Hugo & Nebula Awards: Best Novels discussion

Opening the discussion thread for this challenge covering John Scalzi's Old Man's War series, to be completed over January to May. The books for this challenge, in order, are:

Old Man's War
The Ghost Brigades
The Last Colony
Zoe's Tale
The Human Division
The End of All Things

There are also three optional, non-essential, shorter works that fall into this series:
Questions for a Soldier - 30 pages, after book 1
The Sagan Diary - 100 pages, after book 2
After the Coup - 28 pages, after book 4

This is amazing. Where can I enlist?

Here I’d imagine 😄 I’m guessing that we will use this thread for general challenge updates and questions and have separate threads for each book? I’m still waiting for my library hold on Old Man’s but should start soon!

No. I mean , where can I enlist in this Army to fight the war. I'm really liking the book.

As we've mentioned before, somewhere in these threads, Old Man's War is a natural successor to
Starship Troopers - 1958
The Forever War - 1975
Armor - 1979
not to mention many other books and authors.

Military SF has its roots all the way back in 1871, with The Battle of Dorking by George Tomkyns Chesney. I got a free copy on Kindle, and it's in Project Gutenberg.

Cordelia wrote: "No. I mean , where can I enlist in this Army to fight the war. I'm really liking the book."

haha, I'm apparently taking things too literally again 😂

Allan wrote: "Military SF has its roots all the way back in 1871, with The Battle of Dorking by George Tomkyns Chesney..."

Started reading this as a preface to the main series. It's only 45 pages.

Allan wrote: "Started reading this as a preface to the main series. It's only 45 pages."

I haven't checked it but I suppose it is akin to pre-WW1 military fiction that tried to describe what the new war will be like - not exactly SF more an alt-history set in their nearest future, where tech remains the same. Is it?

That is correct. It was written in 1871, right after the Franco-Prussian War. Chesney, a Captain in the Royal Engineers, was upset at the state of the British military & amazed at the superiority of the Prussian army. He tried to express his concerns through letters and articles, unsuccessfully, so turned to this fictional tale.

So-called "invasion literature" actually became popular in the Napoleonic era, when the French invented the hot-air balloon. Almost 100 years before Dorking! But then the 1800's in Europe were filled with invasions & revolutions, so its popularity was sustained.

Allan wrote: "As we've mentioned before, somewhere in these threads, Old Man's War is a natural successor to
Starship Troopers - 1958
The Forever War - 1975
Armor"

I recently reread Armor and The Forever War, and I was surprised by how "current" they both seemed, especially The Forever War. I read Forever War as a teenager (a while ago) and had forgotten the dark humor that runs through it -- or maybe I didn't catch it until I spent 4 years in the Army myself, lol. Armor I had read for the first time only 10 years ago or so, but I enjoyed it even more the second time. Now, as if I don't have enough to read, I'll have to read Starship Troopers again, which I read when I was like 12. I've seen the ridiculously bad but highly entertaining film so many times that I doubt I recall much of Heinlein's original story!

The Starship Troopers movie has almost nothing in common with the book. I read it as a young teen & re-read a few times, but haven't re-read now for decades. Of course I liked it but I always liked The Door into Summer and The Puppet Masters better as far as RAH goes. I also just re-read The Forever War in December, and happened to find a used copy of Armor on Sunday. I’ve never read it and hadn’t even heard of it till someone here mentioned it as a military SF classic in the same vein. I’m looking forward to reading it in parallel with the OMW series.

Allan wrote: "happened to find a used copy of Armor on Sunday. I’ve never read it and hadn’t even heard of it till someone here mentioned it as a military SF classic in the same vein. I’m looking forward to reading it in parallel with the OMW series."

I too would like to read it, I already got a copy, bought years ago on some bundle deal I guess. Let's buddy read it

I found Starship Troopers fascinating for a while in my early teens for some reason and read it many times, but I haven’t looked at it for decades and probably never will again. Of course I recognize that it was influential and agree that it was a direct precursor to The Forever War and Old Man’s War. I have to admit I had never even heard of Armor before now.

I have no idea how Armor escaped my attention for over two decades -- luckily a coworker told me about it. Anyway, it became one of my favorites, so I think you'll enjoy it as well.

Oleksandr wrote: "I too would like to read it, I already got a copy, bought years ago on some bundle deal I guess. Let's buddy read it..."

I'm in! Maybe Stephen or others will join if they can track down a copy. I'd like to finish OMW1 first, but it's moving fast & I'll be done in a few days. Whatever is convenient for you otherwise.

It’s certainly on my radar now, but I don’t think I’ll be up for a buddy read in the near future.

Allan wrote: "Oleksandr wrote: "I too would like to read it, I already got a copy, bought years ago on some bundle deal I guess. Let's buddy read it..."

I'm in! Maybe Stephen or others will join if they can tra..."

Any place to read it free on line? I can only find it full price at amazon and the library doesn't even know about it so I cannot request it. Also, maybe in a couple of months, too much else right now

I loved starship troopers also

Open Library

https://openlibrary.org/search?q=John...

thanks

I'm already starting "The Last Colony". Kinda like potato chips. Can't eat jjust onne.

The Last Colony is #3, isn't it? You already read The Ghost Brigades?

Kalin wrote: "The Last Colony is #3, isn't it? "

Yes, but it goes ok if you miss Ghost Brigades (which are also good)

I did not like The Last Colony nearly as well. (view spoiler)[ POLITICS!! Hate politics (hide spoiler)]

Not sure if zoe's will be better

Kateblue wrote: "I did not like The Last Colony nearly as well. [spoilers removed]

Not sure if zoe's will be better"

I for one thought Zoe's Tale was better. Before reading it, I thought "a re-telling of the same story??? That can't be good." But I was pleasantly surprised and really liked it.

