Tournament of Books discussion

contest google doc now live! Longlist posted this morning (~7:20am PST), anticipate shortlist to post mid-December. Get your guesses in!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...

Amy wrote: "Placeholder for the link to the contest google doc once longlist is posted, information about the prizes & and discussions about our bets, Faustian deals and threats to the TOB overlords if they do..."

Thank you so much for doing this, Amy! You are wunderbar!

This is going to take some time to come up with some educated guesses here... ;) When will you close the contest?

I’ll see if I can pin Andrew down on an exact shortlist release date, but otherwise I’ll freeze it Dec 15th as close to 6am PsT as possible so the night owls can use every last minute.

Amy wrote: "I’ll see if I can pin Andrew down on an exact shortlist release date, but otherwise I’ll freeze it Dec 15th as close to 6am PsT as possible so the night owls can use every last minute."

Sounds good - thanks!

That was fun, but not easy to narrow this list down to 18. I finished Red at the Bone this past week and am about 20% into both Patsy and Sabrina & Corina and noticed an obvious theme - mothers abandoning their daughters. I decided to use that for my play-in round theme although I don't actually want it to end up that way. I really enjoyed Red at the Bone and I might also love these other two, but their connection definitely stood out. I wonder if they might do short stories for the play-in round, which I also don't want since there are so many great options for those too...

I mis-remembered that there was only one white male author from last year's shortlist and made my predictions based on that (adding Overthrow as my one "white dude" book). It was actually four white male authors last year but I might keep my prediction anyway. Looking forward to the big reveal!

Lauren wrote: "That was fun, but not easy to narrow this list down to 18. I finished Red at the Bone this past week and am about 20% into both Patsy and Sabrina & Corina and noticed an obvious theme - mothers aba..."

This made me LOL. The contortions we go through to try to predict the choices of the ToB!

Alison wrote: "Lauren wrote: "That was fun, but not easy to narrow this list down to 18. I finished Red at the Bone this past week and am about 20% into both Patsy and Sabrina & Corina and noticed an obvious them..."

Ha, seriously! And this was my lazy version of guessing shortlist books. I could have gone through and labeled each book by type of author and themes, grouping them into categories and then choosing one from each category until I got to the 18. Did anyone else go next level like that?

Lauren wrote: "Did anyone else go next level like that? ..."

Hold my beer...

Alison wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Did anyone else go next level like that? ..."

Hold my beer..."

LOL.

I noticed a lot of dead parents in these books and two (Remainder and Death is Hard Work) involve(view spoiler)[road trips and caskets--although one has a body and other doesn't (hide spoiler)]. It was tough to work that into a theme so I went with a more generic "Literal and figurative weight of a dead parent."

I've only read one of the books (the wonderful Lost Children Archive), but it's fun lurking around here ;)

Ann A wrote: "I've only read one of the books (the wonderful Lost Children Archive), but it's fun lurking around here ;)"

You don't have to have read ANY to put in a prediction! Mine are a combination of total guesses and ones that I'm hoping will get picked since I'd like to read them!

Bob wrote: "I noticed a lot of dead parents in these books and two (Remainder and Death is Hard Work) involve[spoilers removed]. It was tough to work that into a theme so I went with a more generic "Literal an..."

I really want Mostly Dead Things to make it, so I went along a similar death-theme. No way to write "books involving bodies of dead things" without sounding like a psychopath. But there ya go!

Bretnie wrote: "Ann A wrote: "I've only read one of the books (the wonderful Lost Children Archive), but it's fun lurking around here ;)"

You don't have to have read ANY to put in a prediction! Mi..."

Ah, I may give it a go then. There are several I WANT to read!

My predictions are in. I am never good at this, but its fun to guess.

Bretnie wrote: "Bob wrote: "I noticed a lot of dead parents in these books and two (Remainder and Death is Hard Work) involve[spoilers removed]. It was tough to work that into a theme so I went with a more generic..."

Death and Immigration seemed to be strong themes in the long list. I think you're onto something with your theme. My short list was nothing but pure guesswork.

I entered my guesses (truly guesses) - and with that I have shifted from avid lurker to timid participant.

anna wrote: "I entered my guesses (truly guesses) - and with that I have shifted from avid lurker to timid participant."

Welcome, Anna!

I don’t believe TOB has passed up the NBA winner yet so it’s a good bet Trust Exercise will be on the shortlist!

Trust exercise generated some really spirited discussion in the summer Tob so I expect it will be on the shortlist! Personally I was not a fan. But I saw its value after reading everyone's comments. That's why I love this!

Amy wrote: "I don’t believe TOB has passed up the NBA winner yet so it’s a good bet Trust Exercise will be on the shortlist!"

I agree that Trust Exercise is a good bet. And I know I'm getting overly nerdy here, but for those interested, I ran the numbers on both the National Book Award and Booker winners making it in to the ToB. (Let me know if I missed something.)

NBA: 12/15 times (ToB excluded the 2005, 2015, and 2018 winners from the tournament the following year.)
Booker: 9/15 times (ToB excluded the 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2014, and 2018 winners from the tournament the following year.)

