Christian Speculative Fiction discussion

Choosing the point of view for telling your story is one of the most critical decisions that a writer can make before starting. There are pros and cons to first, second, and third person viewpoint, and there are advantages and disadvantages to past, present, and (believe it or not) future tenses. The default POV is third person, past tense, mainly because that's what people expect, making it the most transparent. But this exercise is intended to explore all your options:

1. Post a paragraph, possibly your first paragraph, from a recent work of yours. Make sure it is written in third person, past tense.
2. Now let's edit it and provide a second version so that it presents itself in first person, past tense.
3. Now let's provide a third version in first person, present tense.
4. Now, just for fun, write it in second person (you), future tense.

Some editors dislike stories written either in first person or in present tense. But as you look at your paragraph, you can see that is gives a sense of immediacy and intimacy that the others don't. What would be the disadvantages of writing a book this way? What would make you decide to choose this path?

Would you ever write something in second person or future tense?

Here's my entry:

Past tense, third person

It was late, but Connie hoped that Adam was still up. Thankfully, as she neared the bookstore, she saw that the lights were still on. The front door was locked, but she figured Adam was either on his computer going through inventory or paying bills. She rapped on the glass door, and a minute later, Adam appeared at the door.

Past tense, first person

It was late, but I hoped that Adam was still up. Thankfully, as I neared the bookstore, I saw that the lights were still on. The front door was locked, but I figured Adam was either on his computer going through inventory or paying bills. I rapped on the glass door, and a minute later, Adam appeared at the door.

Present tense, first person

It’s late, but I hope that Adam is still up. Thankfully, as I near the bookstore, I see that the lights are still on. The front door is locked, but I figure Adam is either on his computer going through inventory or paying bills. I rap on the glass door, and a minute later, Adam appears at the door.

Future tense, second person

It will be late, but you will hope that Adam was still up. Thankfully, as you near the bookstore, you will see that the lights are still on. The front door will be locked, but you will figure Adam is either on his computer going through inventory or paying bills. You will rap on the glass door, and a minute later, Adam will appear at the door.

Interesting. I was writing a book in first person and realized my protagonist was a terrible narrator so I had to rewrite the whole manuscript in third person.

As I mentioned, it's a critical decision to make early on, and it's one that unfortunately some writers just decide on a whim. First person is more personal, but really limits your perspective to one person. Present tense is more immediate, but gets tiring quickly.

I just wrote this yesterday. It’s from a current work in progress.

Past tense. Third person.
What the… Nausea rose, bile filling his mouth. He spit, shook his head. Some of the fog lifted. Thunder grumbled again, this time farther away. Keagan pressed up onto his feet, the breeze chilling him through his sweat-soaked clothes. The chuckling of the river drew his attention to his left. He stumbled to the churning water, lowered to his knees, and rinsed his mouth several times, spitting out the fouled water before drinking deeply.

Past tense. First person.
What the… Nausea rose, bile filling my mouth. I spit, shook my head. Some of the fog lifted. Thunder grumbled again, this time farther away. I pressed up onto my feet, the breeze chilling me through my sweat-soaked clothes. The chuckling of the river drew my attention to my left. I stumbled to the churning water, lowered to my knees, and rinsed my mouth several times, spitting out the fouled water before drinking deeply.

Present tense. First person.
What the… Nausea rises, bile filling my mouth. I spit, shake my head. Some of the fog lifts. Thunder grumbles again, this time farther away. I press up onto my feet, the breeze chilling me through my sweat-soaked clothes. The chuckling of the river draws my attention to my left. I stumble to the churning water, lower to my knees, and rinse my mouth several times, spitting out the foul water before drinking deeply.

Future tense. Second person.
What the… Nausea will rise, filling your mouth. You will spit, shake your head. Some of the fog will lift. Thunder will grumble again, this time farther away. You will press up onto your feet, the breeze will chill you through your sweat-soaked clothes. The chuckling river will draw your attention to your left. You will stumble to the churning water, lower to your knees, and rinse your mouth several times, then spit the foul water before you will drink deeply.

