The Evolution of Science Fiction discussion

For the October discussion we'll be going back to the roots. Let's read something written before 1920.

Granted, the choices are more limited. So do pay special attention to the rules below about eligibility. Titles that we voted on last time this era came 'round are mentioned here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/.... But please search the internet for lost items of interest!

Sci-fi novels or collections of short stories that have not previously been read by the group are eligible, so long as we've not read the author too many times already. Please check the bookshelf (https://www.goodreads.com/group/books...) & the nomination rules (https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...) for further clarification before nominating a book.

Please also add your nominated book title as a clickable link directly to the goodreads' book page, with author and year, so it looks like this:

Around the World in Eighty Days
Jules Verne
1873

We'd appreciate it if you tell everyone a bit about why you chose the book that you're nominating, but we don't require that.

Bear in mind, too, that we'll mostly likely be closing this nomination thread on the 15th, in order to have plenty of time for poll(s) and then for acquisitions of the winner(s).

Everything you can do to help the moderators' tasks will help the group flourish, so thank you!

Runaway Skyscraper
The Last Man
Tomorrow's Eve
Jekyll & Hyde
When the World Shook
20K Leagues Under the Sea (try to get the new "adult" translation if you're reading it in English)

Don't forget to check the "What Is This Folder For?" topic in the Pre-1920 folder for the list of authors. It's probably not complete, but it has some ideas. You can find it here:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

It also contains a list of what we've read & when.

Ty Jim!

I'll nominate The Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde by Robert Louis Stevenson (1886). We haven't read it yet & it is an iconic work of proto-SF.

It is free to download in ebook format from Project Gutenberg here:
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/42

There are 5 English versions & 1 Spanish version of the book on Librivox (free audiobooks) here:
https://librivox.org/search?title=hyd...

Tomorrow's Eve by Villiers de L'Isle-Adam, originally published in 1886

I will nominate The Last Man by Mary Wollstonecraft Shelley published in 1826.

I'll nominate The Runaway Skyscraper by Murray Leinster published 1919.

Jules Vernes, "Paris in the Twentieth Century", this work was withheld from publication by Vernes' literary agent due to its less than optimist stance. First written in 1863, it was not published until 1997.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3...

There are several Vernes nominations on here. If choosing one of his works, I would strongly recommend choosing from the new American English translations from the 1990s ("Amazing Journeys: 5 Visionary Classics"). This is because the Jules' English translations we grew up with targeted for the juvenile market not adults.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...

Good to know!
I'll have to defer to Jim to know if Verne is still eligible - I see two by him on our bookshelves but I have trouble untangling this bit of policy.

No problemo!

I can nominate Robert W. Chambers "The King In Yellow" instead.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...

It is set in a subtle alternative history.

Cheryl wrote: "Good to know!
I'll have to defer to Jim to know if Verne is still eligible - I see two by him on our bookshelves but I have trouble untangling this bit of policy."

Verne is OK for one more book. At one point we mistakenly thought we'd read 3 by him, but we've only read 2 books & one short story.

It's not a complicated policy. We're limiting the number of books we read by any author in a period to 3. Some authors dominated some periods & are so well known that we'd read nothing but their books if we didn't.

Gregg wrote: "No problemo!

I can nominate Robert W. Chambers "The King In Yellow" instead ...."

We read that for July in the group Weird fiction. I was discussion leader. There is plenty of time for you to join us over there if you want. Only one story in that collection is very barely SciFi to me, since even the idea that story is set in the future (1920) depends on whether the main character is to be believed (he is not).

Since Verne is eligible, are you keeping your recommendation of "Paris in the 20th century" ? I warn you that it is extremely boring.

I might myself nominate The Mysterious Island, if someone can clarify for me whether it is necessary to first read Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea.

(Limiting authors is not a complicated policy. It's just that I keep stumbling. My own weirdness. Sorry.)

Jim wrote: "I'll nominate The Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde by Robert Louis Stevenson (1886). We haven't read it yet & it is an iconic work of proto-SF.

It is free to do..."

I know we don't "second" in this group, but I'm going to second this one anyway.

Cheryl wrote: "(Limiting authors is not a complicated policy. It's just that I keep stumbling. My own weirdness. Sorry.)"

I looked it back up to make sure I had it right. It's not complicated, but the situation can be. Is it the author 3 times or by period? What's the period? We've done these differently over the years, so it trips my memory up, too.

Ty RJ. I'd second it too, I think, because I read it recently and wouldn't have to reread it... ;)

Ty Jim. Waiting on Gregg to let us know if he truly wants to nom. Paris in 20th, and on Ed's decision. (No reason not to have two Verne nom's in the same poll imo.)

Ed, I like this review that implies there's no need to read other Verne before MI: https://owlcation.com/humanities/the-...

I will not nominate a book this month as I think there are enough interesting choices. But may nominate a Verne story later since I now know it is OK to do so.

ok... still the review of MI on owlcation is kinda interesting

Cheryl wrote: "ok... still the review of [Mysterious Island] on owlcation is kinda interesting"

I agree. I will read it someday.

I'd be interested in reading both Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea & The Mysterious Island again. I haven't read either since I was a teen, probably a young one, at that. Too many years. I always mixed the latter up with Dr. Moreau & some of ERB's lost world novels for some reason. I think I read them all in a row or something.

I'm going to tentatively nominate When the World Shook by H. Rider Haggard as I'm not sure how sf it is.
I came across the book in a list of pre 1920's science fiction. However, just because it's on some random person's list does not mean it really is sf - he usually wrote adventure type novels I believe so this may be more in the 'Indiana Jones' genre.

