Ersatz TLS discussion

Welcome to the new thread!
Good reading to all and here's hoping for good outcomes for all health issues, especially at the moment Robert & scarletnoir.

Gpfr wrote: "Welcome to the new thread!
Good reading to all and here's hoping for good outcomes for all health issues, especially at the moment Robert & scarletnoir."


Thanks G, and more posts about books hopefully!! A bit of a slow burner the last one. I've gone back to crime, so to speak, after reading Henry V, currently

The owner of said hall decided to reenact for tv the locked room trick performed many years ago. Our policeman, not knowing the cameras would be there, is persuaded to go to see the performance. Of course, we all know that the owner is going to end up in the locked room dead. Easy enough reading without taxing the brain!

I read recently Sanctuary by Garry Disher, Australian crime writer. I've enjoyed his Hirsch series. This one is a stand-alone which I was a bit dubious about at first as it begins with a very unpleasant character, but liked well enough in the end although not as much as the others. Characters trying to escape, or catch up with, their pasts.

I've got the latest Alex Gray, Out of Darkness waiting. I think I've got you to thank for these, give.

. I very much enjoyed Penelope Fitzgerald's Innocence set in mid-1950s Italy.

Framley Parsonage And I'm continuing to enjoy my re-visit to Barsetshire. This is the 4th book of 6. A young parson, who has had the good fortune to be very comfortably situated, is dazzled by the company he's drawn into keeping and acts unwisely. The day of reckoning is at hand!

Gpfr wrote: " I read recently Sanctuary by Garry Disher, Australian crime writer. I've enjoyed his Hirsch series. This one is a stand-alone which I was a bit dubi..."

I think we do keep one another going on the crime novel side G. I am ashamed to say I haven't yet read any of the Barsetshire series, but keep meaning to.

BBC are showing the Wolf Hall The Mirror and the Light starting next Sunday at 9pm. They showed the first episode of the first series last night but I can't see if they are repeating the other episodes, which seems a bit odd.

Thanks for the new thread, GP.

As the clocks have gone back and it’s now getting dark at tea-time I thought I would mention the best Christmas murder mystery I ever read (not that I have anything like the knowledge of the real aficianados here): An English Murder, by Cyril Hare. Atmospheric, witty, and not at all nasty. As the blurb says, the snow is thick, the phone line is down, and no one is getting in or out of Warbeck Hall. It’s long enough since I read it to forget what actually happens, so I’m looking forward to pulling up a chair in front of the fire and re-reading it.

Logger24 wrote: "As the clocks have gone back and it’s now getting dark at tea-time I thought I would mention the best Christmas murder mystery I ever read ..."

Oh, goodness, Christmas books already! ❄☃ 😀 I'll look out for that one.
Here are 2 others with snow deep on the ground. In 2020 on something I was listening to there was a recommendation for The Case of the Abominable Snowman by Nicholas Blake (C Day-Lewis). I went on to read the others with his detective Nigel Strangeways.
And I more recently came across a 2nd-hand Michael Innes: There Came Both Mist And Snow, one of the old green Penguins.

Gpfr wrote: " I read recently Sanctuary by Garry Disher, Australian crime writer. I've enjoyed his Hirsch series. This one is a stand-alone which I was a bit dubi..."

I've read and liked four (all?) books in the Hirsch series, but tried one from another series - 'Peninsula Crimes' - and liked it far less, as the plot was unconvincing and the protagonist less engaging. I may try another Disher, eventually...

It's interesting how some authors seem to hit a sweet spot with a particular character, but fail to repeat the magic when attempting another - at least, from my POV of course. An example is Elly Griffiths - I enjoyed the Ruth Galloway series, but sampled one of the 'Brighton Mysteries' and didn't care for it - iirc, it didn't 'feel right' for the period which was close to the time I was a kid and so remember it - Griffiths is younger and so doesn't.

There are probably other 'cases' which may come back to me.

scarletnoir wrote: "Gpfr wrote: " I read recently Sanctuary by Garry Disher, Australian crime writer. I've enjoyed his Hirsch series. This one is a stand-alone which I w..."

