Underground Knowledge — A discussion group discussion

Excerpt from The Orphan Conspiracies: 29 Conspiracy Theories from The Orphan Trilogy:

It seems likely MK-Ultra or a Manchurian Candidate, or possibly both, may have been involved in the 1968 assassination of Robert F. Kennedy, the US Presidential candidate most political analysts agree would have been elected President had he lived.

As mentioned earlier, The Orphan Factory climaxes with a political assassination in the Amazon jungle. Nine and Seventeen, the orphan-operatives charged with carrying out the assassination, tell themselves over and over in their own minds, “Quamina Ezekiel must die.” They are not sure why they’re repeating this phrase to themselves; the implication is they’re under the influence of mind control.

In the writing of that sequence, we include mind control triggers based on alternative theories surrounding some of the most well-known lone gunmen of the 20th Century. But more than any other real-world assassination, this section of our novel was directly inspired by reports of RFK’s convicted killer, Sirhan Sirhan.

By all accounts, on the fateful evening of June 5, 1968, the Palestinian-Jordanian assassin appeared to be in a hypnotic state at the scene of the crime – the Ambassador Hotel in Los Angeles. Many believe Sirhan Sirhan was a Manchurian Candidate diligently following instructions his conscious mind was not even aware of.

The prevailing professional opinion is RFK’s assassin has never been able to remember anything of that night – not entering the hotel, not the killing itself and not leaving the hotel in handcuffs. Nothing.

Apparently, Sirhan Sirhan’s only vague memory fragment, if it can be described as that, was said to be a vision of a typewriter he remembered observing all night long as it automatically typed a series of orders for him to follow.

All the evidence at hand seems to indicate Sirhan Sirhan was a brainwashed assassin or, at the very least, he was in a hypnotized state when he pulled the trigger of his .22 caliber revolver.

We refer to his memory blackouts; the reports of multiple witnesses claiming he looked like he was in “a trance”; the psychiatrist who testified at the ensuing court case that Sirhan Sirhan was in a trance state on the night of the crime; and especially the diaries found in his home by the LAPD – diaries whose pages were filled with Sirhan’s scribbled handwriting.

Over and over, the words “RFK must die” filled the pages of those diaries. Handwriting analysis indicated the writing was automatic writing, meaning Sirhan Sirhan was not conscious of what he was writing.

Another curious fact supporting the hypnotism and mind control theory was that the Jordanian passport-holder had earlier joined the Rosicrucians, an occult group also known as the Ancient Mystical Order of the Rose Cross. When several psychiatrists assessed him to be in a hypnotized state after the assassination, Sirhan Sirhan’s Rosicrucian membership was treated by many as suspicious, especially as trance and hypnotism are a known part of the group’s teachings.

Defence attorney Dr. Bernard Diamond tried to dismiss his client’s undeniable hypnotized state by claiming Sirhan Sirhan must have hypnotized himself.

If the assassin was a Manchurian Candidate, the range of suspects could include anyone from the CIA or the Mafia to occultists or the Military Industrial Complex. Many believe the latter to be the culprit, especially as Kennedy had stated he would immediately end the Vietnam War were he to become President.

In a 2011 parole hearing, Sirhan Sirhan’s new lawyer, Dr. William Pepper, said his client had been “hypno programmed” and he alluded to the Manchurian Candidate theory.


Ezekiel’s head was in the center of the crosshairs of Seventeen’s telescopic sight. As she prepared for the shot, the only sound she could hear was Kentbridge’s voice in her mind. Her mentor sounded like a broken record. Quamina Ezekiel must die. Quamina Ezekiel must die. Quamina Ezekiel must die. –The Orphan Factory

Larry Teeter (Sirhan Sirhan's lawyer) talks about the CIA and RFK and how mind control was involved in the assassination: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6thJe...

"they" killed the best and bravest...

I am not convinced that RFK was killed by him. Look at the number of bullet holes in the original photos.

You're right, Dave.
Sirhan Sirhan was most likely another patsy and under mind control also.
He did have a gun and fire bullets (which I think from memory witnesses saw) but at the Ambassador Hotel there were so many bullet holes that clearly there were other gunmen.
So probably Sirhan Sirhan was programmed to be the fall guy or Lone Gunmen ala Oswald.

A new poll is underway asking whether YOU believe Sirhan Sirhan was the lone gunman in RFK's assassination: https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...

Naim wrote: "I voted no because it seems like the general consensus. I suppose im just keeping up with the flock. I have not done any research on this topic myself."

