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Algorithms of Oppression
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February 2019: Algorithms of Oppression (Feb/Mar 2019)
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Hey team! I've put together a poll for what we want to read next.
I'll be gallivanting around South America for the next couple of weeks, so will be ignoring pretty much everything until Jan 22nd. I've set the poll to close then, and will announce results soon after and figure out when we want to meet (thinking late Feb, but maybe March if people want more time to read).
Happy voting!
I'll be gallivanting around South America for the next couple of weeks, so will be ignoring pretty much everything until Jan 22nd. I've set the poll to close then, and will announce results soon after and figure out when we want to meet (thinking late Feb, but maybe March if people want more time to read).
Happy voting!
Hey everyone! I think Zoe comes back from her travels today, so get your vote in today (if you haven’t already) for next month’s book choice 🙌🏻🙌🏽🙌🏿
We have a winner! The next read is Algorithms of Oppression: How Search Engines Reinforce Racism by Safiya Umoja Noble.
To give us time to read, I propose early March to meet. Have put some options into a poll. Don't know if this is the best method to organise, but let's give it a shot. If anyone has better suggestions, let me know.
To give us time to read, I propose early March to meet. Have put some options into a poll. Don't know if this is the best method to organise, but let's give it a shot. If anyone has better suggestions, let me know.
Mod
The issue with polls on here is that you can only select one answer, so we won’t be able to find the best time for people like we could with doodle. Perhaps a doodle instead? Let me know if you’d like me to make one this weekend!
Ah, right you are. Was trying to avoid the dreaded Doodle, but here goes: add your availability here. Have included more options too, but if I'm way off for anyone's timezone please let me know!
Awesome!! Really excited to read the book :)
Heya! It looks from the Doodle like Sunday 10 March is the best time for the folks who voted. Shall we lock that in?
Little late to the Doodle, but the 10th works for me. Looking forward to discussing this one!
Sorry team! Been meaning to loop back on this. Thanks for the reminder, Kirstie :)
It does look like the 10th works for everyone who completed the poll, and I'll randomly select 2-3pm EST / 7-8pm UTC / [your timezone here].
@Naomi - how did you handle RSVPs last time so I can make sure everyone who's attending gets the call details?
Now I just need to start reading... Went wild and read a whole other book this month (The Power by Naomi Alderman - highly recommend it if anyone is in the market for some fiction).
It does look like the 10th works for everyone who completed the poll, and I'll randomly select 2-3pm EST / 7-8pm UTC / [your timezone here].
@Naomi - how did you handle RSVPs last time so I can make sure everyone who's attending gets the call details?
Now I just need to start reading... Went wild and read a whole other book this month (The Power by Naomi Alderman - highly recommend it if anyone is in the market for some fiction).
Fab! Thank you Zoe! And for the recommendation - looks awesome :)
The author is a keynote speaker at a Conference I'm going to next week. What should I ask her?
Sorry for the slow reply Eric! Have you been to the conference? How was the talk?
Unfortunately, she had to cancel. Was looking forward to it.
Mod
@Zoe - I did rsvps using the event option here, had emails for most people but it didn’t matter because we shared the agenda doc and the conf call link on the event post here and called handles on twitter too. At least that’s what I think happened! Lmk if you need any help. I’ll be on a train during the book club slot but will be trying to join!
Thanks Naomi :)
We're on for Sunday at 2pm ET / 7pm UTC, folks!
I have Alisa, Patricia, Anna, Jessica, Kirstie, Nick and a possible Naomi (pending the train situation) down, but don't think I have email addresses for you all, so will just share the call link & agenda here morning-of. Will try do some Twittering to get the word out too - hope a few others can join us! Spread the word if you can :)
We're on for Sunday at 2pm ET / 7pm UTC, folks!
I have Alisa, Patricia, Anna, Jessica, Kirstie, Nick and a possible Naomi (pending the train situation) down, but don't think I have email addresses for you all, so will just share the call link & agenda here morning-of. Will try do some Twittering to get the word out too - hope a few others can join us! Spread the word if you can :)
Awesome! Thank you for organising Zoe! See you all online this evening (my time 😉)
Kirstie wrote: "Awesome! Thank you for organising Zoe! See you all online this evening (my time 😉)"
Tomorrow evening, you mean? (Frantically checking I did say Sunday and that today is actually Saturday and I didn't accidentally time warp...)
Tomorrow evening, you mean? (Frantically checking I did say Sunday and that today is actually Saturday and I didn't accidentally time warp...)
Tomorrow evening!! Sorry - yes - Sunday! 😬😬 I knew that!
Hey folks! I think we might have a daylight savings problem!! 2pm Eastern Summer Time is 6pm UTC (Europe haven’t changed their clocks yet!)What shall we go for 14 EDT / 18 UTC or 15 EDT / 19 UTC?
I’m on a long car ride and we’ve been slowed by snow (!!) so I’ll be joining from my phone in the car either way!
Maybe comment below to say you’ve seen this message so we don’t get too confused ❤️
Ooooh! Right you are, Kirstie! Damn. Sorry I didn't catch that. I'm ok with either time, so hopefully others will chime in with a preference (wish there was tagging on this thing). I guess later is better than earlier so people don't miss it? I could be on at 2pm ET to let anyone know who's there early. Although I only said 2pm ET in most recent tweeting... Ackh, I don't know.