So, the tournament last year did not include either the National Book Award or Booker winners (awarded in 2018). Interesting, no?

I just put all three winners in the play-in to settle it once and for all. That way they are all represented but only one of them makes the final 16.

Is this contest for some prize?

So, the tournament last year did not include either the National Book Award or Booker winners (awarded in 2018). Interesting, no?"

That doesn't seem right. Milkman won the Booker in 2018 and was in last year's ToB. Lincoln in the Bardo won in 2017 and was in the 2018 ToB.

ah, it is true that The Friend didn't win summer tournament 2018 and subsequently did not make the shortlist.... not a good trend for Trust Exercise.
I wouldn't mind more discussion on Trust Exercise though... while I liked portions of the writing and the story, the total seemed a hot mess. It's definitely stuck with me since the summer.

Jason wrote: "Is this contest for some prize?"

Andrew usually pitches in some TOB swag to the prize winner :) I'm putting the thumbscrews to him now!

Amy wrote: "ah, it is true that The Friend didn't win summer tournament 2018 and subsequently did not make the shortlist.... not a good trend for Trust Exercise.
I wouldn't mind more discussion on Trust Exerc..."

I believe that Trust Exercise will make it on the shortlist. From the Camp TOB info--Which brings us to an additional change, effective this summer: None of our summer reads—or any of the titles in the poll below—will be disqualified automatically from next year’s Tournament of Books. What happens at camp, stays at camp.
I think they put this in because The Friend did not win over the summer last year. Now most of the books on that list were not included in the Longlist only the ones that were on the National Book Award shortlist and Lost Children Archives.

When I revisited my choices this morning I noticed that one of them was missing. Everyone might want to make sure your picks are still there.

Was I supposed to give seed placements for my predictions?

Michelle wrote: "Was I supposed to give seed placements for my predictions?"

I didn't know how that worked either, but it seems to difficult to predict, so I ignored that part.

First time doing the shortlist predictions and since I've only read four of the books (for shame), I just totally winged it, trying to throw in a couple outliers, sure things, and buzzed about. I'll be interested to see how close I am. (I'm guessing not close at all.)

Janet wrote: "When I revisited my choices this morning I noticed that one of them was missing. Everyone might want to make sure your picks are still there."

One of the dangers of a spreadsheet anyone can edit

The shortlist will be out on Monday!

Awesome - thanks for the update!

Ace wrote: "The shortlist will be out on Monday!"

Man--I wish they'd wait till January so I could get to more of the longlist! Once they're out of the running, I lose interest lol

Bob wrote: "Ace wrote: "The shortlist will be out on Monday!"

Man--I wish they'd wait till January so I could get to more of the longlist! Once they're out of the running, I lose interest lol"

I am happier to have it early but agree that there is a sudden loss of interest in the rest of the list!

Looking at the Spreadsheet:

Heather C and Amanda, there are empty cells on your lists so you may want to review prior to Monday.

Agree with Bob and Ace about losing interest in the rest of the list, but at least it will help me focus.

I’ll freeze the doc tonight 10pm EST (sorry I’ve been quiet this last week - no service (!) on vacation . So get your guesses in before then.

No worries about seeding - I have them in there just for kicks... and we won’t really know the seeding until the brackets come out (it’s pretty much up to the tourney team’s discretion). We have two ways of calculating winners: if we have a tie based on overall guesses, the person with the most “dark horse” guesses will take the prize. It wasn’t needed last year though.

eh. make that 11pm EST. as a west coast-er 7pm PST is just too early!

Ace wrote: "Looking at the Spreadsheet:

Heather C and Amanda, there are empty cells on your lists so you may want to review prior to Monday."

Thanks for looking out for me, but I chose only 2 books for the play-in based on the theme.

frozen! now we just bite our nails to see when 'early this week' arrives.

Amy wrote: "frozen! now we just bite our nails to see when 'early this week' arrives."

Oh man, I missed it! For some reason I assumed it was 11pm PST - no idea why. I don’t expect to be included in the contest but wanted to share my guesses still - hope it’s okay!

1. Bangkok Wakes to Rain
2. Black Leopard Red Wolf
3. Ducks, Newburyport
4. A Girl Returned
5. Girl, Woman, Other
6. The Most Fun We Ever Had
7. The Nickel Boys
8. The Night Swimmers
9. Normal People
10. Red at the Bone
11. Queenie
12. Trust Exercise
13. The Old Drift
14. Lost Children Archive
15. Pigs
Play-in theme: immigrant stories:
16. On Earth We’re Briefly Gorgeous
17. Let’s Tell this Story Properly
18. Sabrina and Corina

Katie, I’ll toss you in there since the list hasn’t posted yet! - I wanted to make sure we had a clear timeline so we beat Andrew posting this week (last year he surprised us by posting early).

I really desperately hope they post the list today. I'm almost done with my book and will need a new one tonight!

It’s up!

I love it! I want to talk about every single book on here that I have read, and I am excited to read the ones I haven’t!

Link? It hasn't pushed to my Inbox.

https://themorningnews.org/article/th...