In such a case better perhaps to nominate "Undecided" Naim otherwise the result (final tally) could be skewed if more Undecideds vote yes or no based on the toss of a coin so to speak. Just a suggestion.

I find it interesting that there seems to always be those interested in spewing disinformation who show an interest in these topics. I find it exposes them actually. How frequently they have ties to Nazi ideology.

The group poll that asked 'Do you believe Robert (Bobby) F. Kennedy (RFK) was solely killed by the "lone gunman" Sirhan Sirhan?' is now complete.

Here are the results:

50.0% voted NO
26.3% voted UNDECIDED
23.7% voted YES

Check out the comments that occurred during the voting period: https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...

Shadow Play: The Murder of Robert F. Kennedy, the Trial of Sirhan Sirhan & the Failure of American Justice covers many of these issues and presents are strong case that Sirhan Sirhan is totally innocent.

Cheers James, this is one I haven't read.
Excuse me, I'm off to Amazon.

RFK Assassination on Coast to Coast https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2...

First Half: Paul DeBole is an Assistant Professor of Political Science at Lasell College, where among the courses he teaches is Conspiracy in American Politics. He will discuss the anomalies in the assassination of Robert F. Kennedy which happened 50 years ago this week and why Sirhan Sirhan may not be guilty. He will also update his work on the JFK assassination.

James wrote: "RFK Assassination on Coast to Coast https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2....."A new publication on the 50th anniversary of RFK's murder brings new evidence of the i.d. of the polka-dot dress girl, CIA links & MK/ULTRA. 'The Assassination of Robert F. Kennedy' by Tim Tate & Brad Johnson. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic...

http://cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?...

I wouldn't say this is THE greatest speech ever...
But it's one of them!

The Greatest Speech Ever - Robert F Kennedy Announcing The Death Of Martin Luther King https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoKzC...

James wrote: "I wouldn't say this is THE greatest speech ever...
But it's one of them!

The Greatest Speech Ever - Robert F Kennedy Announcing The Death Of Martin Luther King https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoKz..."

And here's another great "pin drop" speech in a continuation of the theme - from the eloquent James Baldwin. Note both Kennedy and King get a mention. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUBh9...

RFK ASSASSINATION RECONSIDERED, BUT WHY NOW? https://gizadeathstar.com/2018/06/rfk...

Who Killed Bobby?: The Unsolved Murder of Robert F. Kennedy



Treason, Treachery & Deceit: The Murderers of JFK, Mlk, & Rfk



Shadow Play: The Murder of Robert F. Kennedy, the Trial of Sirhan Sirhan & the Failure of American Justice

RFK Assassination https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2...

Lisa Pease has been researching the assassinations of the 1960s and the covert history of the United States' roles in coups for more than 25 years. In the first half, she discussed her latest work on the 1968 assassination of Robert F. Kennedy and how witnesses who had details of the conspiracy were silenced by the LAPD, evidence was deliberately altered and, in some instances, destroyed. According to Pease, the LAPD pried off wood paneling from the pantry wall where RFK was shot. The FBI had labeled four bullet holes in the door frame which implied that there was a second shooter besides Sirhan Sirhan, she cited.

Pease suggested that Sirhan's weapon may have been firing blanks (witnesses saw a flash coming from his gun and blanks typically produce more of a flash than bullets do), and that he was a hypnotized patsy used as a distraction from the real shooters. One theory is that a gunman had a gun concealed inside a camera. Three witnesses actually saw a shooter (not Sirhan) on the kitchen table in the pantry firing down on the crowd, she reported. Adding another layer to the mystery, she revealed that one of the security guards at the event was working for a top CIA intermediary, known for running assassination plots.

David wrote: "I am not convinced that RFK was killed by him. Look at the number of bullet holes in the original photos."

I thought you only believed in one or two conspiracies in JFK and Pope John Paul I, Dave?
What's happening to you? Are you becoming the new Fox Mulder? Or even a tinfoil hat wearer?!

as the year ends, I remain the skeptic. However, RFK death continues to pose a number of questions not answered by an incompetent LAPD that screwed up the OJ case years later. Princess Di, Adolph, M. Jackson and all the rest remain in the fringe category for me.

James wrote: "RFK Assassination https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2...

Lisa Pease has been researching the assassinations of the 1960s and the covert history of the United States' roles in coups for mor..."Just bought 'A Lie Too Big To Fail'. Will be my first read in 2019.

Pete, will have to check that out

David wrote: "as the year ends, I remain the skeptic. However, RFK death continues to pose a number of questions not answered by an incompetent LAPD that screwed up the OJ case years later. Princess Di, Adolph, M. Jackson and all the rest remain in the fringe category for me. ..."