Anna wrote: "I'm going to tentatively nominate When the World Shook by H. Rider Haggard as I'm not sure how sf it is...."

It doesn't look very SF to me, but it is 'lost world', has teleportation, & a sort of cryo-sleep in it, so I suppose it could be proto-SF. Unfortunately, it hasn't been reviewed on GR, so we can't see what shelves it is on. Here's the Wikipedia entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_th...

It is available for free on Gutenberg.org, so availability isn't an issue.
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/1368

Better link: When the World Shook: Being an Account of the Great Adventure of Bastin, Bickley, and Arbuthnot. I don't trust GR members' shelves, but some do tag it SF.

(I'll see if I can get the editions combined. The other link had the author misspelled and was all wrong.)

Cheryl, I think it is important to nominate "Paris" because it is a "new" Verne novel and a translation in the adult mode and, hence, twice something we have never read or see before. However, if the intent of reading these novels is their historic impact, I would recommend one of the new translations novels instead so we can understand why Verne became a French and adult SF and mainstream creator of our genre. Please advise which follows the intent of the reading philosophy best.

However, I think Jim and Ed are leaning towards "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea", so we could nominate a consensus on reading it in new translation. This would perhaps best reflect the "Evolution of" in the concept.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...

Gregg wrote: "Please advise which follows the intent of the reading philosophy best. ..."

The philosophy, such as it is, is: Nominate whatever YOU want. But hurry!

What Ed said, but you might keep the name of the group in mind as well. IMO, any of Verne's books fit.

I nominate Jules Verne's "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea" in the new translation:

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...

:smiles:
Thanks for working it out guys!

Fantastic! We've got six nominations already, so we're likely to have a good poll!

**Poll is up! With six nominations, odds aren't bad we'll need a runoff, so get your votes and lobbying in! https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...

Gregg, we need clarification on Verne's 20K. As I was clicking around trying to confirm, I got lost.... Can you confirm that Frederick Paul Walter is the translator we should look for? Also can you confirm that this: https://www.amazon.com/Twenty-Thousan... is the paper book, for those of us who prefer not to read ebooks? Can you figure out if it's available elsewhere than Amazon, for those of us who boycott them?

Do you know if any other translations are better than others? I did some preliminary looking and found too much info. Here's a sample of what I found:

"Can't go wrong with FPWalker, but remember that he has three translations, each later one better than the last: a public-domain version in 1991, a 1993 edition published by Naval Institute Press with Walter James Miller (based on the 1991 translation), and one in 2010 in the omnibus Five Visionary Classics.

An often overlooked one is William Butcher's translation by Oxford University Press. This is the one I read, and I highly recommend it. Its footnotes are excellent.

Stay away from Mercier."

Thanks Dan! I still hope to hear from Gregg, but if Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea w/ Mickel is more readily avl. to some readers, I would imagine that to be a fine choice.

Of course, this is all surmise, as the voting has barely begun. :)

It's a tough choice for me. I'd be happy to read '20,000 Leagues' or Leinster's 'Skyscraper', but I nominated 'Dr. Jekyll'. Sigh. "Tomorrow's Eve" seems interesting, too. The last time I tried to read a book by Haggard, I just couldn't get into his style.

I read "Last Man" not too long ago. I won't argue the point, but I don't consider it SF any more than I did "The Road" & I liked it only a little better. Marginal SF at best & way too long. Don't ask me why I consider "Earth Abides" a solidly SF book, though. Well, consistency is the bugaboo of little minds...
;)

The one nominated in this topic - Shelley's.

Cheryl wrote: "**Poll is up! With six nominations, odds aren't bad we'll need a runoff, so get your votes and lobbying in! https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1......"

Amazing Journeys: Five Visionary Classics is the correct translation.

https://www.ebay.com/p/Amazing-Journe...

1875 reprinted illustrations edition appears to be a current translation, too:

https://www.ebay.com/i/143357220514?c...

I do not have an opinion on the Mickel translation. If it is non-juvenile, it should be fine.

I do not have an opinion on the Butcher translation either. Is he English or American? Again, if it is non-juvenile, it should be fine.

Thanks, Gregg!

No problemo!

Before I search for a copy of 20K - are we going for the Mickel, Butcher, or Miller translation? Or is it a personal choice as long as we read a modern translation? (I have an ebook of the original French version, but I'd rather read it in a modern English translation)

Benjamin wrote: "Before I search for a copy of 20K - are we going for the Mickel, Butcher, or Miller translation? Or is it a personal choice as long as we read a modern translation? (I have an ebook of the original..."

I plan to read whatever I can find. It might be interesting to mix it up & see if there are big enough differences to really matter.

Benjamin wrote: "Before I search for a copy of 20K - are we going for the Mickel, Butcher, or Miller translation? Or is it a personal choice as long as we read a modern translation?..."

The poll is still open. It looks like 99% certain that we'll select 20,000 leagues, though. It is a long book, so I'm going to start early.

I'm using Butcher. It seems the most accurate, or at least the one most concerned with accuracy. That doesn't mean it is necessarily the "best" or the "most fun to read". I'll start a thread for discussion of the different versions because that could be interesting to explore but should be kept separate from a discussion of the story itself.

I started the discussion here:
Translations of 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea(s).

Ok, the Verne epic clearly won.
However, it's awfully long. We three, we team of moderators, have decided to offer a second book for those readers who want to participate in a BotM but can't face the door-stopper.
So, come October, you'll have a choice of 20K Leagues, *and/or* the winner of a 'run-off' poll (to be posted momentarily).

https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...

OK, we're doing 2 books in October. The poll was iffy, so command decision for reading The Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde as a secondary read. I plan to read both it & Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea.