Georgette Heyer Fans discussion

Here is part 1, https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/... but the thread was so old (no comments since 2015) that I thought it might be best to start afresh.

New to Heyer readers - proceed with caution, as I am going to allow open spoilers for Heyer novels.

My reason for starting this now is that most of us have strong opinions about Vidal & Mary (Devil's Cub) I thought it might be fun to have an open discussion!

& I have a lot of favourite heroines. For a woman who apparently preferred male company, GH gave us many distinctive heroines.

I think Kitty (Cotillion) might be my absolute favourite because of her kind heart, but Arabellla, (Arabella) another kind heart, Abigail (The Black Sheep) Mary (Devil's Cub) are right up there!

I tend to like the more mature, less emotional (at least on the surface) heroines—Anthea (Unknown Ajax), Mary (Devil’s Cub), Frederica (eponymous). But I also love the impetuousness of Phoebe Marlow (Sylvester) and Arabella (eponymous).

Sometimes, though, I like a book for the chemistry of the secondary characters even more than the hero or heroine. The inarticulate but trusty sidekicks especially!

Somehow heroines impress me less than the heroes. However, Drusilla from "The Quiet Gentleman" was good (even though in that book I cared more for the "mystery" than the romance).

Arabella, Phoebe and Frederica are the ones I'd like as best friends, if they were real people. Arabella is so kind and giving and resolute, Phoebe is imaginative and funny, and Frederica is caring and giving.

Phoebe is another one of GH's kind heroines.

I forgot to say what I liked about Abigail. I liked her independence, her sense of humour and her intelligence.

My favourite is Venetia: intelligent, caring, kind and with a wonderful sense of humour!!

For me the one who springs to mind immediately is Sophy Stanton-Lacy. She has what I call the "three C's" that tend to attract me in a protagonist, male or female: Courage, Competence, Compassion. And true to her name, she also has a good deal of wisdom--knowledge of the world and insight into human nature. She also has great lines!

Another vote for the Grand Sophy--she's lively, bright, perfectly imperfect, and more than a match for the hero!

Although I am fond of several of GH's heroines (hi, Venetia!), I would want Sarah Thane (Talisman Ring) to be my BFF. I love her sense of humor, her appreciation of the absurd. She's kind, smart, and very comfortable in her own skin. She manages to make the hero unbend, which just adds to her credits.

This one's hard.

Sophy because she's cool under pressure and she can assess any situation and knows what needs to be done.

Venetia because she's rational, calm, empathetic and has an amazing sense of humor. I love her sense of the absurd, very Austenesque,

Frederica because she can handle those crazy brothers of hers with calmness and doesn't take her sister too seriously. Plus she's oblivious to the attentions of Alverstoke which is fun and different.

First of all, Sophy! I met her during a very difficult time and her strength, kindness, patience, composure, intelligence and self-confidence really inspired me to improve myself, and to just, hang in there, and to think that I could do it, just don't give up!

'I don't suppose,' said Sophy honestly, 'that I should ever advise anyone to despair, for I can't bear such poor-spirited conduct!'

Sarah Thane is another. Ready for adventure, and what a sense of humor! Confident, smart, intrepid, and does not take herself too seriously. I don't begrudge her Tristam, but I do envy her! When she (eagerly) becomes entangled in the lives of Eustacie, Ludovic and Tristam, she really rises to all of the challenges, exasperates and melts Tristam's heart, and helps save the young couple. All while supporting her much loved and ridiculous brother.

"'Do you imagine that I am going to break into Basil's house?' demanded Sir Tristram.

'Why not?' said Ludovic.

'Not only that,' said Miss Thane thoughtfully, 'but we might need you if there is to be any fighting. My brother tells me you have a Right.'

'If,' said Sir Tristram, 'you would all of you rid yourselves of the notion that you are living within the pages of one of Mrs Radcliffe's romances, I should be grateful! Do you realize that tongues are already wagging up at the Court over Eustacie's ill-judged, unnecessary, and foolish flight? I dare swear the news of it has even now reached Basil's ears. If she remains here, what am I to tell him?'

'Let me think,' said Miss Thane.

'Don't put yourself to that trouble!' said Sir Tristram, with asperity. 'Eustacie must go to my mother in Bath.'

'I have it!' said Miss Thane, paying no heed to him. 'I knew Eustacie in Paris some years ago. Finding myself in the vicinity of of her home, I sent to inform her of my arrival, whereupon the dear creature, misliking the Bath scheme, formed the idea of putting herself under my protection. Unfortunately, you, Sir Tristram, knowing nothing of me, and being possessed of a tyrannical disposition – I beg your pardon?’

