Crime, Mysteries & Thrillers discussion

Welcome to our discussion on Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy, by John Le Carre, which is part of our Fall/Winter Collection Group Reads. Your discussion leader is Lisa.
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About spoilers

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Summary

A modern classic in which John le Carré expertly creates a total vision of a secret world, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy begins George Smiley's chess match of wills and wits with Karla, his Soviet counterpart.

It is now beyond a doubt that a mole, implanted decades ago by Moscow Centre, has burrowed his way into the highest echelons of British Intelligence. His treachery has already blown some of its most vital operations and its best networks. It is clear that the double agent is one of its own kind. But which one? George Smiley is assigned to identify him. And once identified, the traitor must be destroyed.

Hello and Happy Halloween! Looking forward to moving into spy territory in November. Who is in for this one?

I'm going to attempt this one. I believe I started it previously (years ago) and for whatever reason I abandoned it. I'm going to check out the audio version. I can generally get through an audio book even if I can't get through reading.

I have some serious knitting to do so I'm going to put on some books and knit my fingers off.

I think I just checked it out from my library digital section. I'll have to plug stuff in and get back to you. 😄

Yippee I did it right and have it downloaded onto my Kindle.

I'm having to go back and forth to keep up with who's who.

This makes me smile every time - Circus, the trade-name for British Intelligence.

I'm waiting on everyone's comments on this one before I say too much.

I'm going to see if I can find the movie.

I'm almost done with an audio a different audio book, so I downloaded this as an audio. I hope I can get through it this time.

˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "Yippee I did it right and have it downloaded onto my Kindle."

I call myself "tech-challenged" I always get tickled when I do something like that correctly.

I'm so sorry, everyone, I've not been getting notifications on this thread, and just thought no one else was reading. I should have gone in and checked.

Anyhoo, I need to get crackin' as I'm just about a third in. I can say that I love Jim Prideaux, and I'm enjoying the humor. I am also having a bit of trouble keeping up with characters and what exactly is happening...there's a bit of lingo being used here that's above my pay grade. Will check in with you all again soon :)

I did find the movie but didn't watch it all because it was awful.

I don't know if this contains spoilers so I'm going to "hide" this list of characters...

(view spoiler)[ George Smiley – Formerly a senior officer in the Circus, who was pushed out at the same time as Control, his mentor. Smiley's timid nature and unassuming appearance belies his keen understanding of spycraft. He is called upon to investigate the presence of a Soviet mole in the Circus. Various inspirations for Smiley have been suggested, including le Carré's superior in MI5, John Bingham, and MI6 chief Maurice Oldfield (who took the position in 1973, a year before the book was published).

Peter Guillam — Head of the scalphunters, the section of the Circus used in operations that require physical action and/or violence. Previously the head of Satellites Four, in charge of East German operations, he was "exiled" to the scalphunters outstation in Brixton after Control was dismissed. Son of a French businessman and an Englishwoman, he is a longtime associate of Smiley's.

Jim Prideaux — Former field agent and head of the scalphunters, Prideaux was shot in Czechoslovakia under the codename "Jim Ellis" during Operation Testify and kept in Soviet captivity. Now teaches at a boys' prep school. He was first identified as a prospective recruit by fellow student Bill Haydon at Oxford.

Control — Longtime head of the Circus, now dead. Once a Cambridge don, he becomes convinced that one of his subordinates is a Soviet agent, and spends the last years of his tenure trying to uncover them.

Sir Percy Alleline — Chief of the Circus following Control's ousting. Alleline spent his early career in South America, northern Africa and India. He is vain and overambitious, and is despised by Control. Alleline is knighted in the course of the book in recognition of the quality of the intelligence provided by the source codenamed Merlin.

Bill Haydon — Commander of London Station, he has worked with the Circus since the war. A polymath, he was recruited at Oxford where he was a close companion of Prideaux. A distant cousin of Ann Smiley, he has an affair with her, and this knowledge subsequently becomes widely known. One of the four who ran the double agent codenamed Merlin.

Roy Bland — Second in command of London Station to Bill Haydon. Recruited by Smiley at Oxford, he was the top specialist in Soviet satellite states and spent several years undercover as a left-wing academic in the Balkans before being instated in the Circus.

Toby Esterhase — He is the head of the Acton lamplighters, the section of the Circus responsible for surveillance and wiretapping. Hungarian by birth, Esterhase is an anglophile with pretensions of being a British gentleman. He was recruited by Smiley as "a starving student in Vienna."

