The Seasonal Reading Challenge discussion

This is the discussion thread for the Fall 2020 Group Read Quackery: A Brief History of the Worst Ways to Cure Everything by Lydia Kang and Nate Pedersen. Please post your comments here. This thread is not restricted to those choosing this book for task 20.10, feel free to join in the discussion. Warning- spoilers ahead!

The requirement for task 20.10: You must participate in the book's discussion thread below with at least one post about the contents of the book or your reaction to the book after you have read the book.

This was a fun book. I'm an aficionado of this sort of foolishness, and I picked up some new stories about bad medical ideas and other "cure-alls". My favorite new stories were the "King's touch" and corpse medicine, but there were many others that I was unfamiliar with.

My only cavil with this book: even though it's written for a popular audience, I often found the tone annoying. The book is filled with:

(1) Dave Barry-like jokes delivered after some particularly gruesome or gross description (maybe 25% were amusing), and

(2) a fondness for contemporary analogies / similes / metaphors that bear little relationship to the story being told. They didn't add much to the book, and I REALLY didn't need to learn about the authors' hatred of Nickelback (just one example). C'mon, guys, haven't they suffered enough ? :-}

I don't know if that's how it's done in popular science writing these days, but it got old after 300 pages.

Ava Catherine

20.10 - Group Reads

Although I was familiar with the use of leeches, bloodletting, radium, and opium treatments, many of the practices described in this book were foreign to me. I was amazed at the use of electric baths, tobacco smoke enemas, gold treatments for alcoholism, antimony, arsenic, and other toxins. I knew that mercury was used to treat syphilis but had no idea it was given to babies. And repeatedly reusing antimony pills after they had passed through the digestive tract and then handing them on a relative after one’s death strikes me as just too personal. The king’s touch was an interesting concept, and I was intrigued by the superstition of the people who perpetuated the practice. It reminds us how vulnerable people are when in ill health and forced to trust others for health care. We look at the examples in this book of “snake oil salesmen” as obvious frauds, but they remind us to be vigilant today and not fall victim to the guy hawking the latest magic potion. Of course, there are some examples of remedies that worked or were precursors of effective treatments, and many offered the best "cures" available at the time. Most physicians from previous ages worked tirelessly trying to provide healing miracles with the limited ingredients and tools of their time. Looking into the future, we wonder how primitive we will seem to our descendants.

The book was obviously well-researched and well-written; however, the sarcasm and black humor fell flat and got old quickly. That is the only fault I have with the book.

I wasn't bothered by the snarkiness - perhaps because I somewhat enjoy black humor. A number of points struck me while I was reading this.

First, while many of these ideas seemed pretty crazy, you have to wonder whether there were some "cures," due to belief. The placebo effect is strong, and maybe if you believed strongly enough, something like the king's touch might make some things get better. Just enough, wouldn't have to be everyone, but even 1 or 2 "cures" would be enough to reinforce the belief.

Second, it was intriguing that some of these notions actually were the germ of treatments that are currently used - leeches, the use of light therapy, the use of radiation. So, some of the ideas (not all, by a long shot!) seem to have an actual basis, but one that just didn't work with the available knowledge/technology.

Third, I think we can see right now that this isn't just "old time" lack of knowledge and superstition. Even leaving out politics and religion, think of all the fad diets that some people adhere to for awhile, that then just wither away. Or the people who will spend large sums of money for cosmetic creams that will supposedly make you younger. I'm afraid we're all susceptible to snake oil salesmen, if we want something badly enough.

Finally, wow! Apparently syphilis was the BIGGIE - seems like every one of these remedies touted its ability to cure syphilis!

I thought this was interesting enough. I had come across many of the treatments in other sources, but I thought the information was presented well.
The chatty style worked for me in the beginning, but wore thin as the book progressed. It might have worked better in a blog post or a podcast.

Andy P.
Totally entertaining, I'm not sure I added anything to my knowledge bank except bits of obscure information. It did cement my position that one should never take anyone's view (including that of a certified physician ) without consulting several other sources.

