Underground Knowledge — A discussion group discussion

I guess this will be seen by some as a "lunatic fringe" theory but without any conspiracy that I'm aware of.
I spend a lot of time kayaking on the waters near my home here in the Bay of Islands, New Zealand. I come face to face with many different kinds of marine beings, including sharks, orca, dolphins, rays etc.
Over my life I've thought about facts such as life having started in the ocean, cetaceans (dolphins and whales) having huge complex brains with zones for which humans have no explanation, the length of time (millions of years) some of these animals were evolved before our own ancestors came down from the trees. Also the important fact that cetaceans lack the distraction of hands. Hands are what makes our own species so obsessed with material "stuff".
So I sit here and wonder what might be going on in the marine idea-sphere which I think of as "Ocean Mind"
Lacking the distraction of material stuff, might these marine beings have developed intellectual skills we have no concept or understanding of? And might our efforts to understand be something like a mouse or rat attempting to understand what is going on in the human mind? (I hope I'm not insulting rats who are probably cleverer than I think)
In view of those facts, is it that crazy to imagine this stuff?
Or ought the human species give these beings the benefit of the doubt and grant them legal "person-hood" as original owners of their oceans, viewing them as the ultimate indigenous people of this planet. Instead of doing what we do, which includes filling their world with plastic garbage which entangles and kills them, running them down with our ships,maiming and killing them with our whirling propeller blades, killing them with our nets and floating factories, poisoning them with our pollutants, etc etc.
There actually already movements afoot in the world to grant such beings legal person-hood. I'm not the first to think of this by any stretch.
Any responses?

There may be something to this especially considering that some ocean dwellers have abilities such as sonar/echolocation etc. Who knows what other brain capabilities they may have.

I’ve also never thought about how we may be obsessed or burdened with materialism simply because we have hands. A very interesting theory, that seems to track the more I think about it. I’d even go as far and say that it could be due to all of our senses.

Tui wrote: "I guess this will be seen by some as a "lunatic fringe" theory but without any conspiracy that I'm aware of.
I spend a lot of time kayaking on the waters near my home here in the Bay of Islands, Ne..."

Hi guys, a very interesting discussion!

What makes human a dominant animal?
1. his ability to move within/use as a resource any part of the planet, such as ocean, atmosphere, the land; most animals cannot do that
2. having 5 senses (not all animals have all 5, right?)
3. being able to behave like any animal- having the widest variety of behavioral patterns so to speak- brave as a lion, sly as a fox, timid as a rabbit etc
4. having hands as a sophisticated manual tool for many jobs

And yes, it is fascinating to think that other forms of life- such as those who lives in the oceans- could be more intelligent than us :o)

And also- is it " inevitable" that evolution had to progress to having a "dominant animal"?

Dr Jasmine

In my opinion,most animals evolve to be prominent in a niche. They can never be dominant because the adjacent niche has something better there. However, anything that can become adequate in many niches will be predominant. In the plant life, the best example is grass. It can't choke out much, but it is everywhere.

Ian wrote: "In my opinion,most animals evolve to be prominent in a niche. They can never be dominant because the adjacent niche has something better there. However, anything that can become adequate in many ni..."

Thank you, Ian :o) This is quite funny ... the human and the grass! the dominant species :)