‘I did not speak,’ replied Sir Tristram, eyeing her frostily.

Miss Thane met his look with one of liquid innocence. ‘Oh, I quite thought you did!’

‘I choked,’ explained Sir Tristram. ‘Pray continue! You had reached my tyrannical disposition.”

Great dialogue there!

& I know not everyone does, but I like Eustacie too! She is very romantic, but also very brave!

And also, Drusilla!

Drusilla was an unusual heroine. You don't usually find a heroine described as short-necked, not beautiful, with mouse-coloured hair. Gervase refers to her as 'that little squab of a female' "with so little countenance or conversation' and thinks that she is dull. But from their meeting outdoors and her taking care of relocating the epergne, the hints of her formidable nature are confirmed!

I like Eustacie's spirit, too! She is young, and might mellow a bit when she gets older. I love how she goes back and forth about marrying Tristam.

I like so many of the heroines and as with her heroes, I don't see them in isolation, but my liking is caught up with their place within the story and alongside the hero.

So, Venetia because she is such a fabulous character and her discovery of true love and her own power is so beautiful.

Arabella, Deb Grantham, and Sophy were amongst my earliest Heyer discoveries and I love their compassion, intelligence, sense of adventure, and style.

I love Mary Challoner and Elinor Rochdale for their intelligence, grit, and determination, as well as for the way they handle their heroes.

Wow - this thread mad me start thinking about Drusilla - and I have begun a re-read of A Quiet Gentleman!

Critterbee❇ wrote: "Wow - this thread mad me start thinking about Drusilla - and I have begun a re-read of A Quiet Gentleman!"

I ADORE Drusilla! Absolutely my favourite GH heroine! I just love how sensible she is, and that so many of the events that take place are thanks to her practicality!
Although I can't relate to her self-professed lack of a romantic nature, she does utter (in my case) the most relatable (and hilarious) line of any GH heroine:
"You have fallen in love with a beautiful face, and you should be ashamed of yourself!"

I love seeing her relationship with Gervase grow "in-between the lines", and the eventual confession leaves me a giggling wreck every time.

Enjoy your re-read Critterbee!

My favourite heroines are always the intelligent and capable ones, but some I appreciate more than others

Sarah Thane - her humour, she doesn't take anything too seriously, but she doesn't shy away from doing what needs to be done.
Mary Challoner - her ablility to get things done.
Nell Stornaway - making the best of her life even though it is nothing like anyone would wish for.

Sarah Thane is probably number one, but closely followed by Sophy. Both are brave and extremely playful which is a fun combination.
I can't think of a heroine I dislike, right offhand. One that didn't make much of an impression - I can't even remember her name! - was from The Foundling. Hetta Silverdale! that was it. I have no sense what she was like, except happy when her hero grew up and got assertive.

Jackie wrote: "One that didn't make much of an impression - I can't even remember her name! - was from The Foundling. Hetta Silverdale! that was it. I have no sense what she was like, except happy when her hero grew up and got assertive."

I agree that Lady Harriet Presteigne doesn't make much of an impression, and it's easy to mix her up with Hetta Silverdale from Charity Girl ... or even with Lady Hester Theale from Sprig Muslin!

GH did like those H names for her heroines!

yes, and all three that Margaret mentioned are women without strong personality traits that make them memorable, I think.

well, no, Lady Hester in Spring Muslin starts out that way but once she gets away from her stupid family she comes into her own. so I take back my previous statement: she is memorable, while the other two aren't really.

Jackie wrote: "well, no, Lady Hester in Spring Muslin starts out that way but once she gets away from her stupid family she comes into her own."

Given that, it's interesting to observe that the other two "H" heroines have names that are basically the same in meaning (they're both feminine versions of Henry/Harry), whereas the origin and meaning of "Hester" is quite different. So superficially similar, but with an underlying difference.

After reading The Quiet Gentleman for the first time, I think Drusilla has to be one of my favourites! I especially like when she has that talk with herself about being practical.

Arabella was the first GH I read, so I will always have a soft spot for her. I am also very fond of Jenny from Civil Contract - she is not a 'heroine' but makes the best of things, and does actually have the courage of her convictions, which is pretty brave of her.
And Mary from Devil's Cub, and her re-appearance in Infamous Army - I can so picture her!

GreyGirl wrote: "Arabella was the first GH I read, so I will always have a soft spot for her. I am also very fond of Jenny from Civil Contract - she is not a 'heroine' but makes the best of things, and does actuall..."

Always admire Jenny but feel sad for her. Love Arabella, Sophy, Frederica and of course Venetia.

