The Evolution of Science Fiction discussion

A postmodern visionary who is also a master of styles of genres, David Mitchell combines flat-out adventure, a Nabokovian lore of puzzles, a keen eye for character, and a taste for mind-bending philosophical and scientific speculation in the tradition of Umberto Eco, Haruki Murakami, and Philip K. Dick. The result is brilliantly original fiction as profund as it is playful. Now in his new novel, David Mitchell explores with daring artistry fundamental questions of reality and identity.

Cloud Atlas begins in 1850 with Adam Ewing, an American notary voyaging from the Chatham Isles to his home in California. Along the way, Ewing is befriended by a physician, Dr. Goose, who begins to treat him for a rare species of brain parasite. . . .
Abruptly, the action jumps to Belgium in 1931, where Robert Frobisher, a disinherited bisexual composer, contrives his way into the household of an infirm maestro who has a beguiling wife and a nubile daughter. . . . From there we jump to the West Coast in the 1970s and a troubled reporter named Luisa Rey, who stumbles upon a web of corporate greed and murder that threatens to claim her life. . . . And onward, with dazzling virtuosity, to an inglorious present-day England; to a Korean superstate of the near future where neocapitalism has run amok; and, finally, to a postapocalyptic Iron Age Hawaii in the last days of history.
But the story doesn’t end even there. The narrative then boomerangs back through centuries and space, returning by the same route, in reverse, to its starting point. Along the way, Mitchell reveals how his disparate characters connect, how their fates intertwine, and how their souls drift across time like clouds across the sky.

As wild as a videogame, as mysterious as a Zen koan, Cloud Atlas is an unforgettable tour de force that, like its incomparable author, has transcended its cult classic status to become a worldwide phenomenon.

I have a few books I need to read this month so I decided to start this one a couple of days early.

So far it's a lot more readable than I was expecting. I feel like I was led to believe that it would mostly be a series of disconnected fragments until a big reveal at the end, but it doesn't feel like that at all to me. I recently finished the third segment and all three felt like they worked on their own in spite of not resolving, and there are some pretty explicit aspects that link the stories together. A flick-through shows that the structure of the book is symmetrical, with us ending back where we started in terms of each story. I didn't get much from the first segment, but the second and third were a lot more enjoyable for me. Not in love, but enjoying it and interested to see where it goes.

I started early too. A friend loved the film but I found it disappointing. Approached the book with trepidation but I’m really enjoying it. Love that I can read a section, savour it, then read on the next night without my usual compulsive need to read on until I finish. That’s one plus for the episodic nature.

This book contains 6 stories. Only 2 of them are definitely SF. So I'm surprised it was picked in the vote. I've seen it picked in other SFF groups as well.

I read this long ago and will not re-read, but may read another of his books. They are all interconnected through repeating characters, though they are quite different from each other.

I encountered Cloud Atlas in this way: I was house-sitting for a friend with lots of books. This was on the coffee table and I started reading it. I was immediately hooked. Didn't finish it while at her house, but got another copy.

Story #2 in this book is about a composer and his helper. It reminded me very strongly of the film "Song of Summer" about composer Delius and his helper Eric Fenby. I've never seen Mitchel acknowledge that as inspiration, but it seems likely to me.

Story #6 is, he has stated, partially inspired by Riddley Walker, our book from last month.

It's widely considered a novel, not a short story collection, as I understand it. If all the narratives are linked/they can collectively be considered scifi/they build towards a conclusion or revelation that puts the total work under the umbrella of sci-fi (I'm being presumptuous at this stage, since I haven't read it all), then whether each section individually functions as standalone scifi is probably irrelevant. But either way, if it has a reputation as scifi and voters haven't read it, it's no surprise it would get picked, as it is a popular work.

The Scribbling Man wrote: "It's widely considered a novel, not a short story collection, as I understand it. If all the narratives are linked/they can collectively be considered scifi ..."

Yeah. He calls it a novel himself. And I don't worry much about genre boundaries. I like the ones that mix things up or try new things.

