Underground Knowledge — A discussion group discussion

In my studies of Buddhism, especially lately, I’m noticing many similarities between the stories/mythologies told in both Buddhism and Christianity. What I find fascinating is that Gautama Buddha historically would have existed at least 500 years or more before the supposed birth of Christ, so many of the stories could have been heard through Silk Road by many followers of Jesus who later wrote bible pieces. The story of Devadatta is interesting— Buddha’s cousin, brother in law, and his closest companion was also a secret conspirator who worked closely with those in power to bring down the Buddha-sound familiar? I have to believe that many of the Buddhist traditions,stories and beliefs had to carry over into Christianity.

Thoughts?

Very interesting theory.

No. Go read the Book of Enoch and the Dead Sea Scroll translations and then go read some of the so called "myths" which the Mayans wrote.. and check out the 12,000 Gobekli Temple.. and then there is the Epic of Gilgamish.. there "pre Adamic" Flood stories.. expand your reading material. I also spent a couple years reading D.T Suzuki, Zen Buddhism when i was transitioning from Catholicism to Christianity. Seek and you will find and keep your mind open to God's leading. Good question.

My mind is definitely open and I’ve read/studied a good bit on pre-christianity religions-in fact my undergrad degree is in History with emphasis on Ancient History. I’ve also been lucky enough in that coursework to come across some truly open minded academicians who taught mythology. I’ve also been fortunate enough to learn from many great people and authors on this forum like James and Tony, to name just a few. I’m open to interpretation for sure, but this just stuck out like a sore thumb...also pondering the historicity of both Buddha and Christ(more so Christ than Buddha). The interesting thing for me, as your rightly identified, is the recurrence of certain myths...they are juts repackaged over and over. What anyone chooses to believe is only what a) the grew up believing or b) landed on after research and study. I grew up catholic, my family is still catholic and my wife is catholic-I however find truth in Buddhist teaching, especially since the message is “light your own path”, “if you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him”, etc...it never tries to tell me what’s right and wrong, only offers guideposts. Some I follow, some I don’t.

Anyway, just thought the similarities between Devadatta and Judas were interesting...again, since Buddhism predates Christianity by 500-1000 years I found it fascinating

No B
You are going straight to HELL for leaving the Church and daring to question one of the biggest financial/political institutions on Earth! :)

Hell is not a physical place :-). It's just a synonym for pain I think. Fundamentals in every religion are same, it is just violence and non-violence which separates these religions.
It's completely my opinion and wanted to say somewhere between open minded people.
Please ignore if you don't like this :-).

James,

I needed a good laugh-the pain of eternal damnation and the devil in his red cape await me! Lol love it.

Deepak,
It’s all good man...over here on this forum we likely all agree with your interpretation or something close to it. James was just having a little fun since I talk about this stuff a lot on his forums 😉

I believe that we need to dig a little deeper in the mannerisms in which ideas have flowed in and out of the ancient 'known' world. Buddhism as an Indic school of philosophy was part of the larger shramana movement, directed at reforming the corruptions in Vedic Brahmanism,aka proto Hinduism.
They were espoused in kind by the emergent rulers and empires, and did missionary activities elsewhere. However, the huge vedic influence remained over them due to a common material culture of the Indians. I can illustrate with few examples :
^ 1001 nights, Aesop's fables are nothing but translations of the Panchatantra, text of Indian fables carried away by Buddhists to Egypt and Greece respectively.
^ World's oldest written treaty, between ancient peoples of Hittanites and canaanites mention Mitra, the vedic god of treatises.
^ Similarities b/w Upanishads and the three pittakas, later religious literature of Hinduism and Buddhism respectively. It was the subject of later orientalists such as Max Mueller and Arthur Schopenhauer.
Also I'd like to point out that the exchange was a two way process, with huge Hellenistic influence on Buddhist thought and culture, post Alexander. Hercules to this date is revered as Vajrapani in some Buddhist monasteries in India. That being said, it is equally probable that some stories were indeed Roman or 'Christian' in origins and made it's way into the other.