I dunno mate, painting yourself as the only logical/skeptical one around here is a cute approach and a theme you like to promote, I note....However, I'd say you're about as tinfoil as they come according to many in the mainstream!!! I mean, belief in UFO sightings, JFK, RFK, Vatican conspiracies etc, are completely nuts to many "mainstreamers" or academic types. In fact, some diehard patriots would even call you anti-American for those Kennedy beliefs re someone or something within the US Government or CIA likely being the ones that did that to President/Presidential Candidate...

Re some of the other things you're mentioning: Diana's death being a potential conspiracy has been covered a lot in mainstream news media, so not really anymore fringe than JFK, especially in Britain (and I'd say the Diana conspiracy theory is far more popular than RFK which is a rare theory almost never reported, tho one I personally tend to subscribe to myself having looked into RFK's strange death).

Re Adolf and MJ, those were just raised to ensure all bases covered, but unlikely to be true conspiracies I tend to agree. I think a lot of people make the mistake to automatically assume discussing potential conspiracies means that one DEFINITELY believes in those ideas. Personally, given all the naivety and pollyanna-ish trust in big governments and military we as a people have historically shown to be extremely gullible and hoodwinked sooo many times (e.g. Operations Paperclip, MK-Ultra, Mockingbird, Northwoods, Gulf of Tonkin, etc), that it makes sense to question everything and put all counter ideas on the table (for discussion only, just to ensure Devil's Advocate/due diligence). That doesn't mean all potential subjects raised will turn out to be true, however...Quite a few won't in fact, I would have thought that's kinda obvious with such contentious subjects?

Keep in mind also that to be a successful logically minded and skeptical person means that skepticism needs to go both ways - i.e. it's not just skepticism of conspiracy or counter theories we as a people require... History reveals we also need to be MUCH more skeptical of official stories presented by the mainstream whether from the government, the military or academia.

It's a very tricky balance to get as an individual and one I will admit I personally need to readjust for constantly to make sure I haven't swung too far in any one direction (so I don't fall for the agendas of different factions in society).

So in short Dave, I hope you have a Happy New Year with your shiny tinfoil hat on! Wear it with pride, because it means you're not one of the gullible masses who believe everything they are told!

James wrote: "David wrote: "as the year ends, I remain the skeptic. However, RFK death continues to pose a number of questions not answered by an incompetent LAPD that screwed up the OJ case years later. .."A few days ago, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was on the Alec Baldwin Show, and he said that he does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan shot his father, and he thinks he knows who did, and he wants the case reopened.

Pete wrote: "A few days ago, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was on the Alec Baldwin Show, and he said that he does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan shot his father, and he thinks he knows who did, and he wants the case reopened. ..."

Nice development. The surviving Kennedys have been quiet on these issues in recent decades. You can understand why! Heavy load to be part of that clan.

Kinda seems like Western Civilization needs to go back, sort out the past and debunk all the silly lies and fabricated official stories, so that we can move forward. What do you reckon, Pete? And where are you at with your research on the Kennedy assassinations?

James wrote: "Pete wrote: "A few days ago, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was on the Alec Baldwin Show, and he said that he does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan shot his father, and he thinks he knows who did, and he want..."Western Civilization needs to go back, sort out the past and debunk all the silly lies and fabricated official stories, so that we can move forward. Phwor.....that's a big ask! Like Dave, I'm somewhat a cynic too.

In my research I continue to collect publications on JFK & RFK. 2017 & 2018 saw Trump's file releases. I was recently asked about these in a Q. & A. to be published in the Dealey Plaza Echo. I quoted Peter Model from 1976, "But even if these files will one day all be thrown open for us to look at, there’s no guarantee that they will contain all the necessary information with which to finally get at the truth of what happened up to, during and after that fateful November 22, 1963. For in conspiracies, you see, no records are ever kept.”

Yeah, I agree with all you're implying here as maybe so much misinformation has been infused into JFK/RFK assassinations that we may not recognise the truth even if it was put in front of us?

Am not saying all past mysteries can ever all be solved, but it seems like more and more people are growing suspicious of various events they once believed indisputable fact. We may not always find a smoking gun, but at least people like you are trying.

Keep up the good work Pete!

p.s. How about MLK's death? You ever researched that? https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

James, It seems like yesterday that I sat and watched moment by moment these horrific murders of John, Bobby, Martin. The images are burned into my brain and I have not for one single day believed any of what we were told to be the truth. I appreciate as an historian the research people keep doing to find the real truth. I probably won't be around when that is public, perhaps my children or grandchildren will be, but these are answers that we must have, just as today we need the truth behind all the lies. All lies can alter the future of life.

