Tournament of Books discussion

Hi all!
It is time to make some decisions about the potential for a summer/fall tournament of favorite books that haven’t made the ToB. Last year, we did boosts from odd-year long lists… we can do the even years next OR maybe a themed event? Short story collections? Genre fiction?

The nomination process should start soon, so that we can make a long list by the end of the month, or maybe April 15 by the latest. I will start cleaning up the even years lists in the meantime, in case we stick with that plan, but if you have ideas, opinions, or the desire to help out please chime in!

In looking back over the 2022 ToF, I realized we've already done even years!

So... there are still lots of good books on those lists, do we just dive back in for a new round of nominees? Or do something different?

Chrissy wrote: "In looking back over the 2022 ToF, I realized we've already done even years!

So... there are still lots of good books on those lists, do we just dive back in for a new round of nominees? Or do som..."

Thanks so much for kicking this off, Chrissy! A couple of years ago Maggie asked for ideas, they’re listed in the front of this thread. https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/... There are some great suggestions. I wonder if it might make sense to take a poll?

It seemed at the time that people were most interested in keeping things focused on ToB longlists. Given that we are a little behind schedule, a pre-poll seems like a lot.

I think there are still a ton of things left on the even year's lists to choose from, so I'm fine going that way.

I'm also fine with using the full list of lists (not just even years) but limiting nominations by genre or format (i.e. short story collections). That would require people having knowledge of genre (or checking before they nominate) though.

I have the even list spreadsheet ready to go, and I am pretty sure I will use a Listopia for the nomination process to keep things easy.

I'm still open to other ideas, but in the interest of getting things moving, here is the listopia for nominations of even year books:

https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/1...

The spreadsheet of eligible titles is in the list's description, but here it is again:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...

(I've added about 15 nominations of books I have been meaning to read!)

I’m so deeply grateful that we are doing this again. I know it’s probably heresy to admit this, but … while I love reading the judges’ decisions and the commentariat insights during the ToB, I’ve found the ToF to be a much more fulfilling reading experience than the ToB.

Have we ever considered picking a pre-TOB year and picking 8-10 books from that year? 2005 was the first TOB reading 2004 books...so, 2003 books? Just a thought.

That 2012 list is soooooo long.

Bob wrote: "Have we ever considered picking a pre-TOB year and picking 8-10 books from that year? 2005 was the first TOB reading 2004 books...so, 2003 books? Just a thought."

This is a great idea, at same time, I was 14 in 2003 and not reading much that didn't rhyme with arry potter, ord of the rings, or arnia. But I would be happy to receive lots of suggestions on books to read.

Bob wrote: "Have we ever considered picking a pre-TOB year and picking 8-10 books from that year? 2005 was the first TOB reading 2004 books...so, 2003 books? Just a thought."

Here is a bunch of possibilities https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/p...

I like the idea of 2004, 2003, etc. books. I also really like the concept of doing genre selections - though would it be all genres, mystery v romance v sci-fi?

Risa wrote: "I’m so deeply grateful that we are doing this again. I know it’s probably heresy to admit this, but … while I love reading the judges’ decisions and the commentariat insights during the ToB, I’ve f..."

So much agree, these books are actual choices, by people I trust, not created by random number generators!

I’m happy with whatever is decided.

Emily is still in for organizing with me! (I got confused by shared screen names… oops.)

We are leaning toward books from just the 2024 long list, which will be repeatable strategy if we continue running this year after year. Any objections? I do have an idea for a little twist, but more on that later this week if it works out.

Thanks for keeping this going! I would be fine with just 2024 longlist books to vote on (although I think the best books of 2024 didn’t make the longlist). But I’d also be happy with a nominating process (people adding their picks to the list you made) that includes longlist books from all even years. This could include even years before the ToB—books that people think would have been on the longlist. But in general, I like the idea of a nominating process where each book up for a vote has at least one passionate supporter, compared to voting within that huge list of all the previous longlisters. As long as people keep it reasonable on the nominations (max of 5-10 per person, assuming there will be overlap on favorites, etc.) that could be a fun way to try it.

