Support for Indie Authors discussion

Introduction:

The world of writing is a complex and caveat riddled landscape, and although there is much to do once you've written the manuscript, today we'll briefly cover some things that worked for me while I was trying to get much work up to standard.

To say I spent a lot of time working on my manuscript would be an understatement, although it may surprise you to hear that most of the resources went towards learning and perfecting my craft. Along the way, I have discovered pieces of wisdom that I'm happy to share, and I'll go into detail about what I learned in this post.

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Sit at your desk, and write:

Some days you'll be working on your manuscript and the words and ideas will flow out of your mind and onto the page without any effort. Other days, you'll be fighting against yourself to stay focused amidst a sea of distractions and intrusive thoughts. On these challenging days, you may say to yourself that you're not ready to start, or it's too much work and you’re not up for such a mammoth task.

On the tough days, even if your progress is slow, if you do decide to stick with it you'll look back on it and be glad that you forced yourself to work. Even if you learned a thing or two, or got a few pages done, it's a net win. You won't be able to get everything done in a single writing session, but if writing is your goal, then any work towards learning or developmental work is progress. But you need some building blocks to start with, and if you delay the challenging days you're only putting yourself further away from your goal.

You could spend the day researching story content, finding out what to do once you've published your work, or anything in between, but it's critical to win the battle with your neuroses and make sure you sit and work, even if that means struggling with your inner doubts and nay-saying.

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​Give yourself time to learn, and lean on your family and friends for help:

The chances of you finishing your manuscript and looking back on it without finding any faults are impossible, and that's a good thing. If you were to do so, the chances of learning would be slim, and you want to get your skills and work ethic as great as they can possibly be out of your first experience.
Once you're completely satisfied with what you've produced, spread a chapter or two around to your friends and family, and ask for feedback on how it all fits together. Spelling and grammar is one thing, but if there are any fatal flaws in your style this is the time to help construct it into something solid. Things like overused words, pacing issues and confusing sentences are easy wins to learn about. Every author will have their own strengths and weaknesses, and this process will give some easy insights into yours.

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​When you ask for feedback, be humble:

It's a precarious thing to speak to someone about their work. If you have someone close to you who's willing to read your novel in progress, and provide feedback, then this is a precious channel for improvement, and you should keep a few things in mind when discussing this.

Take what the person is sharing internally, and jot it down for review later. Don't interrupt them, and don't try to change their mind about what they're sharing with you. It takes courage to be honest, and you need to be careful not to taint this unique method of learning. After all, do you really want them to hold back when they're sharing their feelings with you?

One other thing to remember is that your opinion counts too. If someone says they don't like a section, but you feel differently, it's okay to want to retain it if you have a good reason. However, If multiple people bring up the same concept, then it might be worth revisiting.

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Persistence is paramount:

At the end of the day, you want to make sure that you spend time on simply being a writer. You can set your own hours and schedule, but the more you put in now, the more you'll get out of it later. To hear your friends and family talk about your story is one of the best feelings out there for an entertainer, which let's be honest, is what you're trying to ultimately do.

Every day you procrastinate puts the day of completion further away, so get stuck into it as soon as you can, and know that there’ll be good days and bad days. It’ll teach you about yourself; It’ll help you learn what to look for when crafting a story or a character, and the process will shed light on which areas you struggle with. There’s a community of people waiting to help answer your questions and build from your weaknesses, and the amount of videos and blogs on the internet is staggering. All you need to do is seek it out!
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Closing thoughts:

There are countless more tips and tricks out there for new writers, and I'll no doubt revisit this subject down the line to get into more insights I've learned along the way.

Thank you, as always, for your precious time.

Wonderful advice for everyone from beginner to expert. If you don't treat this like it's important, it then becomes a hobby. With a hobby, there is no need to finish because you do hobbies when you can or want.

90% of the people who say they want to be a writer will never write a completed manuscript. Of those that do, most will throw it in a drawer/file and never look at it again.

Of those who want to publish, 90% of your work is jut beginning. Editing is a long tedious, arduous journey in taking that pile if s**t and making it into something readable. This is where what you don't know can make readers dislike your book.