Remy wrote: "James, It seems like yesterday that I sat and watched moment by moment these horrific murders of John, Bobby, Martin. The images are burned into my brain and I have not for one single day believed ..."

Those are traumatic things to remember, Remy.

James wrote: How about MLK's death? You ever researched that? ..."Sure have. The most revealing books on MLK that I have read are the series from William Pepper.....'Act of State' being my recommended one.

The Real Manchurian Candidate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCU2M...
Was Sirhan Sirhan hypnotically programmed to assassinate Bobby Kennedy? For the last eleven years, Dr. Daniel Brown, a leading expert on hypnosis and coercive persuasion at Harvard Medical School, and Sirhan's attorney Laurie Dusek, have spent over 150 hours with Sirhan, trying to recover his memory of the shooting. These sessions have produced some extraordinary new evidence of the "range mode" programming allegedly used to set up Sirhan as the lone assassin. On the 50th anniversary of the assassination, you can now watch Brown and Dusek discuss these new discoveries for the first time.

James wrote: "The Real Manchurian Candidate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCU2M...
Was Sirhan Sirhan hypnotically programmed to assassinate Bobby Kennedy? For the last eleven years, Dr. Daniel Brown, a lead..."The recent publication from Lisa Pease 'A Lie Too Big To Fail' shows that Sirhan's gun was not matched to any ballistic evidence & was very likely firing blanks & that there were two assassination teams in the Ambassador to intercept RFK which ever route he took after his victory speech. The Pease book is a must read, brings out new evidence & points to THREE other shooters in the pantry, one of which, the so called bodyguard, Thane Eugene Cesar was CIA & yes, Sirhan was hypno programmed & is innocent of all charges.

Thanks to Pete for the tip

From Amazon site about Pease's book

In A Lie Too Big to Fail, longtime Kennedy researcher (of both JFK and RFK) Lisa Pease lays out, in meticulous detail, how witnesses with evidence of conspiracy were silenced by the Los Angeles Police Department; how evidence was deliberately altered and, in some instances, destroyed; and how the justice system and the media failed to present the truth of the case to the public. Pease reveals how the trial was essentially a sham, and how the prosecution did not dare to follow where the evidence led.
A Lie Too Big to Fail asserts the idea that a government can never investigate itself in a crime of this magnitude. Was the convicted Sirhan Sirhan a willing participant? Or was he a mind-controlled assassin? It has fallen to independent researchers like Pease to lay out the evidence in a clear and concise manner, allowing readers to form their theories about this event. Pease places the history of this event in the context of the era and provides shocking overlaps between other high-profile murders and attempted murders of the time. Lisa Pease goes further than anyone else in proving who likely planned the assassination, who the assassination team members were, and why Kennedy was deemed such a threat that he had to be taken out before he became President of the United States.

https://www.amazon.com/Lie-Too-Big-Fa...

David wrote: "Thanks to Pete for the tip

From Amazon site about Pease's book

In A Lie Too Big to Fail, longtime Kennedy researcher (of both JFK and RFK) Lisa Pease lays out, in meticulous detail, how witnesses..."
& thanks to James for the YouTube link....well worth watching. Dr. Daniel Brown provides new info I have never come across before regarding the i.d. of 'Frank' at the Corona firing range, who is linked to Chicago Mafia's Mo Dalitz. O.K. but Mafia links to RFK & JFK's killings, it should be remembered that CIA & Mafia had operational links prior to these assassinations & I don't believe Mafia could have performed these killings & cover-ups without CIA overall control.
Also new is the morse code explanation to Sirhan's notebook writings that Brown has uncovered.

Pete wrote: "I don't believe Mafia could have performed these killings & cover-ups without CIA overall control..."

Me neither. It think RFK's death way too methodical and sophisticated for just Mafia to have done all by themselves. Likewise with JFK.

As James has often said, NOT the entire CIA but rouge elements within.

Worth a watch...

Who Killed Robert Kennedy? | Al Jazeera World https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVScM...

very compelling. LAPD hosed it.

David wrote: "very compelling. LAPD hosed it."With Manny Pena & Hank Hernandez both CIA stoolies, it's no surprise they hosed it!

A big problemo in getting a fair trial for Sirhan Sirhan would be that most of the public couldn't conceive of mind control. Even if you explained MK-Ultra to most people, they still couldn't process it I don't think.