I enjoyed the first few of the Ruth Galloway series but then got fed up of the latest domestic problem Ruth/Nelson/Nelson's wife/ the boyfriend going on through one book, right through the next and into the third I'm afraid.

giveusaclue wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: " Elly Griffiths - I enjoyed the Ruth Galloway series, but sampled one of the 'Brighton Mysteries' and didn't care for it"
got fed up of the latest domestic problem Ruth/Nelson/Nelson's wife/ the boyfriend..."

I did read all the Ruth Galloway series, but was thoroughly fed up with the Ruth/Nelson storyline.
I've liked the Brighton Mysteries.

A monumental day for western democracy, as Trump faces Harris....

I expect Trump will win and we will have a very tough 4 years ahead, i hope i am wrong!

Have started The Valley of Fear by Conan Doyle, written during WW1, amazed i havent read it before. An excellent start..

think there is a glitch, it keeps showing a "new message" when my post was the last message almost 40 mins ago!!

AB76 wrote: "A monumental day for western democracy, as Trump faces Harris....

I expect Trump will win and we will have a very tough 4 years ahead, i hope i am wrong!

Have started The Valley of Fear by Conan ..."

I think we will have a very tough 4 years whoever gets in.

A couple of folks here expressed an interest in my Secular Pilgrimage that I completed last week, which is a sort of 'write around' the life of Aldous Huxley. The five books of his that I have read are talked about but rather in the context of his life, and are not reviews of those books. So there are no spoilers here. From ‘Brave New World’ to ‘Eyeless in Gaza’ - A Secular Pilgrimage in the footsteps of Aldous Huxley - And a tribute to ‘The Ancestors’ along the way...

There are some surprising links, at least to me. Anyway here it is, for those that are interested in his legacy. I hope you enjoy it... https://jediperson.wordpress.com/2024...

AB76 wrote: "think there is a glitch, it keeps showing a "new message" when my post was the last message almost 40 mins ago!!"

Yes, it was the same with mine from this morning.

Gpfr wrote: "Logger24 wrote: "As the clocks have gone back and it’s now getting dark at tea-time I thought I would mention the best Christmas murder mystery I ever read ..."

Thanks for the tips, GP.

The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Napoleon by Karl Marx is an interesting and quite impressive piece of extended journalism. In a commentary of some 120 pages on the essentially contemporary politics of 1848 to 1852 (seven articles written, in the immediate aftermath of Louis Napoleon’s coup of 2 December 1851, for a New York weekly that never in the event appeared, and then receiving very limited distribution in book form), he manages to place it all in the long perspective of history.

In particular he explains the issues by reference a phenomenon which, it appears, was entirely missed by other commentators, e.g. Victor Hugo, the struggle for dominance between the social classes. Thus, in May 1850, the Party of Order (Legitimists and Orleanists temporarily in alliance), who have a majority in the National Assembly, neatly abolish universal (male) suffrage, and disable the “democratic” parties, by a new requirement for three years’ residence in a locality, such residence to be proved in the case of workers by a certificate from their employer! But that very action proves to be the undoing of the monarchists.

On the specifics of the coup:

Why does he do it? Because in a few months’ time, in May 1852, there will be elections for a new Assembly and a new President. Under the Constitution of 1849 he is not permitted to run for another term. The Constitution could be amended to remove this bar, but that requires an affirmative vote of three-quarters of the Assembly, and the pure republicans, who are adamantly opposed to an amendment, hold more than a quarter. To stay in power he has to act.

How does he do it? By ensuring that the generals commanding the army are loyal to him personally (and the soldiery too, with increased pay), by making speeches designed to terrify the middle and lower bourgeoisie that without him there will be disorder among the working classes and violent uprisings led by demagogues on the left, and by having the military arrest all the parliamentary leaders of the high-bourgeois opposition, breaking into their houses overnight, pulling them from their beds and hauling them off to prison. He announces the dissolution of the Assembly. When the remaining opposition members gather in a mairie to pass a resolution condemning the coup he has them arrested and imprisoned as well.