Kristen IA

I enjoyed this book, but I will agree with others who thought the humor was slightly off. I wondered if it was because I listened to the book and her tone never changed when she read one of the author's quips. It was the kind of humor that makes me uncomfortable in person, like it's begging for a laugh, but I don't think it's funny.

Aside from that, I feel like l have a renewed appreciation for the times in which we live, even though one can't help but wonder how this pandemic will be viewed when it is history. Also, while things can always be better, I am very thankful that I am a woman in 2020...I was a bit shocked (but shouldn't be) by the idea of a "pelvic massage" by a doctor to treat hysteria, or whatever disorder women were thought to have. Yikes! This book truly does make you want to step back and look at what things that we do now that seem normal that will likely be shocking or crazy to people of the future.

Amy W

Overall, I enjoyed this book and learned a few new tidbits of information about the past. Definitely cemented the idea that one should think critically when it comes to health, and that if it seems too good to be true, it probably is! I found the whole book a little light - I felt the authors would introduce a topic, share a couple of things, make a joke, and move right on. I would have liked a little more in-depth information about fewer topics.

For me this was a little short of a good read. I probably will give it 3 stars but my true rating is perhaps just under that. I have a nursing background so much of the information was not new to me. I too found the humour a little underwhelming and indeed, thought the information was dumbed down a little too much.It felt like the authors were saying - see what i can make it easy for you to understand.

For me though the biggest annoyances were in the way the book is presented. I read it in Hardback beautifully bound with illustrations and information boxes. My problem was the use of coloured paper - I do have eye sight issues and red or yellow paper i found particularly difficult (i have to resort to my iphone torch). I also felt the placement of the information boxes could have been better in the text.

I see someone listened to the audio version - I would guess this and e-reader formats leave the reader wanting more.

I found it interesting to read, but added little new. It was interesting to see how things had progressed from previous treatments into things we think of as rational now. The humour was hit and miss. To start with it was entertaining, then wore a little thin.

The e-book format was better than expected. The pictures came across reasonably well, if a little small.

(Bookwrm526) This was interesting, but the puns were incredibly groan-worthy, and I agree with the poster above me that the humor wore incredibly thin by the end.

The coverage of the treatments was oddly uneven, incredibly thin and superficial in some places and overly detailed in others. I did learn a few things (I love learning things) but most of this was familiar to me.

If you like the topic of weird medical history along these lines, I recommend the podcast Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine, especially the earlier episodes.

All the snark! I love snark, but come on, man. This was too much. And there was no earth-shatteringly new stuff in here. I've read plenty of weasel balls, leeches, cauterizations, etc., but if you haven't, this isn't a bad book. I echo the recommendation to check out the podcast "Sawbones" if you enjoyed this book or at least the topic. (Note: I'm rarely thrilled with a book someone tells me I have to read, which isn't the best personality trait.)

Queen Bee Darlene

I enjoyed this book very much at first and then it became almost tedious. What started as interesting information became too much information. I was reading it straight through, but as I started to get bored with it, I thought I would then read one chapter at a time between other books, but then I found myself dreading having to pick it up again so I just powered through.

I 100% am with Ashley - when it's a book I HAVE to read, I definitely rebel against it and never enjoy it as much which is totally not fair to the author and why I tend not to rate these books.

Darlene wrote: "Queen Bee Darlene

I enjoyed this book very much at first and then it became almost tedious. What started as interesting information became too much information. I was reading it straight through, ..."