Nonetheless, it is accurate to say that it contains 6 stories.

Anyway, I did a bit of googling and he does, in fact, mention Delius as an inspiration. I hadn't found him say that back when I read the book.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/201...

Cloud Atlas is more like a novel than Jean Toomer's Cane or Ray Bradbury's Martian Chronicles. Those seem to be thematically connected short stories. Cloud Atlas has some interaction between the narrative lines and something that passes for plot progression.

I'm listening on audio since I already read the print book a few years ago. This is one of my all-time favorites although what I most appreciate is how beautifully it's written and how each story has a unique style that is appropriate for its time period and subject matter.

Already on my revisit I am picking up things I didn't really notice on the first go 'round, which supports my supposition that the novel is one that rewards repeated readings.

I've heard of people who read the book as a collection of stories. For example, read the first part of the first story, then skip to the end and read the final part of the first story, then read the first part of the second story and skip to the second part of the second story, etc. If I revisit the book in print maybe I'll try that sometime and see how it changes the experience, but in general I prefer to read books the way the author envisioned them to be read.

The movie version makes some changes and additions to the plot, and it bounces back and forth between stories more than once. I really enjoyed the film but I think it might be more rewarding for those who had already read the book (a change of pace, since usually those who love the book hate the film - see Harry Potter series for more on that phenomenon).

The final line of the novel is one that has remained with me: "Yet what is any ocean, but a multitude of drops?"

^^ maybe spoiler tag the last line of the book?

Ed wrote: "This book contains 6 stories. Only 2 of them are definitely SF. So I'm surprised it was picked in the vote. I've seen it picked in other SFF groups as well."

I view it as an SF work because all stories are supposedly in the same universe (on the same Earth) and they can be seen as linked

I'm not arguing whether this counts as SF or not. I'm just saying I'm surprised this got picked here. It is published as mainstream literature and there are lots of more explicitly SF works to choose from.

All of Mitchell's novels are connected in the same universe. So, for example, this is also connected to "Slade House" which is what I consider fantasy / horror.

I went to the library today and picked-up "Utopia Avenue". I've only read a few pages so far, but I know it connects to Cloud Atlas through at least 2 characters (the composer, and Luisa Rey.) The link to the composer is fairly trivial -- someone listens to his music. It is just an Easter egg for fans, and shows that he is trying to keep a single continuity.

Despite the connections, the books, and even sections in the books, have different "voices" or "styles" or whatever you want to call it. It amazes me that Mitchell can work so well with so many different voices.

Thomas wrote: "Cloud Atlas is more like a novel than ... Ray Bradbury's Martian Chronicles."

Agreed. But I don't mind if someone wants to call "Marian Chronicles" a novel.

I've read 4 sections now. They are distinct, but not so distinct that it feels like a different author. The voice of the protagonist in both the musician segment and the Knuckle Sandwich segment feel quite similar to me. And I'd say that across segments 2-4 there are characters that display a certain verbose frustration at the world they inhabit (the world of music, the world of journalism, the world in general).

Currently struggling through the Orison of Somni segment. Given that it's the first whiff of explicit sci-fi, it's the least compelling for me so far. Pretty tedious and slow going.

That was one of my favorite sections! (I also greatly enjoyed the Knuckle Sandwich segment.) The only segment I don't like is the 6th, central story.

Finally finished. Loved the first round of stories but it became a slog in the back half.

Don’t think anyone can criticise the quality of the writing. The styles were all different and matched the stories. The characters were interesting. The worlds were vividly captured with sometimes disturbing detail. There was a sense of drama in every tale.

What disappointed me was the binding glue. It felt a bit ham fisted at times. Quirky. Lazy. Surface connections. Books. Music. Letters. Omni. At a deeper level the stories were connected, but for me only at an intellectual level that felt flimsy at best. Thematically, yes. Six tales on the exploitative nature of humanity but…

Emotionally it just didn’t resonate.

As a SF fan I would have liked the reincarnation angle fleshed out a bit more. This was not really the kind of book I would have expected in a SF group.

I've slowed down considerably, mainly due to the Orison of Somni segment. About to start the last story segment before we get to the story conclusions. I'm more looking forward to the conclusions of certain stories than I am having the book wrapped up as a whole. I'm not convinced I'm going to be all that satisfied by the overarching thematic.

I've started the re-read, currently at the first chapter. The style is a great representation of its age, including the attitudes

The Scribbling Man wrote: "^^ maybe spoiler tag the last line of the book?"

Sure thing. Just let me know which plot element it spoiled for you.

Andrew wrote: "...This was not really the kind of book I would have expected in a SF group."

Yeah, I think this is a tough sell as "Sci-Fi." There are definitely Sci-Fi elements to the fifth story and the sixth story but I wouldn't call the book a Sci-Fi book. I'm glad to have the chance to revisit it though. I think the prose is beautiful and the second time around some of the connections pop out a bit more to me.

I'm listening to the audiobook this time, and they use six different narrators for the six different stories. I'm on the first half of story 2 right now. Unfortunately, Scott Brick narrated the first story. He's the guy who ruined the audio version of Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? by Philip K. Dick so his voice really puts me on edge. It's harder to follow Mitchell's ornate prose while I'm driving around, so I've found I have to rewind a lot.

RJ - Slayer of Trolls wrote: "The Scribbling Man wrote: "^^ maybe spoiler tag the last line of the book?"

Sure thing. Just let me know which plot element it spoiled for you."

Since I haven't finished the book, I wouldn't know. But I don't think it's an unreasonable request for the last line of a book not to be dropped on a discussion thread where people are mid-read and spoiler tags can be easily utilised. Personally, I'm someone who likes to go in as blind as possible. I would rather not have passages from later in the book impacting the context in which I read it now.

I plan to finish my re-read today. A few questions for a discussion
1. the comet-like birthmark - does it mean that all characters are related or more general 'all people are brothers (and sisters)'?
2. are all stories in the same reality, or some of them are from different realities?
3. Why the author decided to split the story?
4. What does the title refer to?

1. I think Mitchel uses the term "transmigrating souls". There is lots of discussion on various sites, with lots of ideas. One long discussion is here:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

2. Generally all of his books are set in the same reality. He has said that when writing new books he goes back to check that it all fits with what he has said before. On the other hand, the story of Luisa Rey (view spoiler)[is revealed to be a novel. But it could be a novel about a real person. And Louisa Rey is a real character in "Utopia Avenue".
(hide spoiler)]

Not sure if you've read "Bone Clocks" or "Slade House" but they (view spoiler)[include supernatural stuff where magicians (or something like that) can occupy someone's mind. (hide spoiler)]

3. He said something along the lines of "Why not".

4. From wikipedia, it was inspired by a piano work by Toshi Ichiyanagi. Mitchell has stated that the title and the book address (view spoiler)[reincarnation and the universality of human nature, with the title referring to a changing landscape (a "cloud") over manifestations of fixed human nature (the "atlas"). (hide spoiler)]

The Scribbling Man wrote: "^^ maybe spoiler tag the last line of the book?"

This line doesn't spoil anything in my opinion, but I understand opinions differ. Too late for you to avoid having seen it.

If the last line were "... and it was all a dream", or "The butler did it.", then I would insist on spoiler tags.

In this case, R.J. can add spoiler tags, or not, as he wishes.

Oleksandr - re: birthmarks

There is a line in one of the stories that poses the idea that they are all reincarnations of the same soul. Other details support this such as the feeling characters get when they come across an artefact from a previous era.

The Scribbling Man wrote: "...Personally, I'm someone who likes to go in as blind as possible. I would rather not have passages from later in the book impacting the context in which I read it now."

Ah, now I understand. You're confusing your personal reading preference with "spoilers." Maybe don't visit the book discussion thread until you've finished the book? That's what I do and it works for me. Anyway, hope that helps.