This was an interesting experiment and here are some of my thoughts.
Though my preference remains third person, past tense, I find first person is easier but limiting. Present tense is hard for me to keep consistent. I've used it in short stories or flash fiction pieces but would avoid it in longer writing. Second person is awkward and I think should be used only for non-fiction books like manuals. And future tense? Too much use of words like will or would to make it worth the effort.

Glad to see you added an action paragraph, Chris. And thanks for the input from both of you.

You can open in the present tense in order to ground your reader immediately in the action, especially if you are trying to set a scene that is compelling, mysterious, or inexplicable, and then switch to the past tense in a subsequent chapter. You're absolutely right that the present tense can get tiring because there is such a thing as too much immediacy.

One option you didn't mention is first person plural--"we." I read an award-winning short story a few years back in which this perspective was deployed to great effect, again because of the particular bent of the narrative (a group of girls defending themselves against a well-respected predator in the community).

Anything is possible, as long as it works. The most important point is not to alienate the reader. And I would love to see a sample of how first person as "we" works. Sounds intriguing.

Agreed. If I can dig up the story, Glen, I will pass on the title/link.

Glen wrote: "Glad to see you added an action paragraph, Chris. And thanks for the input from both of you."

Using "We" as the narrative person voice reminds me of Anthem by Ayn Rand. She uses it very deliberately, because the dystopian society she describes has removed the word "I" from the language to prevent individual thought. When the narrator learns how to say "I" it changes to "I." It's a cool effect.

Glen wrote: "As I mentioned, it's a critical decision to make early on, and it's one that unfortunately some writers just decide on a whim. First person is more personal, but really limits your perspective to o..."

Ordinarily I find third person past is a good default. It disappears and doesn't distract from the story. I recently read Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir, though, and it's first person present, and it's perfect. I was really impressed. It was the right tool for the job, and so well done that I actually had to go back and double check to see that it was first person present. But the POV character's personality and the story itself demanded it.

First person can be used effectively as long as the character's voice is distinctive. I used the transition between third person past to first person present as the main character experiences a memory in my current WIP. There is another important memory later in the story (probably in book two) I plan to handle the same way. Here are a few paragraphs at the point of transition. Any input would be appreciated.


Keagan’s vision blurred, caught between the past memory and the present. “Even at that age, I had heard the tales of unearthly beings that lived in the maze; but my hatred of Father held a stronger power over me.

“And yet, the desire to please Father still bound me like some foolish, trapped animal.

“In that inky blackness, fueled by the need to prove myself to him, I felt my way to my left until I knocked into the barrel of torches. It took another long while for me to find flint and tinder in one of the drawers of the cabinet.”

The memory came alive in Keagan’s mind, transporting him back to the maze of tunnels beneath Shadespawn’s city.

The thought of shifting to fox form slips into my thoughts, but I dismiss it. Losing the light of the torch that I grasp with the iron fist of need is not an option. I scan the small room. No weapons. No water. Glancing up at the trap door, I growl. Hatred and respect for my father wage war in my mind. I am abandoned … like before. When she left me. I shake my head. That is a battle for another day. Focus! Survive!

A crumpled mess of empty sacks sits on the floor in one corner of the room. I wedge my torch in a wall bracket. Grabbing the largest of the dust covered bags, I fill the ratty sack with as many spare torches as it can hold. A quick search of the cabinet leaves me sneezing as dust motes dance in meager light, but I find a rusty knife which I stuff into one of the inner pockets of my jacket.
Though perspiration coated my skin while wearing the thigh-length leather coat in Shadespawn’s great room, I am now glad for its protective warmth over my thin tunic. I pocket three tiny bottles. I am not certain why I take them, but instinct tells me they might come in handy.

C.S. wrote: "First person can be used effectively as long as the character's voice is distinctive. I used the transition between third person past to first person present as the main character experiences a mem..."
Sounds like an exciting story!
I don't know the context, so the "slipping into fox form" thing is a bit startling. In context, it would probably really help place the character as the narrator.
I personally wouldn't use present tense for a memory unless the memory is experienced really immediately, like a dream or a sudden recall of a forgotten moment. If the POV character has already processed the memory and is comfortable with it, (and in this case it sounds like he's telling the story, so he must be familiar with the memory and not experiencing it again now as though for the first time) it seems like using a past tense voice would work better. I've seen the memory thing done by switching from first person quoted narrative to third person past. It can work really well. That's just my two cents, you obviously know your book better than I do.

Just one other thing. The sentence that begins "Though perspiration coated my skin" seems awkward, since the phrase "while wearing...." grammatically modifies the subject, "perspiration" which doesn't make sense.

I'm actually working on a memory sequence right now. I would appreciate any and all criticism you can spare. :)


Evan grimaced. "It wasn't anything like that. Just something I saw." A shadow passed over his face. He remembered the moment all too clearly, and even after all those years the memory still made his stomach clench.
He looked up to find Mark staring at him. “What was it?” Mark asked.
“I was walking home one day…” It was as clear in his mind today as if it had been yesterday, not four years ago. The sun shining on the dusty street. The sudden scream of pain and terror, the desperate pleading. “And I saw a group of the Cartel’s collectors. They were easy enough to recognize and I knew enough to avoid them. But this time—” Evan’s eyes defocused, and they knew he was seeing something else.
A child’s scream ripped through the afternoon quiet. It sounded like Jimmy, the boy next door. He didn’t know him well, but he’d seen him playing plenty of times. Where was he? Was he alright?
Then he saw him. The little blond boy was screaming in the arms of one of the Cartel men. Evan stopped, frozen, torn between the desire to help Jimmy and the knowledge that there was nothing he could do against the four men. And that if he did do anything, it would bring trouble down on his own family. So he stood, helpless, and watched as Jimmy was dragged down the street to the door of his house. One of the men pounded on the door until a woman—Jimmy's mother—stepped out.
“Pay what you owe, or…” Jimmy yelped as the man twisted his arm behind his back.
“Let him go! I don’t have it. I’ll have it tomorrow.”
“That’s what you said last month.”

Marie wrote: "C.S. wrote: "First person can be used effectively as long as the character's voice is distinctive. I used the transition between third person past to first person present as the main character expe..."

Thanks for your input.

By this point in the story, Keagan's ability to shift from aelf to fox is well established.

I had hoped the line 'The memory came alive in Keagan’s mind, transporting him back to the maze of tunnels beneath Shadespawn’s city.' was enough to establish the memory becomes immediate, i.e. first person, present tense, in his mind when he begins telling Bran the story.

I am looking over your piece and will provide feedback.

Marie wrote: "I'm actually working on a memory sequence right now. I would appreciate any and all criticism you can spare. :)


Evan grimaced. "It wasn't anything like that. Just something I saw." A shadow pass..."

Marie. Would you prefer I make comments here to share with the group, or just contact you directly?

Writing Exercise #3 is posted.

C.S. wrote: "Marie wrote: "I'm actually working on a memory sequence right now. I would appreciate any and all criticism you can spare. :)


Evan grimaced. "It wasn't anything like that. Just something I saw."..."

I'd love for it to be part of the discussion on here

Okay, I don’t know if this is helpful or if I am just being annoying, but these are the things I picked up when reading this piece. The story sounds exciting and intriguing. I think it could be polished a bit, though, to make it stronger. Remember, these notes are just my disposable opinion.

