Georgette Heyer Fans discussion

I can't find Part One (even though I've named this Part two)

Group Search isn't working atm & I do have an uneasy feeling that I may have deleted the original thread.

Warning: this isn't the thread for those who haven't read many Heyers, as I am going to allow open spoilers.

I have started this thread because although Devil's Cub is a favourite Heyer for many of us, Dominic isn't a favourite hero!

So who is (or are) your favourite heroes.

I don't know if I can name a favourite but my top three are;

Robert Beaumaris
Miles Calverleigh
Freddy Standon

I know Robert is the hardest to justify but I like his sense of humour and his gradual transformation at the hands of Arabella.

Miles I like his honesty, his sense of humour and that he is a self made man.

Freddy - whats not to love? He is so sweet!

Hugo Darracott
Sir Waldo Hawkridge
Gilly, the Duke of Sale

Though I must say I have a fondness for reading about more turbulent characters like Max Ravenscar and Sylvester, Duke of Salford, even though I don’t want them anywhere near me in real life.

I do not have much use for Freddy Standen as a romantic hero, I have to admit—I want him to find a nice man and settle down.

*huffy* Freddy is not gay.

& I like the idea of a nice guy finishing first.

If I had to pick just one, I'd pick Hugo Darracott. I love him to bits and he is perfect. Intelligent, gentle, funny, physically strong. Also, he works for a living, which I like. He is the perfect man.

Miles Calverleigh comes second. He doesn't have Hugo's gentle giant vibe, but he's clever and hilarious and the fact that he's made his own fortune speak in his favour. I also prefer him to Georgette Heyer's dandy characters, because a man who spends more time in front of the mirror than me is a turn off to say the least!

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "*huffy* Freddy is not gay.

Argh! Agreed. I never understood this weird hypothesis that Freddy is gay. He is attracted to women. We have no information about his attraction to men.

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "I know Robert is the hardest to justify but I like his sense of humour and his gradual transformation at the hands of Arabella.."

Yes that's the trouble for me with Beaumaris, I really don't think he transforms very much. Plus, he goes to tell her parents everything without telling Arabella first. Plus, he assumes she would marry him, even though she said no. Like, there's no humbling, not even by a degree. He start cocksure and ends cocksure.

Freddy

And for a totally different type, Jack from "The Toll-Gate"

How to judge these heroes? First of all, there are so many, so I know I will overlook a few. And if they are overlooked, they must not be the ones I like the most, right? :) Then do I rate on attractiveness, whether or not they would suit me, or how interesting they are to read about? hmm.....

Freddy is my number one, as someone who would suit me as a partner. <3 :D <3

He never pushes himself on Kitty, or takes advantage of her, or assumes that she will be his. In regards to judging his preferences without any direct information, that is never reliable. Sometimes direct information is not 100% reliable. But so long as he were attracted to me, I don't think it would matter who he was attracted to so long as he remained loyal.

Charles Audley is another steady, strong non-aggressive hero, perhaps much more intelligent than Freddy, and certainly more worldly and grave. But still with a passionate heart! He is a survivor, and steadfast.

Sir Tristam, oh my! I find him a bit intimidating but so attractive! He seems grim and cold at first, and then just blossoms when he meets Sarah. He is another one you could rely on, and loyal beneath his gruff exterior.

Gervase Frant I also find appealing. Very patient and smart, wise from being on his own and not spoiled by his Father.

I don't see any one thread that connects the heroes that I listed, so perhaps it is also the setting, heroine, friends, and story that makes these few stand out in my mind and heart.

As I've noted elsewhere, Avon is the one Heyer hero that I find Dead Sexy. I think it's the sense of controlled power that does it for me.

Overall, Hugo Darracott is a big favorite; I love his sense of humor, good sense and good heart. Miles Calverleigh falls into the same category; they both have a kind of 'outsider' quality that gives them a unique insight on the situations they fall into.

Gilly in The Foundling is a sweetheart and I just love him to pieces.

Sir Waldo for his nice guy persona and philanthropy.
Miles for his sense of humor. Black Sheep is so Austenesque
Hmmm #3??? Damarel for his kindness and sense of humor. Plus he's really well read and the only one who could keep up with me and my crazy verbal brain. I don't think he's so black as the stuffy neighbors paint him.