Ed wrote: "...In this case, R.J. can add spoiler tags, or not, as he wishes."

Thanks, Ed. I don't think I will in this case since there's really no plot spoiler of any kind. It's a beautiful line of prose that has taken on a life of its own. I seem to recall it closes out the film version as well. You can actually buy it as a wall decoration or even t-shirts: https://www.redbubble.com/i/t-shirt/W...

It reminds me of the final line in A Tale of Two Cities ("It is a far, far better thing that I do...") which is also repeated out of context of the book at times; I think it is even used in Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, but I could be mistaken - I know Kirk speaks the first sentence from that Dickens book and of course Khan spouts a few lines from Moby-Dick or, the Whale.

Anyway, back to the book discussion...

Oleksandr wrote: "I plan to finish my re-read today. A few questions for a discussion
1. the comet-like birthmark - does it mean that all characters are related or more general 'all people are brothers (and sisters)..."

I think those are great questions, Oleksandr. And I enjoyed the answers Ed posted, although I suspect that Mitchell might be a little "cheeky" with some of them. I think he's one of those authors who doesn't really like to explain himself too much and would prefer the reader apply their own interpretation.

Personally I never subscribed to the reincarnation interpretation of how and why these stories are related. I've always thought it was Mitchell's more general way of pointing out how actions and events echo forward - and maybe even backward? - in time. But the film, which cast Tom Hanks in each of the stories, seems to support the reincarnation theory. So who knows? I might be "wrong" but I think there are probably a lot of different ways of looking at this book and a lot of different meanings that can be taken from it.

I'm enjoying hearing what everyone thinks so far.

My review https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

I read this book in 2005. I’ve since read several others of the author’s novels, and there’s at least one more I want to read. (The Thousand Autumns of Jacob de Zoet). My memories of this one aren’t fresh or detailed, but I did enjoy it. I remember that I was impressed by the author’s storytelling ability and the way he made the book’s odd structure work. However I don’t think I understood why he did it that way.

Stephen wrote: "...I remember that I was impressed by the author’s storytelling ability and the way he made the book’s odd structure work. However I don’t think I understood why he did it that way."

A couple days ago I read somewhere - Wikipedia probably - that Mitchell was inspired to some degree by If on a Winter's Night a Traveler by Italo Calvino which I happened to read earlier this year. In that book, (view spoiler)[the "main" story is told in the 2nd person and the story involves you, the reader, reading the first chapter of several other unrelated books interwoven with your own story. (hide spoiler)] I hadn't thought of it, but the structures of the two books do obviously have some similarities.

I often find it interesting what authors have read. Thanks RJ - Slayer of Trolls. Years ago I read Ender’s Game and then found a list of Card's favorite sci fi books. I put them on my list since I enjoyed Ender's Game so much.

Well I finally did start. Don't think I will manage to finish in August tho. Saw the film some time ago, liked it but details are fuzzy enough that I should enjoy the read as something almost new.

Just finished it. I do think it's an interesting choice to split 5 of the stories into 2 parts since they seem to continue the story, not present a new one about each character.
I enjoyed the Somni-451 sections as well as the Cavendish ones. I think the humor in the Cavendish story was what had me interested in that one! And I'm always fascinated with robot/AI stories.
I don't know why the stories are split though.

I'm on the second part of the Rey Mystery segment. The Somni and middle segment were big slogs for me, and I think knowing that Mitchell was "influenced" by Riddley Walker (last month's read) didn't put it in a favourable light for me. I too found the Cavendish story a fun one to read, and I think the rest will be easy reads too. The structure works so far, and i get that the symmetry probably helps in highlighting the nature of time and the interconnectedness of the characters, but I am disappointed there isn't more of a connection, or at least new information revealed that puts the rest of the stories in an interesting light (maybe not too late for that). Consequently, I think it comes across a bit gimmicky and not ideal for pacing. I've already forgotten half the names from the current story I'm on so am automatically less invested.

I do agree The Scribbling Man, I was hoping the connections would be stronger.
That's a good point about time being interconnected