Reading the Detectives discussion

Welcome to our June 2020 Group Read - The Sweetness at the Bottom of the Pie by Alan Bradley first published in 2009 and the first in the Flavia de Luce series.

It is June 1950 and a sleepy English village is about to be awakened by the discovery of a dead body in Colonel de Luce's cucumber patch. The police are baffled, and when a dead snipe is deposited on the Colonel's doorstep with a rare stamp impaled on its beak, they are baffled even more. Only the Colonel's daughter, the precocious Flavia -when she's not plotting elaborate revenges against her nasty older sisters in her basement chemical laboratory, that is - has the ingenuity to follow the clues that reveal the victim's identity, and a conspiracy that reached back into the de Luce family's murky past. Flavia and her family are brilliant creations, a darkly playful and wonderfully atmospheric flavour to a plot of delightful ingenuity.

Please do not post spoilers in this thread. Thank you.

Absolutely loved this - anyone else reading/read it? Anybody have a very different view? Looking forward to discussing this with our lovely group members.

I read it a little early as well and also loved it; waiting till June to discuss.

Fair enough, Abigail. I just thought that, as it's the weekend, with lots of us online, it would be worth opening the discussion a couple of days early.

Thanks for opening this up, Susan. I am currently listening to it on Audible and nearly halfway through, after reading the book a few years ago.

I enjoyed it first time but hadn't remembered it all that well. I enjoy the quirkiness of Flavia as a character.

Me too. I can't remember why I never read on, as I enjoyed it so much.

I'll be making a start - I, typically, jumped into the series with later books so am looking forward to starting at the beginning. I just love Flavia, and the elegant writing.

I've read the whole series, love them, and plan to reread this one soon. I was surprised to read in the introduction that Flavia's lab is in the basement. I always pictured a tower-like room.

Yes, I was under the impression it was on the top floor

I haven't read this one, but did read several of the later books until I hit The Dead in Their Vaulted Arches, which I felt devalued the interesting intelligence of Flavia.

I read this one last year and greatly enjoyed it! Didn't think I would at all, especially with the point of view of such a young main character, that preconception lead to the book being unread on my shelves for a long time... Turned out to be a favorite! Didn't go on to read the other books though

About the lab, I agree it was confusing; I'd have to read the book again to be certain it wasn't an error. My first impression was of her going upstairs in one wing of the house and entering a room with tall windows and lots of light, and then late in the book it was mentioned as being in the basement.

I just started this a few minutes ago. I picked up the audio book not long ago when it was on sale through Chirp Books.

I love and have read the entire series- I’ve got the physical book, am on wait list for audiobook from my library. I’m looking forward to rereading this one!

Don’t know about a basement lab, in later books she always referred to the fully stocked chemistry lab she inherited from Uncle Tarquin, who obviously shared her interest in chemistry! I’ve always gotten the impression Flavia’s bedroom is nearby, and she basically has her own private wing (hence, privacy for smelly and potentially dangerous experiments).

Read this a few years ago & loved it.
As for the lab, I was under the same impression as Susan in NC, that the lab was in a separate wing that no one visited......other than Flavia of course.

I was also surprised I enjoyed it. I rarely like books with young central characters. I suppose she is so precocious, she is more adult.

Susan wrote: "Absolutely loved this - anyone else reading/read it? Anybody have a very different view? Looking forward to discussing this with our lovely group members."

Haven't read this now but a while ago--I loved it as well, as you said (and that was the impression I got too) she sounds more adult than an 11-year-old but still I enjoyed her 'voice'

I am waiting on my copy from the library and hope to get it tomorrow. I am unfamiliar with this author so it's all brand new to me!

I will hope you enjoy it, Jackie.

If anyone isn't sure what a snipe looks like, here is a photo and a bit of information - they are wading birds:
https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/wildli...

Judy wrote: "If anyone isn't sure what a snipe looks like, here is a photo and a bit of information - they are wading birds:
https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/wildli..."

Thanks for the informative site Judy!

My pleasure, Anne!

Has the perfect beak :)

The jack snipe is apparently a smaller version!

I've just read to the end of Flavia's father's description of his schooldays - the feel of this reminded me a bit of the Harry Potter books.

I was interested in the quote which the inspector says to Flavia, which is the inspiration for the book's title. Just googled it and found the source:

"Unless some sweetness at the bottom lie, Who cares for all the crinkling of the pie?" - William King, The Art of Cookery (1708) .

I'm listening to the book on audible, and don't remember if this quote was said at the start!

The quote was printed at the beginning of my kindle version.