When I stop and reflect on my favourite heroes, I realise that in general, I love them because of the partnership with the heroine and the story and the setting. I find it hard to pick out a hero without thinking about all those other things. However, I do have a few who immediately pop into my head!

Like Margaret, I find Justin, Duke of Avon in TOS and in DC, definitely sexy and totally attractive as a fictional hero.

My next favourite has to be Jasper, Lord Damerel from Venetia. Clever, articulate, funny, well-read, sexy.

I also love Miles Calverleigh in Black Sheep because he is intelligent, funny, observant and he takes action to help out the woman he loves.

I have to admit, I still have a soft spot for Dominic in spite of all the flaws identified by so many of you in our current group read. I just enjoy reading DC so much.

My favourite heros don't really follow any particular type. I love Freddy, because he is such an atypical hero. Sir Tristan, because despite him seeming to be the typical alpha hero, he is not. Jack Staple because he is the buccaneer.

As a secondary character, I just adore Gil from Friday's Child and wish he had had his own story.

Somehow I missed all this.
My favorites would be Waldo from The Nonesuch. I fell for him the minute I read the book. I love how he's so capable and doesn't need anyone, until he meets Ancilla. I love the development of their relationship.
Miles from The Black Sheep. The way he wants to save Abigail from her family and make her happy. Sigh! What's not to like.
Jack from The Tollgate. His quiet way of going about things and his gentleness with Nell are amazing qualities.
They're probably boring heroes to some but I like the quiet ones.

I love all - or most - of them; certainly all you mentioned here.

but let's not forget Sir Anthony from The Masqueraders. He falls in love with Prudence despite the fact that he only sees her dressed as a young man.

and he is a large man: like Hugo Darracott's future mother-in-law, I find that attractive.

generally, I am weak at the knees when we see extreme competence : her heros know how to get things done.

there's one quality of some Heyer heroes that I can't abide - "being bored". For God's sake, if you're bored, do something ... maybe even something useful?

So, quite independently of how I like the books they are in, my preference goes to the heroes who are not bored and will never be:

Kit (False Colours) - is he the only GH hero who's got a profession??
Sir Waldo (Nonesuch) - he's got his charities
Hugo Darracott (Unknown Ajax)
John Staple (The Toll Gate)

Well Adam has a profession, or at least he was in the army and now works hard to manage his estate. hmm, who else?

Three of your four have military experience, and Waldo is industrious with his good works. I agree with you about not loving the idle bored guys.

I like Freddy, he is not bored, although he does not have a career in anything other than being an unpaid consultant for and fashion and interior decorating...

I am with Justin (so sexy) and Dominic (okay I *really* should not like him) ... not as people I would actually like to date but man I find them attractive in the books.

Damerel, now he is a great favourite (also sexy!). And maybe I could date/marry him ....

But Hugo Darracott ... and Miles Calverleigh ...

Must go reread my GH books again. So happy to have found this group!

Andie

Welcome Andie. You have named some favourite heroes of mine.

Miles Calverleigh!! Swoon!!!

I don't think anyone has mentioned Sir Tristram (from the Talisman Ring) ?? He's another favourite :) And I know Gideon (The Foundling) is not a main character but I have spent some happy time daydreaming about him.

I do like Sir Tristam - he starts off dull, dark and brooding, but then reveals himself to be loyal, smart, and to have a sense of humor.

Sabagrey, I agree with you that the bored heros are less likeable even though I'd never thought of it that way. There is really no excuse for being rich and bored.
Now that I type that and considered the possibility of being poor and bored, I guess what I really mean is I don't like a bored character, period.

A poor character generally wouldn't have the leisure to be bored. They'd have to be scrambling to make some sort of living.

Waldo, definitely. He's just a decent person, with strong ethics, and he's putting his wealth to good use.
Adam Lynton. He's another decent person, who comes more and more to recognise his faults and to do something about them
Perhaps not so much as people, but as characters I like to read about, Gilly and Freddy equally: because they're not Alpha types, but come into their own when tested.

I do like the alpha heroes when they're not being jerks. I'm like Serena from Bath Tangle and would end up sparring with an alpha hero the way she does but I find the dialogue and story is better when the alpha hero and strong-minded heroine spar. What I love about Damarel and Miles Calverleigh is their sense of humor. They both have colorful pasts and not always honorable intentions but they laugh WITH the heroines and that's an important distinction between alphahole heroes and Heyeresque alpha heores.

QNPoohBear wrote: "I do like the alpha heroes when they're not being jerks. I'm like Serena from Bath Tangle and would end up sparring with an alpha hero the way she does but I find the dialogue and sto..."

I'm all about the fascinating characters who engage my interest and my loyalty and have a little something extra which draws my emotions into the story. So, Damerel, Miles, Ravenscar, Beaumaris, Rule, Justin, and Vidal are my favourite heroes.

I can admire and respect others but my heart is attracted to those alpha males who have agency which they match with intelligence and humour.

Susan in Perthshire wrote: "QNPoohBear wrote: "I do like the alpha heroes when they're not being jerks. I'm like Serena from Bath Tangle and would end up sparring with an alpha hero the way she does but I find t..."

Perfectly put, I agree.

Abigail wrote:

I do not have much use for Freddy Standen as a romantic hero, I have to admit—I want him to find a nice man and settle down.
"
I am afraid I have to have a grumble, because I have a serious problem with this stereotype. We live in a world where we know for a fact that there are gay men in what would be considered very masculine pursuits: there are gay male boxers/footballers/ice-hockey players/military personnel etc. Equally there are straight male models/actors/fashion designers/nurses etc. So, the idea that Freddy must be gay only because he dresses well and has a good eye for color and fashion is just reinforcing a false stereotype.

QNPoohBear wrote: "I do like the alpha heroes when they're not being jerks. I'm like Serena from Bath Tangle and would end up sparring with an alpha hero the way she does but I find the dialogue and sto..."

I so agree about Damerel, Miles and the "laughing with"! I think there is even a line in Venetia about having that sense of the ridiculous in common, being able to laugh together. :)

Andie wrote: I so agree about Damerel, Miles and the "laughing with"! I think there is even a line in Venetia about having that sense of the ridiculous in common, being able to laugh together. :)

Maybe my favourite passage in Venetia ... and so true. I'm lucky to have a partner to laugh with in real life. It has brought and kept us together for close on 25 years.

For those who haven't read Venetia, the audio book read by Richard Armitage is abridged and doesn't include all the scenes that show Damarel's sense of humor. His sense of humor gives him more depth than the average rakish hero.

Oh this is difficult! Many of your comments struck a chord with me. Some of my favs:

Justin Alastair. Someone said 'dead sexy'. Yes! And in those gorgeous Georgian clothes and shoes too. But all man ;)

Charles Audley. I find Julian a little hard to like (Jan hides from hail of peanuts) but Charles is enormously attractive.

Damerel. Someone to laugh with. Yesssss. He’s also well-read and intelligent. Tick.

Miles Calverleigh. Worldly, full of integrity, honest with himself, cares deeply. Another enormously attractive man.

Hugo Darracott. Yes, those big, quiet men :)

Robert Beaumaris. I agree with Carol. A little hard to justify, but his transformation is a lovely thing to watch, and I love his endless patience with Arabella.

And yes Andie, I loved Gideon too, and always wanted him to have his own book.

Like all of us no doubt, I have spent many happy moments daydreaming about these wonderful heroes. *happy sigh*

What a fun thread, and kudos for proposing this topic!

Reading all your comments made for a happy and wistful respite.

My tops are for the sweethearts who have their own struggles, but eventually manage to overcome them while winning their loves : Gilly from The Foundling, Freddy from Cotillion and Ned Carlyon from The Reluctant Widow.

Freddy and Gilly had been mentioned previously. Ned I'll add because I have always been impressed by his management style. He has a problem to solve and comes up with a pretty darned good solution by hiring in a bride for his cousin. I felt his heart was touched by Eleanor's situation, and how he pushed to solve her problem as well, by ensuring she was provided for - killing two birds with one stone, as they say.

Mr. Self Sufficient already has his hands full managing his estate and caring for his siblings, but Ned's own reward follows soon after establishing Eleanor's comfort ... ok, with a slightly broken head in the process.

Thanks again for proposing this topic, I enjoy reading everyone's thoughts.

nice post, Mary! wasn't "trifling" the word Ned used to describe Eleanor's head injury?

I've posted somewhere (part 1?) that Carlyon is one of my favorite hereos...well, upthread in message 15 I talked about competence and that is really what Ned is all about.