I think my generation (boomers) might struggle some, but younger generations would understand it much better

The Real Manchurian Candidate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCU2M...
Was Sirhan Sirhan hypnotically programmed to assassinate Bobby Kennedy? For the last eleven years, Dr. Daniel Brown, a leading expert on hypnosis and coercive persuasion at Harvard Medical School, and Sirhan's attorney Laurie Dusek, have spent over 150 hours with Sirhan, trying to recover his memory of the shooting. These sessions have produced some extraordinary new evidence of the "range mode" programming allegedly used to set up Sirhan as the lone assassin. On the 50th anniversary of the assassination, you can now watch Brown and Dusek discuss these new discoveries for the first time.

Robert F Kennedy was assassinated by Thane Eugene Cesar, declares RFK Jr, who says it was the security guard who fatally shot his father from behind after planning the murder with Sirhan Sirhan https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...

Robert F Kennedy Jr is accusing Thane Eugene Cesar of murdering his father, claiming he fatally shot the presidential hopeful from behind in 1968
He believes that Cesar was working with Sirhan Sirhan and guided Kennedy towards the Palestinian-born gunman while working security that night
RFK Jr said Sirhan fired once in Kennedy's direction and then into the crowd, while Cesar then the fatal bullet as the senator from NY fell to the floor
There are others who believe there were two gunmen that night, a theory that was bolstered when the coroner determined Kennedy was shot from behind
RFK Jr made this claim just hours after Cesar passed away in the Philippines, where he moved shortly after the assassination, and called for a new probe
'The LAPD unit that investigated my dad’s assassination was run by active CIA operatives. They destroyed thousands of pieces of evidence,' claimed RFK Jr

Thane Eugene Cesar https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Thane_Eug...
hane Eugene Cesar was an armed security guard believed by some commentators (including Mark Gorton) to have been the real shooter in the RFK assassination.
Cesar was hired as a part-time security guard just a few months before getting called up at the last minute to personally escort Kennedy.[2] Lisa Pease, who researched A Lie Too Big to Fail about the RFK Assassination, writes that Cesar had previously worked for Robert A. Maheu in Los Angeles.[3]

Thane Eugene Cesar was an armed security guard standing directly behind Robert F. Kennedy when he was shot in the back of the head. Lisa peases cites witnesses such as the wife of author George Plimpton, who said they saw gunmen behind Kennedy. [3] Cesar admitted drawing his gun.[

RFK Assassin Sirhan Sirhan Stabbed In Prison https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZql4...

In light of everything that's happened in 2020, especially the tensions between different groups of citizens, I think this speech by RFK is worth another listen...

Robert F Kennedy Announcing The Death Of Martin Luther King - A Great Speech
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoKzC...

Seeing Robert F. Kennedy on top of my feed brought to mind the death of RFK Jr's niece, Maeve Kennedy McKean, and her son who died in that very bizarre canoe accident.

She was executive director of the Georgetown University Global Health Initiative and associate director of the HIV Policy Lab at the O'Neill Institute for National and Global Health Law and I believe condemned her uncle's anti-vaccine mission in the past but do you think it's possible that her death could be related. Like, let's say if she changed her mind or as some kind of warning?

Not sure sorry, Roth, I've never looked into that. Only vaguely heard about it in headlines.

The canoe accident her and her son had was odd....

Sirhan Sirhan faces yet another parole hearing in the very near future. His hearing was scheduled for March 2021 but has been slightly delayed due to Covid. Lisa Pease sent me an e-mail requesting appeal letters to the Board.
I would ask members to please consider writing a letter to ask for Sirhan's release from prison. He is now in his mid seventies and as anyone who has studied this case will know, he could not be guilty of killing Bobby Kennedy.
Letters should be sent to:--Board of Parole Hearings,
1515 K Street,
Sacremento,
California 95814, U.S.A.

Letters should NOT mention conspiracy theories, false trial evidence or MK/Ultra indications etc.,etc.
It can be stated that Sirhan was only 24 at the time of the offence. New Californian legislation asks for leniency for people serving life who were under the age of 26 at the time of their lifetime conviction.
Sirhan has served his time with a clean record. Recently he was attacked and stabbed in the neck.
His only family left alive is his brother, who has a house ready for Sirhan to live out his remaining years.
Letters of appeal on behalf of Sirhan from around the world can only aid this man, please consider writing a.s.a.p.
Sirhan's Parole Hearing date will be put on Jim DiEugenio's website 'Kennedys & King' as soon as we know the date.
Thank you.