I must say the whole snipe thing was the one bit of this story that struck a false note to me. Because the details aren't fully revealed till we get about halfway in, I'll put this in spoiler tags: (view spoiler)[It strains credulity that someone sitting in Norway would go to all the trouble of killing a bird (or picking up one already dead), bake it whole into a pie, and smuggle it into England, just so he could leave it on his would-be blackmail victim's back doorstep with a stamp impaled on its beak. I get trying to frighten one's target to get them into a receptive frame of mind before blackmailing them, but even though the character in question was devious, why wouldn't he use some sort of magic trick instead? (hide spoiler)]

Abigail- I get what you’re saying, I’m a huge fan of this series and have read them all, just waiting on my library’s audiobook for a relisten. However, as a mystery buff, there is a point in The mystery of every book where I ask myself, “wait, what? Why? How did she get here or go there?” Then I realize the confrontation/conversation etc. is generally a contrived way to get this quirky person or bizarre plot twist introduced, and I just go with it for the fun of living in this brilliant, lonely, quirky 11-year-old’s head for a few hours! There are often plot holes you could ride Gladys through...

I started this a few years ago and abandoned it as I found Flavia too irritating. Precocious children are not my favourite thing :)

However, as I'm in a less grumpy frame of mind these days, I'm going to give it another try. Have a couple of other mysteries to finish first, so hope to start at the weekend.

I agree, Susan! It helped introduce another pie-related (view spoiler)[red herring (hide spoiler)], so I forgave the author and went on enjoying myself!

It is quite clear in chapter two that Flavia's lab is not in the basement as she goes upstairs to her lab.

I thought the lab was upstairs too.

Pamela, normally I also dislike books with precocious children. So difficult to get right, so, normally, author's just make them like adults, don't they?

I've just found an old interview with the author, Alan Bradley, from 2009 when the book came out. Interesting to see that this was his first novel, published when he was 70 and that he was 11 in 1950, like Flavia. This doesn't seem to me to have any spoilers in it.

https://www.straight.com/article-2037...

Thanks, Judy! I enjoyed that. Had a completely different idea of the author in my head than the real one. Just goes to show, anybody can write convincingly about anything. (It was perticularly encouraging to me because I'm an older woman who has just written a book about a 12-year-old boy.)

Glad you liked it, Abigail - I was really surprised to discover he wasn't a Brit, and in fact hadn't even been to the UK when he wrote the novel!

Sounds as if, like me, he grew up in an anglophile household, being exposed to a lot of British lit and culture. I used British spelling in American schools until it was drummed out of me in high school, and even wrote my most recent novel in British spelling and usage because it felt more appropriate to the material. Many North Americans are more steeped in British culture than their own, albeit in an artificial way. What is it the Lady Catherine de Bourgh character says in Bride and Prejudice? "With Indian food, and meditation, and Deepak Chopra, who even needs to go to India anymore?" (Laughing at our folly.)

I read this a few years ago and, like Pamela, found Flavia annoying although I enjoyed the plot.

Thanks for the interview, Judy. That really is interesting - I love any background to novels that I enjoy.

I finally started but it seems to be a fast read - got up to chapter 10 last night. not sure what I was expecting but didn't realize the main character is only eleven years old!
I'll finish in the next day or two and come back to read everyone's posts.
I'm really enjoying it.

Good to hear you are enjoying it, Jackie.

I really enjoyed this reread - as a big fan who has read every book in the series, I was mystified by some things, like(view spoiler)[how cold and distant the father was, how spiteful and mean the sisters were to Flavia (hide spoiler)]. Rereading after all these years and the rest of the series didn’t necessarily clear things up, but reminded me things started out this way...

I just finished this one. I thought it was really fun. Too bad it wasn't written when I was about 11 years old (1967)! I would have really enjoyed it then!

I´ll be reading this later on, as I never read anything of this series.

As this has been quite popular and we have been chatting, recently, about new buddy reads, I wondered whether this series would make a good choice? If you have any thoughts about this, please head over to the buddy thread and let us know:

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

I'd heard about this series but never got to reading it. Pleased I have now. Thoroughly enjoyable, entertaining and a fast read. Love the heroine even though she's just eleven years old. Such fun and so adventurous. Kept bringing the Pippi Longstocking stories to mind from way back. Had this book been published back when my daughter was reading prolifically she'd have given Nancy Drew and Trixie Belden a run for their money.

Yes, reminded me of Pippi Longstocking too, Lesley :)

CrimeReads.com has an article about the Flavia series:

How the Flavia de Luce Series Investigates the Traditional English Village Murder Mystery

(I was unsuccessful at copying the link.)

And an article on Freeman Wills Crofts.

Thanks, Sandy!

Thanks, Sandy!