But since I don’t have the capacity to join the leadership team this year, I won’t be too picky about this and will just go along with what’s chosen.

Chrissy wrote: "We are leaning toward books from just the 2024 long list, which will be repeatable strategy if we continue ..."

This sounds like a great idea to me.

Chrissy, are you thinking to go with eight books for the whole tournament?

Lauren, would it be possible to either add me or Emily to the group moderation team for the time being? I was thinking of using the polls function for some voting, but can’t set that up as just a member of the group? The other option is to just send you the poll to set up for us.

Phyllis wrote: "Chrissy, are you thinking to go with eight books for the whole tournament?"

Yes, there will be 8 books. More details will be forthcoming, along with links for voting - hopefully by this weekend! We want to close voting by the end of the month/close of the ToB.

I would love to add more people as moderators for this group. I’m currently traveling without my laptop, and it looks like I can’t do that from my phone. I get home late tomorrow night but will set a reminder to add folks on Thursday.

Thanks! I think that means we will be ready to announce and open up voting by Friday!

Wow, this is coming together quickly! Huge thanks to Chrissy, Emily, Lauren and everyone who’s making this happen!

Thanks from me too!! I have so enjoyed The Tournament of Favorites the last few years. I’ll volunteer to write a judgement again.

Kip wrote: "Bob wrote: "Have we ever considered picking a pre-TOB year and picking 8-10 books from that year? 2005 was the first TOB reading 2004 books...so, 2003 books? Just a thought."

This is a great idea,..."

I'm still getting over "I was 14 in 2003"! I, OTOH, was closing in on 40 ....

Kip, you Babe in the Woods, you! ;-)

I look forward to learning from The Youth again this ToF.

https://www.theatlantic.com/books/arc...

This is a list that is rife for debate obviously, but two things of note for me.

1. Percival Everett made the list as he should, it was for Erasure but I also think Trees might be just as good for a list like this.
2. Most of the recent books were also ToB books.

Why not two Everett books? The Trees is an absolute masterpiece.

I don't understand why The Handmaid's Tale didn't make it. Yes, she's Canadian, but the impact it's had is beyond boundaries. Hmph.

Kip wrote: "https://www.theatlantic.com/books/arc...

This is a list that is rife for debate obviously, but two things of note for me.

1. Percival Everett made the..."

Wow, was this list ever humbling!
I consider myself a moderately well-read person and there were quite a few titles on here of which I had never heard, including (insert deep YIKES here) one by a fellow University faculty colleague with whom I served on our public library board of trustees for several years.
I had absolutely NO idea. SIGH.

Time to grow my TBR pile yet further .... Thank you (I think), Kip.

Kip wrote: "...I was 14 in 2003..."

You spring chicken you. I'm sure us oldies have lots of suggestions for you that were published pre-2005.

Your comment also reminded me of how funny I find it when I look back at prize winners from the decades before I was an adult reader and realize how few of them I am familiar with. The tough part is that it is getting more & more difficult for me to find living, breathing adults who can tell me the best & most interesting reading from those decades (darned if those folks don't keep on dying off).

The beauty of our goodreads groups is I get so many book suggestions from so many different generations, none of which I get much of in real-life. I can then take those recs, add them to my TBR which I then ignore to read whatever the newest literary fiction of the month is.

Kip wrote: "The beauty of our goodreads groups is I get so many book suggestions from so many different generations, none of which I get much of in real-life. I can then take those recs, add them to my TBR whi..."

That’s hilarious. Why do the amazing sounding 2023 books I was so excited to read, but never got around to, seem so much less interesting because it’s 2024? This happens every dang year.

Just this past week, my (almost 38-yr-old son) and I were calculating how many more books I can reasonably expect to read before I croak, and therefore how many more bookshelves I need to purchase, build, and make space for in my house. He went into my living room to estimate the existing number of "TBR" novels on my shelves, then returned to give me a rough answer to my question; his response allowed me enough books to get from my current age to 80 yo. He assured me he intended that as the minimum number of shelves/books I would need, and not the maximum..

Phyllis wrote: "Just this past week, my (almost 38-yr-old son) and I were calculating how many more books I can reasonably expect to read before I croak, and therefore how many more bookshelves I need to purchase,..."

The most unintentionally discouraging comment I ever read here was from one of our fellow commentariat members who told me that I should not count on increasing in retirement my number of books read because it turns out that you either have less time than you'd presumed you would or you don't want to read as many books as you'd assumed you'll want to. I mean, I WAS, in fact, counting on reading far more books in my retirement. Sigh. Well. In fairness to that commentariat member, I probably won't retire any time soon anyway, though many of my 60 year old peers are doing so!

My parents have read more in retirement for what it's worth! I also monitor the Parnassus Books events page for them and send them to the readings I want to go to so I can live vicariously through them.

Kip wrote: "My parents have read more in retirement for what it's worth! I also monitor the Parnassus Books events page for them and send them to the readings I want to go to so I can live vicariously through ..."

That does, actually, make me feel better, Kip!

I hope it wasn’t me Risa who discouraged you. It certainly was not my intent. My first couple of years of retirement I did read more….a lot more. But then I found that I disliked a lot of what I was reading so I read less (I share your revulsion for Tender is the Flesh). I became pickier about what I read and only attempted the ones I felt I would enjoy or learn something from. I DNF a lot more. I stopped reading on vacation because I wanted to do more active things. I stopped reading at night because I would drift off to sleep in just a few minutes. When I broke my ankIe I thought I would read more but for some reason my concentration was shot. I read medical articles to self-diagnose my complications. I started watching more television and movies and discovered I had missed decades of pop culture references. I switched mostly to audiobooks because my vision suffers if I read very long and it takes longer to listen to an audiobook than to read print. I discovered I own enough books for two reading lifetimes even if I never read another new release. For anyone who thinks simply reading more should be a goal I would recommend the book Why We Read, on Bookworms, Libraries and Just One More Page Before
Lights Out by Shannon Reed. She puts everything into perspective. And I hope you have a wonderful retirement filled with

I was going to say filled with good books, great health and wonderful adventures.

Risa, I've read SO much more in retirement than I have for years!! I get in about 100 a year recently and life allowed so little before when I worked. And now I can read whatever I want instead of work related material. It will be what you make it be! I am reminded of how much I hibernated in my room as a kid, reading, and feel like I'm right back there now, finally. And I'm loving it. Keep the faith!

Lauren wrote: "I would love to add more people as moderators for this group. I’m currently traveling without my laptop, and it looks like I can’t do that from my phone. I get home late tomorrow night but will set..."

Are we still on for this? Emily and I will hopefully be talking in a bit to finalize some stuff.

Chrissy wrote: "Lauren wrote: "I would love to add more people as moderators for this group. I’m currently traveling without my laptop, and it looks like I can’t do that from my phone. I get home late tomorrow nig..."

Just added you! There are many Emilys in the group, so I don't know which one to add. I think you can make the addition (from the members list) now that you have moderator status. :)

Everyone!!

Polls open TOMORROW for your picks - the Tournament of Favorites is back!

This year’s tournament will focus on fiction from last year (published in 2023). One side of the bracket (4 books) will be voted in by our members from the ToB long list, giving a second chance to our favorites that didn’t make the official tournament this year. The other side will be books that shoulda/woulda/coulda made the tournament, but didn’t get selected for the long list at all!

This means voting will occur in 2 parts. A “dot poll” for the books from the ToB long list will give each voter 4 “dots” or votes to allocate. You can put all 4 on one book you really love, or split them up among 4 different books, or do any combination of dots on any number of books that add up to 4. The 4 books with the most total dots will make the tournament, and seeds will be based on ranking. Visit this link to vote!

https://pollunit.com/en/polls/uvramkd...
(Will open tomorrow morning.)

For the other half of the bracket, we’ll vote from a list of well-loved books that came out last year, qualified for ToB, but that didn’t make it to the long list. This list will be seeded with a few favorites from your organizers, and you can choose to vote for one of them or write in your own choice. Each person will get only one vote, but the top 4 will make it to our bracket. This poll will be on our Goodreads group homepage tomorrow morning.