Awaiting that, I've put together a light agenda with the link to join the call at the top.
Awaiting that, I've put together a light agenda with the link to join the call at the top.
Either time works for me!
Ok, feels like we should make a call. I'm leaning towards going ahead at 2pm ET - most people who RSVP'ed on the Doodle poll are NA-based and I can shoot Naomi a message to make sure she's seen the change. Kirstie / Nick do you have an opinion?
Totally agree with making a call - 2pm eastern, lets do it!
I think I have misplaced the call link. Help?
Thanks again to everyone who came out! Notes are in the agenda for anyone who wants to recap, and please continue the discussion here if you have more questions or thoughts, whether you could make the call or not.
Naomi suggested the host put together a summary after each call, so here are a few takeaways:
- All of us found it a bit of a struggle to read, especially the first half. It was quite dense & academic, but got more into narrative later and got more interesting. We talked about the context of it perhaps being one of the earlier written examples in the subset of books on tech & social justice, and that it's an academic monograph, likely important to author for tenure etc. Some similar books are maybe a bit more compelling, and the combo of Weapons of Math Destruction + Why I'm No Longer Talking to White People About Race was recommended.
- We discussed the implications for those working in library & information sciences and the practical question of what can be done in the face of these issues - figuring out what role librarians can have to help people navigate information structures, how to have conversations and ask question that allow people to figure things out for themselves, rather than just giving them information etc.
- One of the intersections with open: we talked about the examples in the book of how things like in the Library of Congress Classification have changed their classifications in response to evolving societal attitudes (and a lot of advocacy) and how that might be applied to the definition of 'open' as the values/goals of the movement evolve over time.
- Talked about how search engines are only ever pulling from an incomplete set of data, because people choose not to put things online, some info not compatible with the format/media etc. So, how might search engines be more transparent about this, and about how they reach the conclusions they do? E.g. surface more of how they reached a particular set of results.
- One more (just because I find it really interesting!): In the book, there's a mention of the printing press as the trigger for the need for classification systems that have led us to where we are now in lots of ways & the author argues search engine indexing etc. is the new version of this kind of classification. We're faced with a radical increase in the amount of information available, the likes of which we haven't seen since the invention of the press, and so are looking desperately for tools to help us navigate that mass. But the tools are being developed primarily by and for commercial entities, with little regard for the societal impact of the systems & structures they are creating, which is ever-so-slightly terrifying. It's difficult to think how we might influence things in another direction, but creating & supporting alternative models and helping people to develop critical perspectives on these tools is so important, because what we do now will have an impact for potentially hundreds of years to come. So... no pressure?
Ok, that's just a few things that have stuck with me from the conversation. Read the full notes if you're interested, and if others on the call have other highlights they want to surface, please do!
Ashley has offered to host next time (if timing works), and if you have book suggestions, please add them to the group bookshelf. We'll get a poll up & set a date for the next call soon. Looking forward to it :)
Naomi suggested the host put together a summary after each call, so here are a few takeaways:
- All of us found it a bit of a struggle to read, especially the first half. It was quite dense & academic, but got more into narrative later and got more interesting. We talked about the context of it perhaps being one of the earlier written examples in the subset of books on tech & social justice, and that it's an academic monograph, likely important to author for tenure etc. Some similar books are maybe a bit more compelling, and the combo of Weapons of Math Destruction + Why I'm No Longer Talking to White People About Race was recommended.
- We discussed the implications for those working in library & information sciences and the practical question of what can be done in the face of these issues - figuring out what role librarians can have to help people navigate information structures, how to have conversations and ask question that allow people to figure things out for themselves, rather than just giving them information etc.
- One of the intersections with open: we talked about the examples in the book of how things like in the Library of Congress Classification have changed their classifications in response to evolving societal attitudes (and a lot of advocacy) and how that might be applied to the definition of 'open' as the values/goals of the movement evolve over time.
- Talked about how search engines are only ever pulling from an incomplete set of data, because people choose not to put things online, some info not compatible with the format/media etc. So, how might search engines be more transparent about this, and about how they reach the conclusions they do? E.g. surface more of how they reached a particular set of results.
- One more (just because I find it really interesting!): In the book, there's a mention of the printing press as the trigger for the need for classification systems that have led us to where we are now in lots of ways & the author argues search engine indexing etc. is the new version of this kind of classification. We're faced with a radical increase in the amount of information available, the likes of which we haven't seen since the invention of the press, and so are looking desperately for tools to help us navigate that mass. But the tools are being developed primarily by and for commercial entities, with little regard for the societal impact of the systems & structures they are creating, which is ever-so-slightly terrifying. It's difficult to think how we might influence things in another direction, but creating & supporting alternative models and helping people to develop critical perspectives on these tools is so important, because what we do now will have an impact for potentially hundreds of years to come. So... no pressure?
Ok, that's just a few things that have stuck with me from the conversation. Read the full notes if you're interested, and if others on the call have other highlights they want to surface, please do!
Ashley has offered to host next time (if timing works), and if you have book suggestions, please add them to the group bookshelf. We'll get a poll up & set a date for the next call soon. Looking forward to it :)
Thanks so much for the update - great to read this especially after missing the call! Looking forward to the next one...
In the meantime, please keep reading and reflecting on Blueprint, there's so much more to discuss and digest!