Yes, you may have a decent story. Yes you can publish it. Yes, you can get people to read it. But to have that wonderful, exciting, best seller, you need to have a great story, with characters that standout in a manuscript that has been edited beyond that first draft. No, it may not be the best work on the market but if you know how to market that manuscript whether you go traditional of self-publishing, and that story draws in the readers, you have a winner..

You make some good points. I have one quibble, though, and a point I think should be added.

Once you're completely satisfied with what you've produced, spread a chapter or two around to your friends and family, and ask for feedback on how it all fits together.

Relatives and friends can hear your voice telling them the story when they read, but the reader can’t. So friends and relatives aren’t getting the same story as the stranger who picks it up. Plus, their relationship with you prompts them not to say things that may hurt you. Added to that, in the words of Sol Stein: “Readers don’t notice point-of-view errors. They simply sense that the writing is bad.” So while they might say the story didn’t grab them, they are not going to tell you what didn’t work because they can’t.

I favor the advice Ben Bova gave my son: “If you want to know how you’re doing, give the writing to someone who doesn’t like you. If you can make them say they like it you may have something.”

Sit at your desk, and write:

Good advice. Persistence is necessary. But you’ve left out a problem hopeful writers face, which is the misunderstanding we all leave our school years with: We think we learned to write. And since the profession is called Fiction-Writing, it’s reasonable to assume that the common word between the skill we were given and the profession implies a close connection.

Unfortunately, while we learned one approach to writing, professions are acquired in addition to the traditional Three R’s we’re given in our school days. And Fiction-Writing is a profession—not an easy one to master, at that.

Think of the ratio of reports and essays you were assigned to the number of stories. That will tell you the thrust of the writing education we were given. And that makes sense, because our teachers were giving us a set of general skills that employers find useful, not the professional skills of any specialty.

Did any of your teachers, for example, spend meaningful time on the niceties of dialog, and tag usage? Did even one teacher mention why a scene usually ends with disaster for the protagonist on the page—and should?

If you’re like most who turn to writing fiction, the answer is no, because it’s professional knowledge that only fiction writers need. Employers need writing that informs, clearly and concisely. So that’s what we’re given. But the approach to nonfiction is author-centric and fact-based. We tell the reader what they need to know.

But fiction’s goal is very different. Our readers seek an emotional experience. They want us to make them feel as if they’re living the story, as the protagonist, in real-time. They’re not looking to nod and say, “I see.” They want you to make them sag back in their chair and say, “Oh hell…what do we do now?”

The thing we all forget is that professions are learned in addition to the traditional Three R’s. So the elements of writing fiction—the tools of the profession—are not given us in our school days. But since we all know we learned to write, and all suffer that misunderstanding I mentioned, pretty much every hopeful writer starts out believing that people who are meant to be writers have great stories “come to them,” and need only a bit of practice, and some luck, to write successfully.

If only…. To quote James Scott Bell, from his book, Plot & Structure:
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I would read short stories and novels, and wonder how the writers did it. How did they get all this great story material? The Big Lie said they had it in their heads, naturally, and it just flowed out on the page as they went along.

I tried it. I tried to let plot flow. But what came out on the page was dreadful. No plot! No story! Zip!

But when I began to learn about the craft, I saw that plotting had elements I could learn. And I found out about structure: when plot elements were put in a certain order, a stronger story resulted.

I can still remember the day it came together for me. It was an epiphany. All of a sudden, something clicked in my head. The pieces started to fit. The Jell-O hardened.

About a year later, I had a screenplay optioned. Then another.

Then I wrote a novel. It was published.

Then I got a five-book fiction contract. I wrote those books, and they were published, too.

Suddenly, I took a deep breath and looked behind me. Somehow, some way, I had learned how to write after all.

The Big Lie was exposed.

I was so ticked off about the Big Lie that I started teaching others what I’d learned about the craft of writing. I wanted new writers to know that they weren’t doomed to stay where they were. They could learn craft, as I did. I never taught fancy theory, just nuts and bolts. Things that worked for me, that new writers could understand and use right now.

And then a funny thing happened. Some of my students started selling their books.

Good post Joel. Especially the first point: Sit at your desk, and write. This reminder is just what I needed right now.

It's fascinating how much energy can go into squirming, side-tracking, and self-arguing, instead of directing the energy to just writing.

