Victorians! discussion

We come to the final week of our discussion of Agnes Grey.

In this segment we see that Agnes faces a major loss in her life with her father’s death. They have to vacate the parsonage and live elsewhere now. Agnes grieves the loss of her father. She also grieves for having to leave the parsonage where she grew up and which is filled with fond childhood memories.

Having loss the income with the father’s death, Agnes’s mother is determined to make her own living without being dependent on her elder daughter, Mary and her husband. She decides to open up a school and Agnes decides to help her mother. This will be a new chapter in Agnes’s life. What are your thoughts about this new school? I think Anne will be better skilled and happy as a teacher than as a governess. Do you agree?

Agnes gives notice to quit Horton Lodge. Here she goes through another grief – that is the parting with Mr. Weston. Agnes finally admits she loves him (we readers knew this for some time now, didn’t we?). Agnes is not certain of Mr. Weston’s feelings for her, although he seems kind and attentive to her. At their parting Mr. Weston states that they may meet again someday and wishes to know if Agnes will be pleased at the prospect. Agnes answers in the affirmative. What do you infer from this? Does Mr. Weston entertain hopes on Agnes and wishes to know how she feels in return or does he merely being friendly?

Agnes and her mother start on the school and doing tolerably well. Meanwhile Agnes’s thoughts dwell on Mr. Weston. She does not hear from him nor meet him. As time passes, Agnes feels that her hopes are being crushed. She pines away which makes her mother worry. Agnes even wishes for the end of her suffering but collects herself as she reproaches her of being selfish. This is a different side of Agnes. What were your thoughts? Were you surprised?

We meet Lady Ashby (Rosalie Murray) again. She invites Agnes for a visit. It seems even after her marriage and birth of her daughter, she hasn’t made much progress. She still wishes to be the center of admiration and a shameless coquette. She claims her husband is a drunk and a controlling brute, which seems true. However, she failed to raise any sympathy in me. Such fate was brought about with her consent. What do you think?

Agnes is in for a surprise. When she is reconciled to the idea that she will never see Mr. Weston again, whom does she meet? Mr. Weston! He has taken the living of a nearby parsonage from her new place of abode. Agnes learns that Mr. Weston’s failed attempts to locate her school. This information renews her blighted hopes. Mr. Weston expresses his wish to acquaint with her mother to which Agnes assents. He visits them and slowly becomes a frequent visitor. And then one fine summer day he proposes and she accepts ending the long agonized wait and promising an earthly happiness and fulfillment. I was really happy for Agnes. After her long trials, she deserved to be happy.

With this segment we reach the end of Agnes’s story. I really enjoyed her story. Did you? What were your thoughts on the whole?

The author’s portrayal of Agnes’s love for Mr. Weston and its effect on her life and behavior were very well done and realistic, in my opinion. Agnes acts just like a despondent teenager in love constantly replaying conversations in her mind, hoping against hope that every knock or every letter has brought Mr. Weston to her. Generally mooning about and being depressed.

I had no sympathy for Rosalie either. She did make a conscious choice to marry Thomas, but unfortunately for her she was unable to manipulate the situation to her advantage. She certainly remains totally selfish and self centered, unwilling to take any of Agnes’s advice on how to try to make her marriage and life better. It might actually involve some effort on her part which we know she’s never been willing to make, unless it would be to make her the object of adoration in the eyes of a man she’s targeted. Poetic justice in that now Rosalie is at the beck and call of her mother-in-law just as Agnes had been at Horton Lodge. The saddest thing to me was Rosalie’s jealousy of her baby daughter in perhaps being able to enjoy life more as a young lady than Rosalie has been. If Rosalie’s time as social butterfly and heartbreaker has been cut short, why should she help her daughter in this regard?

The social inequality between men and women was certainly highlighted by Rosalie detailing Thomas’s lifestyle of drinking, gambling and women whereas she had been hurried to the country and away from any dishonorable behavior she might pursue with other men.

I don’t think the novel could have ended any other way than with the happy marriage of Agnes and Mr. Weston. He certainly provided all the hints of his feelings for Agnes, limited by the social rules of the time. The kind, religious and dutiful win out in the end in this novel.

I enjoyed the second half of this novel more the first. The second half seemed more like Austen with its characters and their interactions.

Renee wrote: "I enjoyed the second half of this novel more the first. The second half seemed more like Austen with its characters and their interactions."

I too enjoyed the second half more, Renee. Yes, there is an Austenian touch in that part. Anne's writing does seem to run back to Regency period with its lightness and the simply beauty of the language. Unlike her sisters, the gravity of Victorian writing is absent in her work. Yet, her subjects are truly drawn from the Victorian time.