I agree about the having to read bit being off putting I am the same

SandyL

Like many other have already said, this book started off on an interesting note, but became boring and tedious as time went on. And yes, the humor was cute at first, but became annoying the more I read. If it was 150-200 pages I probably would have enjoyed it, but at over 300 pages it was just too long. I'm a fast reader, but it took me over a month to struggle through this book (and like Ashley and Darlene, it may be because it was 'required reading', but I also think I may have just marked it as DNF and moved on after a few chapters.) But who knows - maybe one of the topics of this book will come up as a Jeopardy question and I'll be able to answer it, and then I'll be glad I read the book! :-)

I enjoyed the book in a casual way, skimming regularty. I could only take it in small doses through a few of the sections. I would not consider myself sensitive most of the time, but I had to stop reading here and there just to get a break. I agree with many posters that the snarky jokes got old. If they were rare and smarter throughout the book I think they might have elicited an actual audible laugh. This would be a fun book to pair with an Agatha Christie, Sherlock Holmes or Flavia de Luce mystery or to give to a younger person interested in the subject. The high school biology or chemistry instructor with this on a shelf would be fun to flip through. I think an adult or someone with more reading experience with the subjects would need more details or a focus on one of the topics of the chapters individually.

The subject piqued my interest, the format lost it fairly quickly. I am in agreement with others that the humor was old and I felt often a little off base. As one who enjoys the mix of science and humor mix, I need it to blend smoothly or be a relief for what may be an uncomfortable topic for some, I think of Mary Roach's books. The humor relates, enhances or smooths over the rough spots. This was here just for the purpose of being there and quickly lost appeal.
I still would not completely dismiss the book, it definitely hits the mark on some of "the worst ways to cure everything". A little more depth on some of the science behind those initial claims or theories would have benefited this book.

As with many others I found this intriguing at first but I also found it got old as well. I was familiar with most of these stories as well but there were a few that were new to me. I had never heard of the King's Touch nor blowing smoke up someone's rear to bring the back from the dead. I found it interesting that a few stories that I was expecting when reading a section were not mentioned. The radium girls, and Kellogg's colonic treatments to name a few. Although Kellogg did get mentioned later in the book.

READ 60

I really took sometime to read this book. The information was not really earthshattering but the authors did put it all together in one place. The most difficult part of this to read was the "humor" that was added for reasons known only to the authors.

Amy FL

I'm with the majority of the readers in that the humor fell kind of flat and the book dragged. After hearing about the illustrations in the physical book, I'm thinking maybe I'd have enjoyed this more had I not opted for the audio version. There were some interesting facts, some gross uses of animal parts, but overall an average read for me.

Like the majority of our group readers I had some discomfort with the humor and snark. I found I expected it. I would give a gratuitous 'ha ha' but concurrently thought many of the humor inspired comments were unnecessary. I was interested in the topic as I hadn't read up on many of the described treatments. I chose to rate the book higher based on the fact that it made a good introduction to the topic of quackery. Perhaps there are better books out there on the subject but I don't recall reading one that specifically dealt with it.

I had a lot of fun with this book and shared a lot of it with friends and family who were amused by its content. That is one reason I am posting so late. I read it slowly and so that I could "report" to others what I had read. Maybe that is why I didn't get as annoyed with the book or maybe it is because I like reading "weird" books It was a treat for me and my interested audience got some really fun conversations going. Some of it I already knew about like the peach and apple pits which I learned about from a mystery novel! And history class taught us about gold, quicksilver, leeches etc What was different for me was how the information was presented. Each chapter had the basics about the cure and how it was used and people who were associated with its development as a cure. I liked the images included, especially the advertisements but the politician who turned blue from taking so much salver was so bizarre and that was only 20 years ago! It was kind of creepy how they marketed some of these things for babies and the early ads depicting women as subservient to men was maddening but I understand it is history, although women are still used as provocative enticements in advertising even today so we haven't progressed that far in the advertising world. I also liked the origin pf different words like dope and bluebloods that I did not know. Also, learning how some of the things that were not helpful in the past have been modified into safer cures today like using gold in cancer treatments and arthritis medicine. As for the humor I liked it. I like sarcasm and dark humor. To me, it is not making fun of a subject but providing "comic relief" about an unpleasant topic. It's good to laugh even when the topic is serious. I don't think I have laughed out loud at a book in a long time but i found myself laughing on almost every page about something. I really needed this book now with all the sadness and frustration in our world and I was not only entertained but enlightened by the subject. It's a five star from me.