Oliver Lacon — A permanent secretary in the Cabinet Office. Civilian overseer of the Circus. A former Cambridge rowing blue; his father "a dignitary of the Scottish church" and his mother "something noble."

Mendel — Retired former inspector in the Special Branch, he assists Smiley during his investigation. Frequently a go-between for Smiley and other members helping him investigate.

Connie Sachs — Former Russia analyst for the Circus, she is forced to retire, and now runs a rooming house in Oxford. Alcoholic, but with an excellent memory. She is said to have been modelled upon Milicent Bagot.

Ricki Tarr — A field agent and presumed defector who supplies information that indicates there is a Soviet mole in the Circus. He was trained by Smiley. Worked for Guillam as one of the scalphunters before going AWOL in Hong Kong.

Miles Sercombe — The government minister to whom Lacon and the Circus are responsible. A distant cousin of Smiley's wife, he plays a peripheral role in Smiley's investigation. Not highly Not highly regarded. (hide spoiler)]

Now for the "lingo"

Agent - An espionage agent or spy; a citizen who is recruited by a foreign government to spy on his own country. This term should not be confused with a member of an intelligence service who recruits spies; they are referred to as intelligence officers or more particularly case officers.

Babysitters -Bodyguards.

Burn - Blackmail.

Circus - The novel's name for SIS (Secret Intelligence Service), MI6, which collects foreign intelligence. "Circus" refers to the (fictional) location of its headquarters in Cambridge Circus, London.

Coat-trailing - An officer of one side acting as if he is a likely defector – drinking, complaining about his job – in the hope of attracting a recruitment offer from an enemy intelligence officer, with the object of becoming a double agent.

The Competition - MI5, the Security Service, the UK's internal counter-espionage and counter-terrorism service, which the Circus also calls "The Security Mob".

The Cousins - The US intelligence agencies in general and the CIA in particular.

Ferrets - Technicians who find and remove hidden microphones, cameras, etc.

Handwriting - An agent's particular style of espionage.

Honey trap - A sexual blackmailing operation.

Hood - An agent involved in criminality.

Housekeepers - The internal auditors and financial disciplinarians of the Circus.

Inquisitors - Interrogators who debrief Circus intelligence officers and defectors.

Janitors - The Circus headquarters operations staff, including those who watch doors and verify that people entering secure areas are authorised to do so.

Lamplighters - A section which provides surveillance and couriers.

Legend - A false identity

Mailfist job - An assassination operation. Mailfist might be the code word for such work or the compartmented information concerning the program that performs it.

Mole - An agent recruited long before he has access to secret material, who subsequently works his way into the target government organization. In his foreword to the 1991 edition, Le Carré discloses that he may have been under the impression "mole" was "current KGB jargon" during his brief stint as an intelligence officer but that he can no longer say for certain; it is possible he actually invented the term himself. Francis Bacon used the word "mole" in the sense of "spy" in his 1622 Historie of the Reigne of King Henry the Seventh, but Le Carré was not aware of Bacon's work while writing the book – the passage was pointed out to him later by a reader.

Mothers - Secretaries and trusted typists serving the senior officers of the Circus.

Neighbors - The Soviet intelligence services, in particular, the KGB and Karla's fictional "Thirteenth Directorate".

Nuts and Bolts - The engineering department that develop and manufacture espionage devices.

Pavement artists - Members of surveillance teams who inconspicuously follow people in public.

Persil - The cleanest security category available, used of questionable foreigners, "Clean as fabric washed in Persil".

Reptile fund - A slush fund, to provide payment for covert operations. (Attributed to Otto von Bismarck)

Scalphunters - Agents who handle assassination, blackmail, burglary, kidnapping; the section was sidelined after Control's dismissal.

Sweat - Interrogate

Wranglers - Radio signal analysts and cryptographers; it derives from the term wrangler used of Cambridge University maths students.

When I read a book like this or a Russian novel (which I'm partial to) I'll copy and past the characters and any jargon into a word doc and print it so I can refer to it when I write. I hope this helps.

edit: when I read

That's smart Gem but a lot of work.

˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "I did find the movie but didn't watch it all because it was awful."

Wow, really! I’ve always heard such good things. It’s been on my list forever, but this gives me pause. I think a knock against it that I have heard is that it’s a bit hard to follow. Was that your experience, Sheri?

Gem wrote: "Now for the "lingo"

Agent - An espionage agent or spy; a citizen who is recruited by a foreign government to spy on his own country. This term should not be confused with a member of an intelligen..."

Gem! This is fantastic - thank you!