Evan grimaced. "It wasn't anything like that. Just something I saw." A shadow passed over his face. He remembered the moment all too clearly, and even after all those years the memory still made his stomach clench. He looked up to find Mark staring at him.
“What was it?” Mark asked.
“I was walking home one day…” It was as clear in his mind today as if it had been yesterday, not four years ago. The sun shining on the dusty street. The sudden scream of pain and terror, the desperate pleading. “And I saw a group of the Cartel’s collectors. They were easy enough to recognize and I knew enough to avoid them. But this time—” Evan’s eyes defocused, and they knew he was seeing something else.
A child’s scream ripped through the afternoon quiet. It sounded like Jimmy, the boy next door. He didn’t know him well, but he’d seen him playing plenty of times. Where was he? Was he alright?
Then he saw him. The little blond boy was screaming in the arms of one of the Cartel men. Evan stopped, frozen, torn between the desire to help Jimmy and the knowledge that there was nothing he could do against the four men. And that if he did do anything, it would bring trouble down on his own family. So he stood, helpless, and watched as Jimmy was dragged down the street to the door of his house. One of the men pounded on the door until a woman—Jimmy's mother—stepped out.
“Pay what you owe, or…” Jimmy yelped as the man twisted his arm behind his back.
“Let him go! I don’t have it. I’ll have it tomorrow.”
“That’s what you said last month.”

1. A shadow passed over his face. - Since this is from his POV, I think the descriptor might be better from an internal perspective. He couldn’t see a shadow passing over his face.

2. He remembered the moment all too clearly, and even after all those years… It was as clear in his mind - Though there is nothing technically wrong with these statements, they tend toward telling rather than showing and become repetitive.

3. Evan’s eyes defocused, and they knew he was seeing something else. – Once again, this could use some tweaking since it is from Evan’s POV.

4. A child’s scream ripped through the afternoon quiet. – Coming when it does, this seems abrupt since I am uncertain if it is part of Evan’s memory or currently happening. Especially considering note 3 above precedes this.

5. It sounded like Jimmy, the boy next door. He didn’t know him well, but he’d seen him playing plenty of times. Where was he? Was he alright? Then he saw him. The use of the pronoun ‘he’ here gets a bit confusing. Is the ‘he’ Evan or Jimmy? Since the first ‘he’ comes after the noun ‘Jimmy’ but refers back to Evan and is followed by six more references to ‘he’ and ‘him.’

6. Also, consider limiting the number of times you use being verbs (specifically ‘was’). For example, since you already mentioned the screaming above, consider something more active in place of, the little blond boy was screaming in the arms of one of the Cartel men. The last ‘was’ is an easy fix. So he stood, helpless, and watched as Jimmy was dragged down the street to the door of his house. - So, he stood, helpless, and watched as the men dragged Jimmy down the street to the door of his house.

I was a bit uncertain about your POV, since we seemed to be inside Evan's head, but we also notice the shadow pass over his face and others watching his eyes close ... so I wasn't sure.

Aside from that, the old memory impinging on the present ... and the present blowing up ... was well done.

Thank you, C.S. I really appreciate your taking the time to analyze my text in such detail. SO helpful!

Regarding point 4: This begins the flashback. I have it in italics in my text, which I think helps with the clarity, but goodreads doesn't support that kind of formatting. Would that be sufficient for clarity, or do you think that it would need more than that?

I was already getting the impression I really needed to work on my POV skills. You have just confirmed that. I appreciate it.
I was definitely jumping around between the external perspective on Evan and his internal perspective. Thank you for pointing that out. I think that's why I was dissatisfied with what I'd written. I'm really struggling with third person. It's not as easy as it seems like it ought to be.
I'm currently studying a book by one of my favorite authors to see how he does POV. It's a fascinating study.

The "was" thing I will fix in my rewriting process. This was the first thing I splatted on the page for this scene. Thanks for pointing it out, though.

Jessica wrote: "I was a bit uncertain about your POV, since we seemed to be inside Evan's head, but we also notice the shadow pass over his face and others watching his eyes close ... so I wasn't sure.

Aside fro..."

Oh dear.... I didn't realize how unclear it was that the screaming and violence was all a flashback. Do I need more than italics to make that clear?

C.S. picked up on the same POV issues (see above). I think that means it probably isn't clear. Nobody can see a shadow pass over his own face.

I had no problems with the flashback whatsoever, only the POV.