Victorians! discussion

Our excursion on the Thames has come to an end, Fellow Travelers. Both glorious and ignominious. What are your thoughts on this section? And on the book as a whole?

Possible Discussion Points:

1) How were you struck by the suicide? What were Jerome's possible motivations in including this sad event? How is the writing here different (if at all) from that of the rest of the book?
2) How are the "fish stories" recounted, the same or different from those you've heard? To what effect does Jerome use this common white lie?
3) "Look at your nose!" In what ways has their inexperience colored the events of this excursion?
4) Describe "The a Pride of the Thames." How does it differ from the expectation?
5) What details bring about the end of their time on the river?
6) What are your overall impressions of Jerome's travel journal? What will you take away?

Thank you all for your participation. Reading this with you has been a bit of an extra vacation... Without the sunburn, blisters, wet garments, or general discomfort that sometimes comes with the best laid plans. ;-)

With regards to the suicide, I'm inclined to think that JKJ and his wife really did encounter such a corpse on their river excursion and that it affected them deeply, and despite Three Men being a humorous book, he felt he needed to include it.

I'm also inclined to think that he speculated about the woman's circumstances rather than really investigated. It all seemed a little too much like one of those ballads about woman who was lured into an alliance that left her with a baby and nothing else.

I couldn't help but remember the dead dog that floated by after they decided to make tea with river water.

In addition to what Jane said, I think he also brings to the forefront that the river is also dangerous. The waters bring life but also death. One can have a wonderful holiday, but life still continues everywhere around you with all the joys and sorrows that entails, and some of it is played out in the river.

Those are really good points, Ladies. I agree that the event of finding a suicide in the river probably came from a real life experience. If not that if Jerome himself, then of someone he knew. And, yes, I also felt there was some romanticizing going on in the written account.

I really like the idea of the author using it to underscore the dangerous aspects of the river. It would seem almost irresponsible not to include some reference to that, along with the recounted humor and history.

I did think that the suicide or rather Jerome discovering it must have been real but for me, it also took away from the overall light-hearted tone of the book- yes, it made it real, but perhaps it was that I wanted to escape it (current state of mind) that made me not want it to be there.

I enjoyed my reading overall- though this last segment taking on a more serious tone and being perhaps a little more travel book than humour did feel slightly different from the rest of the book.

I enjoyed the fact that they slink away to escape the river by train in the end. Especially after some of our speculation on how difficult it would be to row upstream for their return trip.

Renee wrote: "I enjoyed the fact that they slink away to escape the river by train in the end. Especially after some of our speculation on how difficult it would be to row upstream for their return trip."

That was a nice touch- yes.

Hate the suicide, I wish he hadn't included that in the book. I always skip that bit when reading it. it doesn't fit in at all with the overall tone. i love the part about the steam launches - it is such an exact portrayal of human nature - they're against steam launches until they are actually offered a tow by one. And i love the bit about the washing, "more in the nature of excavating." And the demoralising effect of river air is funny. i feel rather sorry for them when they get depressed by the rain, it would have been nice if they could have finished their trip in sunshine, but that is England for you. And i suppose it would have been difficult to think of new things to say about their downriver trip, since they had already passed all the same places going upriver.

The suicide reminded me of something that happened to me. We were going on a much needed vacation and road trip. We were laughing and talking about our vacation plans. All of a sudden we pass a terrible car accident. Makes you stop and think, reminded us to pay attention and drive careful. I thought about it all the while I was on vacation, never forgot it. Reminds us, like the suicide there is sadness and fun in life.

Louise wrote: "Hate the suicide, I wish he hadn't included that in the book. I always skip that bit when reading it. it doesn't fit in at all with the overall tone. i love the part about the steam launches - it i..."

Me too- I loved the general light-hearted tone of the book and this took away from it- in fact changed it entirely.

I missed Montmorency in these later chapters. He mostly faded out of view, only getting very short mentions, and none of them involving the sort of extended interpretation of h is behavior. Contast, for example, the simple
"We spent two very pleasant days at Oxford. There are plenty of dogs in the town of Oxford. Montmorency had eleven fights on the first day, and fourteen on the second, and evidently thought he had got to heaven."

With the earlier, extended description of his interaction with the town cat.

Chapter 14, for example, had a nice selection of Montmorency encounters -- M bringing the dead water-rat to add to the Irish stew, M fighting the kettle, M and the banjo practice, M barking to identify the moored boat, M and the swans. But after that, he sort of fades out and is only barely mentioned.

A lot of the time, I found M the most enjoyable of the four participants. I was sorry to see him disappear just as he was needed to enliven up the somewhat depressing ending.

Everyman wrote: "I missed Montmorency in these later chapters. He mostly faded out of view, only getting very short mentions, and none of them involving the sort of extended interpretation of h is behavior. Contast..."

That's true. I enjoyed the conversation with the cat- such fun. The banjo session and the kettle were again very real.

Everyman wrote: "I missed Montmorency in these later chapters. He mostly faded out of view, only getting very short mentions, and none of them involving the sort of extended interpretation of h is behavior. Contast..."

I'm a big fan of Montmorency too--he pretty much stole the show for me. I think his contribution to the Irish stew was inspired!

Definitely a favorite character!