Joel wrote: "On the tough days, even if your progress is slow, if you do decide to stick with it you'll look back on it and be glad that you forced yourself to work."

Please forgive me if I misunderstood this part, but...
You mean I should exert coercion on myself during a tough day and be glad I did because I advanced, like, half inch? It doesn't sound very healthy, does it?

A famous writer said that he waited for the muse to hit him and it was a good thing that it arrived at 9 AM every day. That is the key. You sit down and you write every day.

I'm lucky, writing isn't my problem. I can write at the drop of a pin, but editing it into a readable tome is a whole different can of worms. My goal this year is to learn how to edit that book into something worth reading.

So, yes, even if you only progress a half an inch, writer. Don't worry about what it sounds like, just get it down. Let the characters take you to unknown places. When editing, you can fix it. I had one book that the characters took me to a totally unusual place but it ended up better than my original plan.

Put yourself into the story and write what you would like to read. As I said above, you can fix it all later.

Welcome back Haru. I also remember you and I get it when it comes to editing. A couple of places I've found good help is the Story Grid (It is a good sized book but work the price and time) which helps you to find what isn't working in the book. Margie Lawson who has a ton of inexpensive packets that give you tons of information in editing and techniques that get your work to shine.

I like the Story Grid to get the major problems fixed. (I'm using it on a current WIP and it is time consuming but well worth the effort) For that polishing, Margie's deep editing packet helps a lot. The editing has been my big bug-a-boo so that is my project for this year. Learning how to edit a book into something that works, shines and gets attention.

Nope, does not work for me. I'm an erratic person and work best with an erratic schedule. So one day I put out tons of words and the next, nothing. Life is much sweeter this way. I usually compare myself with Sherlock Holmes, who seemed hyperactive some days and like a slug in a coma the others.

Considering that my cruise speed increased from 4k in a day to 9k, with much better grammar, after a year of serious practice, I think I've found my way.

Thank you for the welcome! And about the editing part, I'll tell you what worked for me. I told myself to come out with a well-made sentence/paragraph whenever I'm writing, the sole exception when it's one of those occasions where I have a waterfall of ideas that need to be put on paper unless I forget them. I took note of my most common mistakes and tried avoiding them on the spot (for me it's word repetition, like "He looked over his shoulder with a serious look on his face while she looked at him"). Ohhhh, I tend to use the words "look" and "feel" all the time. Just with that adjustment, I was writing much better in no time.

I've been reading through many posts and discussions in our group and am feeling completely overwhelmed by my lack of knowledge. I have my very first WIP, done with 5 whole chapters so far, and mikes to go before I sleep. I guess what I should do is keep writing until it's done, use a program like grammarly or Pro writing aid, find a few people to read it, figure out if its worthy enough to be published, and if so, how... is that it in a nutshell? as I stare at a bottle of bourbon, ironic since I don't drink, but thinking I just may start.

Mama Cass wrote: "I've been reading through many posts and discussions in our group and am feeling completely overwhelmed by my lack of knowledge. I have my very first WIP, done with 5 whole chapters so far, and mik..."

It would help if there's a place nearby where you can meet other writers who will give you feedback. Unless family and friends are writers, most of them have very little useful advice to give you. Many/most don't want to upset you, so they'll paper over stuff. A first time writer needs honest, really honest advice. Hard advice. I was fortunate that there's a place nearby me called "The Writers Center" where I could take classes and meet others with the same interest. It's been great.

Thank you for all that information Eileen. I live in a small town, maybe I can find one online.

Yeah, the write every day thing doesn't work for me. I mean, sometimes when I'm in the middle of a WIP and it's going well I do write regularly everyday and often I can get #K or 5K words down in one day at the height of it, but other times I go days without writing writing a word. I go months without writing sometimes. Once I even stopped in the middle of a novel and went almost two whole years without writing (due to real-life stuff that kept me too busy) and then I wrote other things and then I eventually went back and finished that novel.

It's a creative process, so I don't believe it should be forced.

Mama Cass, yes, my advice is to just write it and then shelve it for a few months while you write the next one. When you pick it up again to re-read it, you'll have a bit of distance from it, which will allow you to see its flaws and decide what parts don't work and this will make editing easier.