Both of these polls will close on the night of March 27. If there is a tie for either side of the bracket, we will have a run-off vote, also via Goodreads poll, between March 28 and March 31.

Info about zombie voting will come once the brackets are finalized, to give voters as much time as possible time to read the selected books before voting.

If Marie Kondo were here I would tell her, “I’m definitely keeping this because it brings me so much joy!” Thank you, Chrissy et al!

Risa wrote: "If Marie Kondo were here I would tell her, “I’m definitely keeping this because it brings me so much joy!” Thank you, Chrissy et al!"

Ha, yes! I love the chance for non-official books to have a chance. I think the ToB really missed out on some of the best of 2023, like:
Sea Change
Pomegranate
What We Kept to Ourselves
Where There Was Fire
The God of Good Looks
We Are a Haunting
Tropicália
Brotherless Night

Ok sorry, I'll stop there. So many missed opportunities!

Chrissy wrote: "Everyone!!

Polls open TOMORROW for your picks - the Tournament of Favorites is back!

This year’s tournament will focus on fiction from last year (published in 2023). One side of the bracket (4 bo..."

THANK YOU, CHRISSY! DONE. (We need to figure out how to give folks digital "I Voted in ToF'24" stickers. ;-)

Note to my fellow voters -- this poll has TWO screens worth of options. I almost missed the second screen, which would have meant omitting "Wellness" by Nathan Hill. (Saved by last-minute uptick in reading comprehension! Chrissy TRIED to tell me, and I was originally too hasty in reading past her good instructions.)

There are SO many great options here!
Very exciting!

Same Bed, Different Dreams and Menewood are on page 1 so don't worry about page 2.

Don't forget, there are 2 different places to vote! A lot more people have voted on the dot poll than on the GR poll for non-longlist books. Here's a link that should take you right there, if you weren't sure where to find it:
https://www.goodreads.com/poll/list/3...

Elizabeth wrote: "That’s hilarious. Why do the amazing sounding 2023 books I was so excited to read, but never got around to, seem so much less interesting because it’s 2024? This happens every dang year...."



YES WHY IS THAT!?? Every year I am SO excited, all these fresh new books coming! And then a few months later I wonder why I was even interested in half of them. Even, sometimes, when December rolls into January, I will lose interest in that previous year's books. I am so fickle

Phyllis wrote: "Just this past week, my (almost 38-yr-old son) and I were calculating how many more books I can reasonably expect to read before I croak, and therefore how many more bookshelves I need to purchase,..."



I think about this some times and it is depressing. Based on the number of books I read each year, and the number of new books I add to my list each year, I will NEVER live long enough to read all of the books on my TBR list. As a result, I've tried to be more aggressive about taking books off my TBR list. Then I think "well maybe my kids can pick a book from my list to read in my memory" and that just gets too depressing and I have to stop thinking about it.

Chrissy wrote: "Don't forget, there are 2 different places to vote! A lot more people have voted on the dot poll than on the GR poll for non-longlist books. Here's a link that should take you right there, if you w..."

Are we allowed to lobby? I encourage everyone here to vote for the non-list book North Woods by Daniel Mason!

Kip wrote: "https://www.theatlantic.com/books/arc...

This is a list that is rife for debate obviously, but two things of note for me.

1. Percival Everett made the..."


That is such a great list!! Odd that they don't include anything by Denis Johnson though, and a few of those authors I don't think of as "American" (like Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie - I know she's spent some time living in the USA, but isn't she still a Nigerian citizen?)

Does it exist as a Listopia yet? I like seeing at a glance how many I've read...

Phyllis wrote: "I encourage everyone here to vote for the non-list book North Woods by Daniel Mason!"

One of the rare times there is only one correct answer.

Nadine in NY wrote: "Kip wrote: Does it exist as a Listopia yet? I like seeing at a glance how many I've read..."

https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/1...

Kip wrote: "Nadine in NY wrote: "Kip wrote: Does it exist as a Listopia yet? I like seeing at a glance how many I've read..."

https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/1... ..."



awesome! thanks!