Has no one mentioned Lord/Cousin Alverstroke yet?? I can’t believe it lol

“Frederica” gets ranked in my own Top Five Heyer list - one of my absolute favorite Heyer’s ♥️

Vernon may even be an all time Hero fave across the board 🤔

Alverstoke is so much fun, I love reading about him too - but he doesn't capture my heart the same way as others.

And I am always a sucker for guys who look after others in the family (Carlyon; also Charles in The Grand Sophy) - etc.

Hugo Darracott, if only for the faux Yorkshire accent parts, plus so calm yet resourceful.

Freddy Standen of course , so sweet and generous .

Damerel (despite the kiss) sexy and clever and funny.

I am so glad no one listed Worth, arrogant sod.

Andie said

And I am always a sucker for guys who look after others in the family (Carlyon; also Charles in The Grand Sophy) - etc.

Yes, so many of my favorites do this: Ned, Hugo, Freddie, Gilly.

I feel like this is my favorite thread ever! :D

Sorry Barbara - I like Worth!

Yes I like Worth too. But Damerel is the one for me!!!

Anne wrote: "Yes I like Worth too. But Damerel is the one for me!!!"

Yes - Damerel is my favourite too!

Susan in Perthshire wrote: "Sorry Barbara - I like Worth!"


I can't forgive him for the scene in which he berates Judith for being a hoyden and unable to tell the difference between a private race and the utter impropriety of one on the public highway. Hugo - or even more so Miles, would have been generous and amusing about it .
Also both he and Judith get to be really rather boring in later life, at least judging by Infamous Army appearances. Judith knows that too but I bet he doesn't . Very sure of his own worth is Worth.

I never liked Worth but hadn't considered how well named he is!

Barbara wrote: "Hugo Darracott, if only for the faux Yorkshire accent parts, plus so calm yet resourceful...."

Oh, but the Yorkshire accent is real! It's his native tongue. It's the upper class accent that's 'faux' if anything. But really, he's just bilingual; the only thing that's faux is his giving the impression that he can't speak upper class English.

Barbara wrote:
I can't forgive him for the scene in which he berates Judith for being a hoyden and unable to tell the difference between a private race..."
Yes, imagine him coming to get Kitty (Cotillion) out of the masquerade, or Hero (Friday's Child) out of Bartholomew Fair, or Nell (April Lady) away from the moneylender's door! Judith was already beginning to be made to feel uncomfortable out on the road on her own - she might well have welcomed a nicer man, like Freddy or Sherry (or Mr Tooting!) or Felix, coming to rescue her rather than the big boss man barging in, telling her off and laying down the law.
I can't stand Worth and have always thought Judith could have done better for herself.

when you put it like that, I can't disagree.

Jenny wrote: "Barbara wrote: "Hugo Darracott, if only for the faux Yorkshire accent parts, plus so calm yet resourceful...."

Oh, but the Yorkshire accent is real! It's his native tongue. It's the upper class ac..."

No, the Yorkshire accent (which he might have had had his Granddad allowed it ) was culled from an early age, Hugo being 'quality make'. Of course he could turn it on in a second, , surrounded as he had been as a boy, outside of Harrow that is .!

Linguists call this sort of thing "code-switching" and most of us do it to a degree (think of the way you talk to your boss at work versus how you schmooze with your friends after work). It just so happens that Hugo's two "registers" are more distinct than maybe a lot of us experience. At one point Anthea notes that both Richmond and their late cousin Oliver were capable of speaking in "broadest Sussex", just for grins.

Margaret wrote: "Linguists call this sort of thing "code-switching" and most of us do it to a degree (think of the way you talk to your boss at work versus how you schmooze with your friends after work). It just so..."

I was trying to remember what that was called. When I was growing up, regional accents were stronger and more common than they seem to be now, although that may have been due to where I grew up. I didn't notice it much at home, because of course everyone spoke like I did in different settings. When I left home for university, it was more noticeable because there were more different accents. My new friends spoke one way with me and we all spoke a fairly standard accent in school or in other formal settings. Sometimes, you got three versions - I knew some who spoke with an accent I couldn't really follow when the saw a friend from home, accented but clearer English when speaking to me or other new friends, and probably an even more formal variant when needed. A few people even took elocution lessons to try to "improve" their formal speech, but that was becoming passe even then, and decades of greater exposure to standard accents on TV and other media have modified the way most people speak.