Linda wrote: "The author’s portrayal of Agnes’s love for Mr. Weston and its effect on her life and behavior were very well done and realistic, in my opinion. Agnes acts just like a despondent teenager in love co..."

I agree Linda. Agnes's behaviour is just like that of a school girl in love. It showed a very immature side of her. She is young anyway, but I felt a maturity of her beyond her age till this side of hers was opened up.

Agnes's behaviour was realistic for me too. Her mental and physical declining made her feel sorry for her. But Agnes was destined to meet Weston! And I'm very happy that her love story was finally realized.

Linda wrote: "I had no sympathy for Rosalie either. She did make a conscious choice to marry Thomas, but unfortunately for her she was unable to manipulate the situation to her advantage. She certainly remains totally selfish and self centered, unwilling to take any of Agnes’s advice on how to try to make her marriage and life better. It might actually involve some effort on her part which we know she’s never been willing to make, unless it would be to make her the object of adoration in the eyes of a man she’s targeted. Poetic justice in that now Rosalie is at the beck and call of her mother-in-law just as Agnes had been at Horton Lodge. The saddest thing to me was Rosalie’s jealousy of her baby daughter in perhaps being able to enjoy life more as a young lady than Rosalie has been...."

Rosalie's character was formed in such a manner that no advice of Agnes can make her see reason. She is nurtured from vanity and self indulgence and she is ill suited for a married life.

I was appalled by her attitude towards her own daughter. Perhaps I shouldn't be surprised given her character. But I was hoping that her experience would make her want to protect and cherish her child and to bring her up better than her own upbringing.

Linda wrote: "The social inequality between men and women was certainly highlighted by Rosalie detailing Thomas’s lifestyle of drinking, gambling and women whereas she had been hurried to the country and away from any dishonorable behavior she might pursue with other men. ..."

Anne does expose the hypocrisy of the upper class married lives. Many men of that class had mistresses. Some of them gambled and some drank heavily. While this was accepted by the society, the women were expected tolerate everything, lead a virtuous life and bring up the children of their good for nothing husband's children.

The position of Rosalie cannot be pitied for her conduct of meeting with Harry Meltham and encouraging him and her flirtations with other men was quite shocking and very unbecoming of a married woman. But all the well brought up, virtuous women who expected all the care, love and protection from their husbands ended up enduring painful marriages due to their husbands debauchery. Anne seems to have very much resented this inequality.

Lucia wrote: "Just finished reading Agnes Grey!
First of all, I would like to thank Piyangie for having led the discussion and for her enthusiastic comments. Sorry, I did not contribute to the exch..."

Thank you, Lucia. It was a pleasure to lead the discussion. And it was a pleasing read too.

I agree with you however that the middle part was bit slow and somewhat boring after the enthusiastic start. And yes, the last few chapters pick up the story again.

As you have said what I liked best too is Anne's writing. There is some simple but enchanting beauty in it.

I'm happy you enjoyed your read Lucia. Anne was an overlooked author in my opinion. So anyone enjoying her makes me happy. :)

Finished this yesterday, and though it was easy to read, I found it not so exciting. The second half was better though.

I don´t necessarily think Agnes would be a better teacher than governess, as teaching also implies pedagogical qualities which she only possesses in a small degree.

Concerning Mr. Weston she behaves like someone the first time in love, also thinking of the beloved one, and becoming depressed when she doesn´t see him.

I pity Rosalie with this husband, but on the other hand she´s not ready to take Agnes´ advice. She even hates her daughter.

I was glad to see a happy ending for Agnes, which I hadn´t expected, and which was rare at these times, there being much more women than men in England (and part of the men away).

So Anne showed the sad possibility for unmarried women, and got Agnes what she herself couldn´t accomplish (also because of her early death).

Thanks Pyangie for leading, and responding even though I´m late in reading this!

Michaela wrote: "Finished this yesterday, and though it was easy to read, I found it not so exciting. The second half was better though.

I don´t necessarily think Agnes would be a better teacher than governess, as..."

You are welcome, Michaela. I understand your sentiments. Yes, it is not very exciting. The book, I believe, is valued more for its powerful message of the position of poor and unmarried women; their hardships to make a living. The second part of the book is better in terms of the story with its romantic element. Overall I hope you had a pleasant read.

Have you read her other published work - The Tenant of Wildfell Hall? Comparatively, it is the better of the two (I'm a bit partial here because Anne is my favourite Bronte). I think you will find it more exciting.

Yes, Piyangie, I read The Tenant of Wildfell Hall, and also liked it better than Agnes Grey. :)