I did think it was hard to follow and I just wasn't interested in doing it. I might try watching it again sometime.

˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "That's smart Gem but a lot of work."

No, just copy and paste.

Lisa wrote: "Gem wrote: "Now for the "lingo"... thank you!

Your welcome. I finished my other book this morning, hubby is finally sleeping so I'm going to start listening to this today or at least try, I wasn't able to get through this selection last time I tried to read it.

Gem wrote: "˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "That's smart Gem but a lot of work."

No, just copy and paste." hahahaha

I tried... this is the third time with this book. I listened to part 1 and had to stop. Not sure why it's not clicking for me.

Gem wrote: "I tried... this is the third time with this book. I listened to part 1 and had to stop. Not sure why it's not clicking for me."

And after reading it the movie just made it seem more complicated.

Lisa, give it a try and let us know what's wrong with us. Gem, I'm including you in that "us" 💕

Sheri and Gem, I think the same thing may be wrong with me...I just can't get into this book or follow it. I get the broad strokes, but all the nuance of what is happening or being discussed is just not sinking in. Gem, I had my iPad open next to me as I read to reference characters and your glossary. It was a blessing, but this is just not landing with me. Ugh, I hate to abandon a book but perhaps I should cut my losses and focus on our December read, Bad Axe County.

I rarely give up on a book but if I had it to do over this may be the one.

One of my all time favorites. I enjoy it that the late Mr. LeCarre did not spoon feed the story. You have to go in knowing that you will gradually be led to the story in an entertaining way.

˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "This makes me smile every time - Circus, the trade-name for British Intelligence."

Try 123movies it's free.

John wrote: "One of my all time favorites. I enjoy it that the late Mr. LeCarre did not spoon feed the story. You have to go in knowing that you will gradually be led to the story in an entertaining way."

I think if I'd had an idea going in I might have understood more.

I wonder if I should try to start this series from the beginning for a better experience. I don’t want to be spoonfed; on the contrary, I appreciate it when an author avoids doing so, but I just couldn’t grab on here.

TTSS is one of my favorite spy thrillers of all time. LeCarre in his prime is unsurpassed and George Smiley is one of the great literary characters.

I always find it interesting and fun to learn out what authors others enjoy reading.

I saw The Pigeon Tunnel on Apple TV which is an interview of John le Carré about his life and books. Fascinating. I think I'll read all his books.

I'm curious for the readers of TTSS - do you read the Smiley collection in order, and thus eventually come upon TTSS, or do you read it on its own? I've read The Spy Who Came in from the Cold and The Looking Glass War and am excited to be on TTSS now either way!

Cecilia wrote: "I'm curious for the readers of TTSS - do you read the Smiley collection in order, and thus eventually come upon TTSS, or do you read it on its own? I've read The Spy Who Came in from the Cold and T..."

I did not but think I would have understood his style and enjoyed it more if I had started from the beginning.

I think I might try the first one to see if it lands better for me. I hate to turn away from thistle one, as I feel like I’m missing out, but I just couldn’t get into it this time.

˜”*°•.˜”*°• Sheri •°*”˜.•°*”˜ wrote: "Lisa, give it a try and let us know what's wrong with us. Gem, I'm including you in that "us" 💕."
Then I'm in good company😁.

Lisa wrote: "Ugh, I hate to abandon a book but perhaps I should cut my losses and focus on our December read, Bad Axe County."

I used to push through and made myself finish as opposed to abandon, it felt like a failure. Yes, I put a lot of pressure on myself. But then it dawned on me that I'm doing this for pleasure and if a book is not a pleasure to read why struggle through it. Especially with how slowly I read.

I’ve been reading Le Carre’s books in order the last several years. In order - TTSS is actually the 5th Smiley book. The first 4 are:

1. Call for the Dead
2. A Murder of Quality
3. The Spy Who Came in From the Cold
4. The Looking Glass War

Apart from being introduced to a few characters in the earlier novels, I’m not sure if you actually need to read them in order. TTSS was written and set several years later, and while Control was introduced earlier, there’s not much I can think of where it’s essential. Luckily, the past information is also in the novel with the failed mission.

That being said, TTSS is my least favorite of the Smiley books, although I still haven’t gotten to The Secret Pilgrim and the recent one. Im in the minority on this though. I read more for story, as opposed to trying to figure out every detail of one like this. I did like the stories in A Call for the Dead, Spy Who Came in From the Cold, Looking Glass, and the Honourable Schoolboy, much more. Ironically, most of my favorites are the 3 where Smiley is a supporting character.