Several people have mentioned Sarah Thane, who is probably my favourite of her heroines, so I won't add my reasons for preferring her.

Additionally, I do like Sophy Stanton-Lacy, for the way she just controls the narrative of her book in a way that most of the other heroines don't, and how her schemes actually work! She doesn't need to be rescued at all.

Lastly, I really like Prudence Tremaine (The Masqueraders) but this is one of the few novels where I'm not so fond of the hero who goes with her. I feel that Sir Anthony takes away her agency.

Emma wrote: "Lastly, I really like Prudence Tremaine (The Masqueraders) but this is one of the few novels where I'm not so fond of the hero who goes with her. I feel that Sir Anthony takes away her agency."

I'll admit that one of my few quibbles with The Masqueraders was that I had this sneaking desire for Prudence to fight her duel and win, but the blame for that not happening I always pinned on the author rather than Sir Anthony. It's Heyer who makes it fairly clear--in the "Mohocks" scene and in other places--that while Prue has some training, she doesn't have the skill and endurance of Robin or the Old Gentleman.

It's left to Ellen Kushner in The Privilege of the Sword to make up for this missed opportunity.

Margaret wrote: " It's Heyer who makes it fairly clear--in the "Mohocks" scene and in other places--that while Prue has some training, she doesn't have the skill and endurance of Robin or the Old Gentleman.."

In defense of Heyer (and of Prue): I rather got the impression that she did have the skills, but not the strength and endurance of a man. - There's a reason why fencing, even today, is not a sport where men and women compete with each other.

sabagrey wrote: "Margaret wrote: " It's Heyer who makes it fairly clear--in the "Mohocks" scene and in other places--that while Prue has some training, she doesn't have the skill and endurance of Robin or the Old G..."

True, but Prudence simply hasn't had enough training and practice to keep up - a strong, experienced, and capable female swordfighter (who would have the endurance) would be more than able to keep pace with a less talented male. Also, she was fighting three or four assailants and that is a lot harder even for a highly experienced fighter.

It would have been interesting if Pru had had her duel - we don't really know if her opponent was better than her or not (Robin beat him fairly easily).

GreyGirl wrote: "It would have been interesting if Pru had had her duel - we don't really know if her opponent was better than her or not (Robin beat him fairly easily)"

Robin fought Markham, though (and said himself that he "didn't have it all his own way"); Prue was challenged by Rensley--whom Sir Anthony made fairly short work of, true, and might have defeated even more easily if he'd been willing to settle for anything other than that arm wound that would put Rensley out of commission. So there's no telling how Prue would have fared against Rensley.

Margaret wrote: "GreyGirl wrote: "It would have been interesting if Pru had had her duel - we don't really know if her opponent was better than her or not (Robin beat him fairly easily)"

Robin fought Markham, thou..."

oops yes, my bad - of course Robin fought the other chap! True, we'll never know...

I think my latest favorite is Anthea (from Unknow Ajax). Most levelheaded heroine I read so far, independent, subtle beauty, understated, and yet still enamored the gentle giant Hugo

Ceecee wrote: "I think my latest favorite is Anthea (from Unknow Ajax). Most levelheaded heroine I read so far, independent, subtle beauty, understated, and yet still enamored the gentle giant Hugo"

Yes I like Anthea too.

I agree with Ann. Venetia is my favorite; she’s smart and caring. Since that is my first Heyer book it seems to stay in my memory best too :)

I like too many of her heroines to have a favourite. As I said in message 17 - each one that I love is seen in the context of her story and the hero.

I am with you all in preferring the stronger, older heroines. Added to those listed, I do also like Elinor Rochdale in The Reluctant Widow. Borne along by events, but spirited anyway.

Of younger heroines, Horatio Winwood in The Convenient Marriage gets a vote from me too

Barbara wrote: "Of younger heroines, Horatio Winwood in The Convenient Marriage gets a vote from me too."

just re-read TCM and looked up this thread to add Horry. I didn't like her on my first read, but she has grown on me. Many don't like her "spoilt brat" behaviour, but when I read it as a very young woman's - almost a child's - cry for attention, I can understand it much better.

hmm, I haven't read that one in a long time.

sabagrey wrote: "Barbara wrote: "Of younger heroines, Horatio Winwood in The Convenient Marriage gets a vote from me too."

just re-read TCM and looked up this thread to add Horry. I didn't like her on my first rea..."

since March group reads is for Georgian or earlier stories, i hope we get to cover The Convenient Marriage. I did like Horry, she is unconventional but very very young so her actions in the book are understandable.