You're already up to April's book! As I mentioned above, you should seek out the shorts that go with the series. I read the first one, it was a good postscript to the first book. I'll pick up the 2nd short after I read The Ghost Brigades, which I'm not going to start until Feb 1.

I liked the first four books very much, the latter less so but still so;id 3 star reads

Still can’t find a copy that doesn’t require buying it. :-(

In January, I read not only the first book, but the short story (#1.5) Questions for a Soldier, which is more or less a postscript to book 1. I read the pioneering military SF short The Battle of Dorking as a prelude and, having re-read The Forever War in December, topped that off with the sequel Forever Free, which is ok but not up to the quality of the original. I plan to start The Ghost Brigades in a couple days, followed by The Sagan Diary, an add-on novella (#2.5 in the series).

Allan wrote: " a postscript to book 1. I read the pioneering military SF short [..."

So a lot of additional reading :)

Oleksandr wrote: "Allan wrote: " a postscript to book 1. I read the pioneering military SF short [..."

So a lot of additional reading :)"

The roots of military SF! Forever Free was kind of an afterthought. I had it on my library TBR and wanted to read a short audiobook.

We talked about reading [book:Armor|102327] as a buddy read. Are you still up for that? I'm ready to start Feb. 1, what's your timing?

Allan, where are you finding the short works?

Allan wrote: "We talked about reading Armor as a buddy read. Are you still up for that? I'm ready to start Feb. 1, what's your timing?."

Armor - a definite yes for the buddy read but closer to the mid-month - I usually start with monthly reads... I have the book bought a while ago, so no need to wait for a loan

I've got "Questions" lined up to read next. I bought the kindle from amazon for 64c.

Cordelia--link to the cheap book please

I dont know how to do that. I'm useless with electronic.

But I wnt to Amazon.com
Searched for "questions for a soldier"
It just came up. BUT it has increased in price to $1.17 US
It's not long - just 22 pages

Ah, I see it! I will decide later it I am reading it

Kindle for Questions for a Soldier (28 pgs)

Open Library for The Sagan Diary (100 pgs)
https://openlibrary.org/works/OL57346...

Tor Books for After the Coup (26 pgs)
https://www.tor.com/2008/07/20/after-...

Oleksandr wrote: "Allan wrote: "We talked about reading Armor as a buddy read. Are you still up for that? I'm ready to start Feb. 1, what's your timing?."

Armor - a definite yes for the ..."

Sounds good to me. Just give me a heads up when you're ready.

Anyone else is welcome to join in. I'll open a thread in Buddy Reads.

Questions and After the Coup are great and well worth it. The Sagan Diary...well, read some reviews before you jump in. I found it awful.

I don't have Kindle, but I found a PDF download for Questions for a Soldier here: https://yes-pdf.com/book/4068

disclaimer: don't know if it is legal

Kalin wrote: "I don't have Kindle, but I found a PDF download for Questions for a Soldier here: https://yes-pdf.com/book/4068

disclaimer: don't know if it is legal"

if I am not mistaken it was available for some time on Scalzi's website, but I haven't checked if it is still there

Ryan wrote: "Questions and After the Coup are great and well worth it. The Sagan Diary...well, read some reviews before you jump in. I found it awful."

I saw a review that didn't rate it highly. However, being a raging completist, I will have to read it anyway.

Kalin wrote: "I don't have Kindle, but I found a PDF download for Questions for a Soldier here: https://yes-pdf.com/book/4068

disclaimer: don't know if it is legal"

NEVER MIND. I bought it for a dollar

XXX I cannot figure out how to download from that pageXXX

Finished all the books on my second go through. Once I got started I just couldn’t stop! I loved spending time in this universe again, and the library books were all readily available. Also read Questions and After the Coup, but passed on the Sagan diary based on reviews and comments here. I am sure Scalzi got tired of writing in this universe, but there is so much depth! I could imagine many more stories and branches that would be fascinating to read.

I'm coming in late to this one as I recently moved states and January (and some of February) was a mess, but I've been wanting to read this series and hope to catch up on the 2 I've missed and join in March :)

Claire wrote: "I'm coming in late to this one as I recently moved states and January (and some of February) was a mess, but I've been wanting to read this series and hope to catch up on the 2 I've missed and join..."

It is ok to join late, after all most readers ave enough short-term memory to discuss books read even a month ago :)

After finishing books 2 and 3 nearly simultaneously, I knocked out the novella The Sagan Diary, #1.5. It is very different from the other books, largely Jane's exploration of her own mind and feelings, as opposed to an action book. Kind of slow & philosophical, it rounds out Jane some, but otherwise doesn't contribute much to the overall saga.

In the afterword, Scalzi explains that it was written after he submitted a draft of The Last Colony to an auction for a book endowment fund for a friend who had passed away. He jokingly offered to write a short story for anyone who paid $5,000 for the draft. Unexpectedly, a publisher who wanted to obtain a short story from Scalzi paid it, and The Sagan Diary is the result.

Just coming in here to say I’m way behind because of work travel eating into my reading time. I’ll come back and necropost at some point!!

I just read The Sagan Diary, or most of it. It seems to be a sort of experimental piece. I didn’t find it very interesting.

I expect to start The Last Colony shortly.

I'm waiting till April to read Zoe's Tale & After the Coup. I might also tackle The Human Division to get it out of the way.

Scalzi on Twitter, in response to a question:

“ I'm contractually obliged to provide at least one more OMW book, which, when it's put that way, sounds like I'm being forced to do it, but in fact I'm SUPER excited about getting back into it. No details on how and when, but I will note the 20th anniversary of OMW is in 2025...”