Aditya:

Excellent points all around! I just recently learned of the Hellenistic influence on Buddhism and vice versa-very interesting! Also to your point about Hercules, Catholics and Christians revere an Indian Saint who is Buddha, only renamed:


https://www.americamagazine.org/faith...

It’s also an interesting parallel between Buddha and Christ that they were reformers of the major religion of their times: For Buddha it was Brahmanism/Hinduism/Asceticism and for Jesus it was Judaism...both were met initially with hate, anger and disdain, but were later adopted by Kings and Princes which spread those philosophies/religions like wild fire. I also believe we don’t really know fully what christianity really was at the beginning-we only have fragments, but it seems from certain literature that I’ve read, it definitely had Hindu and Buddhist elements mixed with Judaism...it’s not what we know of as Christianity now.

It’s also possible that Christianity in its original form was just another “turning of the wheel” of dharma that Buddha often discussed. There are many dharma gates!

There's also an apparent theological speculation about Jesus's lost years being spent in India. Also, the manner in which their theological doctrines were compiled, i.e., various councils under the aegis of an Emperor/warlord were also on the same lines.
Jesus, on the other hand, is similarly much assimilated into the indian culture of ancient Christians, those who willingly embraced after listening to St. Thomas, and not under some sort of medieval inquisitions. Since you are really into this, you will be thrilled to read more about the culture of the ancient Indian Christians of the Malabar, the Syriac/Nasrani Christians. I'll also leave the legends of the Hazratbal shrine,Kashmir for your research appetite.
Research and intellectual interests in this area can actually fill the cultural gap between the so-called east and west and bring us much closer.

Awesome! No doubt-I’ve often said that I believe Gnosticism May be a link between Buddhism and Christianity. I’ve read a little about St Thomas Christians, but oddly enough I can’t find a lot of information on their specific beliefs, only that they still observe Hindu holidays and worship sometimes together. I have read the book Jesus Lived in India and watched a documentary about the same topic-I’m inclined to believe it! Again, I don’t know if Jesus existed, but there appears to be documents at a Kashmir monastery talking about a man named Issa that sounds surprisingly like the Jesus we know.

I just read an awesome “historical” novel called The Gospel of Thomas the Younger written by a Buddhist who posts here sometimes and he does a wonderful job breaking down how Christianity became what it is today instead of what Jesus and his disciples thought it would be...interestingly called The Way in this novel.

If you have suggestions on reading material on Thomasine or Indian Christianity I would be grateful!

I believe Gnosticism may be related to Hindu/Buddhist thought but more likely got the ideas from Platonism. Plato was probably influenced by Indian thought.

Jim:

Good thought! I think they are all intertwined!

I have been educated much about Indian christianity through following magazines and articles of some prominent Anglo indians and through my Christian friends. I'd really like to get more insights about comparative religions from knowledgeable people like you, so can you suggest me some groups here to begin with? I'm kinda new here.
Really sorry for such late response. :(

Jim :
Can you explain a little more on this? Indian influence on Plato is really surprising. I didn't really felt that when I read the republic, though.

I'm basically thinking about the world of forms. Everything that we know is but an imperfect version of something that exists there.

Later Platonists expanded on that world until it resembled something that would be familiar to a Gnostic or Hermetic. At that point, it became a true dualism. The material world became, if not maya, at least distant from the godhead/creator/mind.

You really didn't have dualism in Hellenic thought prior to Alexander. After that it was everywhere in various forms.

There are far too many exact comparisons between ancient Judaism in the West and ancient Hinduism in the East to be a coincidence. Implications and repercussions are huge.

Sanjay:

I agree!

To clarify, I think that Hinduism and Christianity have many similar core concepts: the trinity, “gods” and Saints, attrition through ritual or sacrifice, fasting, etc. since Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism and there was much influence on the silk road during the time of Jesus(who was a Rabbi)-surely he was influenced by Hinduism, Buddhism and other eastern thought when he started preaching about his new way.