

We never really talked about it. I don't think we considered used books. I thought the intention was to have an ebook option. I'm kind of reluctant to accept used books as an option here because one doesn't know what kind of condition used books come in. Let me talk it over with the one or two people who wanted this $5 option every other read and see how they feel about it.

Also, I mentioned this in the "I Just Purchased" thread. Amazon is having a sale on The Essential Pope Benedict XVI: His Central Writings and Speeches in ebook format. It's 99 cents and it includes Kerstin's nomination, God is Love. Here's the link:
https://www.amazon.com/Essential-Pope...

These sales only last a day or two. I hope people see this.

Manny wrote: "Also, I mentioned this in the "I Just Purchased" thread. Amazon is having a sale on The Essential Pope Benedict XVI: His Central Writings and Speeches in ebook format. It's 99 cents and it includes..."

Saw it, thanks Manny. Looks like a bargain.

Manny, the intention of the limitation was too make sure there was a low cost option. Personally, I am not a supporter of the limitation; I feel that how one procures books is their business. I do agree with the suggestions made by you and a number of other moderators over the years to point members to very low cost and sometimes free options.

I have a number of books that I have purchased used and have employed them in group reads. I have also checked books out from the library. Some of group reads we have made have had titles which were not available as E-books at the time we read them; in fact some are not available in E-format to this day.

It is true that buying a used book is a risk regarding condition but over the past few years I have found used books sold by Amazon have turned out to be in reasonably good shape.

If I recall the history of this question, several people opted out of a discussion because they were not willing or able to pay full price for the book chosen. Unlike many GR groups, our books are not often found at a general library. So, a pole was taken if people wanted to alternate between a general selection of any Catholic title and those books that might be available at low or no cost (e-book, on-line document, public library). I understood the $5 to have been a guide post, not an unbreakable law.

I was one of those who voted for the alternation between open nominations and low cost nominations. But, had we not taken a vote, I would have been fine continuing with general nominations. I am very comfortable opting out of a discussion for which I can not find the book, do not want to pay for the book, or simply do not want to read the book. Since a title wins a pole because it has a majority of votes, if I am not among those voting for that book, I feel that the conversation will have enough participants to continue without me. If I can't get the book have already read the book, am not interested in that book, I feel free to sit out the discussion that round.

That is a long way of saying that I have no problem with a title being added to the nomination that is not available for $5 or from a local public library. If people do not want to pay for that book, they won't vote for it and it won't win.

OK, for now let's continue with the nominations. We'll include used books as a low cost option. Most used books from Amazon are in decent shape. We won't include shipping costs in the $5.

I nominate Heart of Joy by Mother Teresa. Heart of Joy

On Amazon for a used book, it is a few cents over the $5 suggestion, but with free shipping.

Colleen wrote: "I nominate Heart of Joy by Mother Teresa. Heart of Joy

On Amazon for a used book, it is a few cents over the $5 suggestion, but with free shipping."

That will be fine. Interesting pick Colleen.

I will. Ore for St Benedict (seeking God)

Elaine wrote: "I will. Ore for St Benedict (seeking God)"

Elaine. are you nominating Seeking God: The Way of St. Benedict? If so, Mike has already nominated it.

Manny wrote: "Elaine wrote: "I will. Ore for St Benedict (seeking God)"

Elaine. are you nominating Seeking God: The Way of St. Benedict? If so, Mike has already nominated it."

I am more than willing to share the nomination with Elaine.

We have spent a fair amount of space in this thread on costs and formats. I would like to solicit comments from the members regarding the use of content to aid in the selection process.

Our group is entitled “Catholic Thought” and as such members are entitled to expect that our reading selections are in keeping with the teachings of the Catholic Church. I have enjoyed the reads that have increased my spirituality and appreciation for the teachings of the Church. I ask our members to comment on using this as a guiding principle in selection of titles. PLEASE COMMENT.

Another suggestion, originally made by Galicius a while ago, was to have the person who is nominating offer a reason for nominating it to the members and a little something about the book. I like this idea and feel it would help others in book selection. Here again I ask members for their comments. PLEASE COMMENT.

Shortly, I will post something on “Seeking God”.