The Leftovers discussion

Tim O'Brien shifts between first and third person, as well as the past vs the present (aka the time of writing) as the chapters change. What might he be trying to accomplish in doing this? Do you find it confusing or annoying as a reader to be suddenly thrown into a whole different setting, even if it is only for a few pages?

I think the purpose of the constant changing of the time period is done to show how even through time, the psychological burdens of the war are still present. This is shown by O'Brien displaying Jim many years after the war still having sorrow and regret from the death of Ted Lavender. Personally I found it rather easy to follow because of words such as many years later.

I agree with Thomas on it's purpose. Although the war was in the past, it still has a huge impact on them. Although I don't find it confusing when it switches POV, it is somewhat odd. I feel as though Cross' story line could have been told in the first person point of view and still be effective. I wonder why the author felt that telling Cross' story in the third person point of view would be best. It could be that he didn't want to completely focus on Cross, but he is the main focus (at least in chapter one).

O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while reminiscing 20 years later as a writer, he mentions lessons he's learned as well as other things he took away from his time in Vietnam. In any case, I personally found it a bit odd at first and thought that it suddenly disrupted the scenery, but in hindsight, O'Brien's apparent motive behind it makes it make sense.

My interpretation of the way that O'Brien writes is that he is trying to covey a flashback of his memories of the Vietnam War. Additionally, I see the changing perspectives as his comrades he has talked to for the novel we are reading now. This is evident when O'Brien meets with Lieutenant Cross after the war. They talk about how Cross felt when Lavender died along with discussing Cross' love for Martha stating that he was completely rejected but "Nothing had changed. He still loved her "(O'Brien 27)

Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while reminiscing ..."
Alec, I do not agree with you on how these time skips make sense. In my opinion, this plot would have flowed better if there were long periods of time in Vietnam and then transitioning into the time after the war. It just doesn't speak to me. What do you think and if anyone else agrees, how could the novel flow better?

Thomas wrote: "I think the purpose of the constant changing of the time period is done to show how even through time, the psychological burdens of the war are still present. This is shown by O'Brien displaying Ji..."

Wow, Thomas that is an astute observation! Also I think the POV matches the perspective he is trying to show (remembering vs. presently experiencing)

Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while reminiscing ..."

100% linking the connection between past/present is essential to his theme

June wrote: "My interpretation of the way that O'Brien writes is that he is trying to covey a flashback of his memories of the Vietnam War. Additionally, I see the changing perspectives as his comrades he has t..."

Flashbacks are a common symptom for those who suffer PTSD

What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, what is his style -what is his "go to" device/technique?

June wrote: "Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while..."
June, I agree. As I have read more of the book, O'Brien's writing style has been bothering me increasingly. I was expecting every chapter to alternate from third person to first person point of view, so I was thrown off when I started reading the third chapter.

Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, what is his style -what is hi..."

I have noticed that O'Brien uses the phrase "The things they carried" a lot. Way too much. The first chapter was actually extremely annoying to read because every paragraph was about how heavy their items were. I think that the author was trying to emphasize the physical burden this war put on the soldiers by showing how heavy every item was, but it became way too repetitive. It lost it's effect when I went from thinking 'wow they must be very strong in order to carry all of those items' to 'okay I get it. The stuff is heavy. Can we move on?'

June wrote: "Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while..."

I definitely agree with you on the notion that it could've been done better. The general motive for the time shifts still appears more than logical to me, however spreading out the shifts more would definitely have minimized the downsides of the technique in general.

Alec wrote: "June wrote: "Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For in..."
Initially I liked the constant change in perspective from past to present because I saw it as a clever way to show the lasting emotional affects from the war. However, as I have gotten farther in the book I agree with you and think that the transitions should be a little bit more spread out.

June wrote: "My interpretation of the way that O'Brien writes is that he is trying to covey a flashback of his memories of the Vietnam War. Additionally, I see the changing perspectives as his comrades he has t..."

Your interpretation seems exactly right. Further, I think O'Brien was aiming to juxtapose how different it was being at war vs back home with the things that remained constant throughout, such as Cross' love for Martha.

Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, what is his style -what is hi..."
One point definitely sticks out: it's what these soldiers carried in their campaign in Vietnam and even into the present day in the novel. This is evident in Lieutenant Cross' love for Martha and O'Brien's painful story of almost running away to Canada after being drafted to fight in the Vietnam War.

June wrote: "Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, what is his st..."

Hey June. I agree. The part where O'Brien was at the Tip Top Lodge was such an emotional and pivotal point for his character. It seemed as if he was losing his sanity, and the only way he could get a grasp on reality was by removing himself from the rest of society. O'Brien crying on the boat while Elroy pretended not to notice was deep because Elroy knew that O'Brien's pain was so personal and intense that Elroy had no business comforting him. He had to just give this stranger space to grow.

Michael wrote: "June wrote: "Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, w..."

Michael wrote: "June wrote: "Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, w..."

Michael, I agree with your statements that staying at Tip Top Lodge was a pivotal moment for O'Brien, Even to the reader, it's so evident how strong this moment is. I also want to include that what he learns from his is that he will have to carry on, even if he does not want to. I believe that this is the mindset of many soldiers, including O'Brien, that they will carry on, even if the going gets tough.

Michael wrote: "June wrote: "Brigid wrote: "What else about O'Brien's writing seems prevalent in these beginning paragraphs? Besides switching POV --- what else (regarding his writing) is on every page? That is, w..."

I agree with your perspective on the lodge and the effect it had on O'Brien. The time that he spent had a major impact on his character and this is very clear as shown by the amount of detail that he was able to give about the lodge and the time on the boat with O'Brien even able to say the same thoughts he had on that day. He even went as far as writing how he was thinking swim to freedom, "I could have jumped and started swimming for my life.. I felt a terrible squeezing pressure...I can still feel that tightness.(54)". This is important because it shows he still feels that feeling and carries it.

June wrote: "Alec wrote: "O'Brien's shifting of time period and perspective appears to me as a sort of attempt to connect different facets of the narrator's life back to his time in the war. For instance, while..."
I disagree, I found that for the most part the transitions were quite easy to see as they were commonly in separate chapters and the ones that were blended in had words in the past tense making them sort of easy to see. Perhaps he could have only changed the time and perspective in separate chapters and not blend them into the text regularly to make it more clear, but I still feel that it was not bad to follow.

Great effect from the sort of black-and-white nature of this thread (time change good vs bad). It was rather fun going back and forth about it and all claims on the matter were well substantiated, though not with textual evd seeing as this thread didn't really call for it. We got off to a great start with this one.