Robert E. Howard Readers discussion

For whoever has something to add or wants to talk about, but today my article "'Black Canaan' vs. 'Black Cunjer'" was published, looking at the context of Howard's story in the pages of WEIRD TALES: https://onanunderwood5.blogspot.com/2...

Bobby, I thought that was an excellent article. "Black Canaan" is one of my all-time favorite REH stories. It captivated me when I first read it, and is one of the ones I go back to time and again. I get it is about racist people, but I don't get how that shows REH as any more or less racist than any other Texan of his time. Anyway, I love that story. I saw the link all over FB, of course, and I had no less than three friends message me the link because they know it's one of my favorite stories.

Loved the article. Thanks for writing it.

I agree with Vincent, but didn't know how to put it as well. REH was writing for the times & the audience. He did it well. I've always found it one of the most memorable of his stories.

Awesome article. Black Canaan was one of the more horrific REH tales. It was scarier than Pigeons from Hell for me. The way he mixed the supernatural with racial tensions and the fear of the uprising was spot on. I think it was the swamp dwellers that gave me the creeps!
In reading the new Post Oaks and Sand Roughs and other Autobiographical Stories I get the feeling that REH felt more racial animosity towards Mexicans and Jews and that in his own life he had little contact with blacks other than the stories told to him about the deep south that inspired him to write Pigeons from Hell and Black Canaan. The character Kirby in the story seems more enlightened than the other whites but Kirby was pretty unnerved by the mysterious sensual black girl, Bride of Damballah, that he meets in the woods. She does not speak in the dialect of the other blacks and there seems to be a sexual attraction. As you mention in your article, the topic of miscegenation is touched on and would have been very taboo for that time period. Writers of that period used a lot of stereotypes at times in regards to race like the Yellow Peril from Asians as well as humble blacks serving their white masters, etc and REH may have been guilty of this at times but I believe he fleshed out his characters and created more memorable and sympathetic characters like N'Longa in the Solomon Kane stories. In BC Saul Stark and the Bride of Damballah are much more compelling characters than the redneck white characters. On that thought I will mention that at the recent REH Days I met a middle aged couple. The man was white and his wife was black and she seemed to be having a good time. I got chatting with her for awhile and one observation she made was that there was not much racial diversity in those attending. I laughed. I did see one other black gentleman there who seemed to be very interested in the panel discussions.

I should clarify too that when I say I laughed about not being a racially diverse group, she said it jokingly, and I laughed because she was right. I hope that changes. A lot of people who come to Cross Plains in the heat of June are older fans like myself who want to hear what's going on in REH fandom and a lot of literary and artistic people. The crowds have been getting bigger but I doubt it will become a "Comicon" type crowd anytime soon. Cross Plains is not exactly the "place to go" for most people in the heat of summer. :)

I got the same impression from Post Oaks and Sand Roughs & Other Autobiographical Writings, Michael.

Also, the swamp dwellers were DEFINITELY creepy. I think the whole "put them into the swamp" thing really makes the story work.

I wonder if the racist charge for this story comes from the idea that the blacks are more primitive, and thus closer to primal forces than whites, and that this closeness is horrific to white society. It does play on racial tensions - but I still don't know if that is a reflection of society at that time, just the needs of the characters, or a statement of the author's that racism is appropriate. I am sure there is some systemic racism at work, but I still don't see how this particular story is chosen to support the idea that REH might be overtly racist. As Michael points out, his colored characters are often more fleshed out and memorable than some of the white characters in the same story.

Vincent wrote: "...I wonder if the racist charge for this story comes from the idea that the blacks are more primitive..."

That wasn't an unusual thought at the time. Eugenics was also common among some of the best & brightest. I was reading a biography of Theodore Roosevelt recently & found that Grinnell (founder of the Audubon Society, editor of Forest & Stream), Madison Grant, & several others felt that way. They were, along with the Colonel, members of the Boone & Crockett Club & were very instrumental in conservationism, putting hunting rules into place, starting the Bronx Zoo, & all sorts of great things. Several wrote some pretty rough stuff about the various races, though.

I just read a bio of John L Sullivan who REH loved as a hero. He was Irish and the first great heavy weight boxing champion of the world. He refused to fight black fighters although "Gentleman Jim" Corbett fought a black heavy weight from Australia named Peter Jackson to a draw a couple of years before knocking out John L. Of course John L was not really in the best shape for that fight. John L said he liked Jack Johnson but felt that white and black fighters should not compete. Then I think about REHs very sympathetic character, the boxer Ace Jessel and note that Howard was not so stuck in the racist mode that he is accused of.

Michael,

Speaking (writing) of Irish and African boxers, in 1923 a County Clare man by the name of Mike McTigue fought a championship bout with a fighter from Senegal named "The Battling Siki". The match was covered with controversy, mainly because it was fought in Ireland, on Saint Patrick' Day, during the time of the Irish Civil War. McTigue was born and raised in Kilnamona, but he emigrated from Ireland to New York when he was 21-years-old. Battling Siki was the world's first black world champion boxer. In any event, the bout went 20 rounds before McTigue won on points. About the time this fight occurred, R.E.H. would've recently turned 17. I don't doubt that he was aware of it. For all of that, I don't recall Howard mentioning this bout in any of his letters. Anyway, it's an interesting piece of history, made more so by the two colorful combatants who took the center stage - Mike McTigue and "The Battling Siki". You can actually view an old, grainy, black and white video of this fight on YouTube.

Ó Ruairc wrote: "Michael,

Speaking (writing) of Irish and African boxers, in 1923 a County Clare man by the name of Mike McTigue fought a championship bout with a fighter from Senegal named "The Battling Siki". Th..."

I checked it out. I never heard of this fight but the name "Battling Siki" rings a bell.

Black Canaan is a favorite of mine too. Almost all his stories set in this setting are great. I don’t mind the racial stuff myself. Reading sonething about racist characters or even by a racist author doesn’t make me a racist.

That said, I read both versions of BC and was disappointed at how little it differed. Readind REH’s comment about the changes, one would think it’s almost a completely different story. He did exaggerate a lot in his letters.

I think a collection of piney woods/weird westerns type stories would make a great collection. Imagine Black Canaan, Horror From the Mound, Pigeons From Hell, Graveyard Rats, Old Garfield’s Heart, Black Wind Blowing, etc. I think Howard was at his best in this field, as with historical adventure stories (crusaders, El Borak, etc).

I felt the same way about the differences. From REH's words, I thought the two versions would be far more different than they were.

Ha, ha, "rings a bell", that's punny. Well, upon getting his bell rung in the ring in Dublin, "The Battling Siki's" life pretty much spiraled downwards after that. He moved to New York City, became an irascible and belligerent drunkard, and was eventually shot to death by someone whom he undoubtedly pissed off. Anyway, I digress from the discussion on hand, my apologies.