To his supporters, especially the vast class of small-holding peasants who had voted for him as President, he promises stabiliity. Marx makes the observation that Louis Napoleon, like a conjurer, was at the same time under the necessity of keeping the public gaze fixed on himself, by springing constant surprises.

To catch all the allusions to persons and events one needs a fair knowledge of the period. Still, it was an instructive read, and a vigorous example of Marx’s intellect in action.

AB76 wrote: "A monumental day for western democracy, as Trump faces Harris....

I expect Trump will win and we will have a very tough 4 years ahead, i hope i am wrong!
..."

It looks like Trump by now.

An article in the G predicts that Trump's protectionist tariffs will cut UK growth by half... interesting that Trump was being supported by a number of Tory politicians and Nigel Farage. So, they want the UK to suffer even more, do they?

That's as nothing to what may happen in Ukraine, as Putin fanboy Trump withdraws support...

Shocking news from the USA, Trump with an almost clean sweep of senate, house, popular vote
Bad news for Ukraine, immigrants and the american constitutional way of life, with no senate obstructions it will be a cabinet of loons, with RFK at health maybe? my word

Polls totally wrong, it does make you wonder...

scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "A monumental day for western democracy, as Trump faces Harris....

I expect Trump will win and we will have a very tough 4 years ahead, i hope i am wrong!
..."

It looks like Trump by..."

as bad a 6am check of my phone as in 2016 on the morning after the Brexit vote. Putin gets more disruption and madness delivered as he would like

Having seen three new books on Cromwell and the Interegnum period (1649-1660), i was reminded of a new book on the dissolution of the monastaries published a few years ago.

While it was a wonderfully rich collection of stories and traditions of the monasteries at work and the brotherhoods that ran them, there was very little on the politics of the dissolution, what the monasteries meant to local communities and the changes wrought by such massive closures of church property. Sometimes a new historical account of something can lead you down a different path to which you intended to travel and ultimately dissapoints

Logger24 wrote: "Marx makes the observation that Louis Napoleon, like a conjurer, was at the same time under the necessity of keeping the public gaze fixed on himself, by springing constant surprises."

And who does that remind us of?

Berkley wrote: "Logger24 wrote: "Marx makes the observation that Louis Napoleon, like a conjurer, was at the same time under the necessity of keeping the public gaze fixed on himself, by springing constant surpris..."

i hope the americans in this forum are bearing up with todays news, Trump will affect our lives in the UK but maybe not as directly and 24/7

The only comparison in modern politics to make me feel quite so angry was Brexit in 2016.

I had a bad feeling about the US election. Enough to cause me to go out on the morning of the 5th and buy myself a bottle of Kentucky
Bourbon whisky, and a lot of bottles of ginger ale, with which to numb my sorrows. I hardly ever drink spirits, they are too strong for me, but I thought that my more usual lager, or white wine spritzers were not going to do it, somehow.

In the end I just shrugged and went to bed quite early, as I could feel the sharp tooting, and relentless energy, that was being put into a whole cultural 'railroading', into an alternative universe. It was just too much for me. And not even the worth of the cost of the numbing, was going to sufficiently work for me, and so was not going to alleviate the state of my sad soul...
The Bourbon remains unopened!...

Tam wrote: "I had a bad feeling about the US election. Enough to cause me to go out on the morning of the 5th and buy myself a bottle of Kentucky
Bourbon whisky, and a lot of bottles of ginger ale, with which..."

makes me think of the REM song and line "its the end of the world as we know it (and i DONT feel fine)"

As the reading year starts to wind down, i tend to fit short stories in to the period between xmas and new year, in case not much "downtime" is achieved

So i have ordered a collection of Henry James ghost stories, of which the only one i know is The Turn of the Screw

Berkley wrote: "Logger24 wrote: "Marx makes the observation that Louis Napoleon, like a conjurer, was at the same time under the necessity of keeping the public gaze fixed on himself, by springing constant surprises."

And who does that remind us of?


Yes indeed. I keep finding parallels.

Hard to give your mind completely to reading when political events make the next four years look seismic. I did finish one significant novel.

The reputation of Jude the Obscure as grim and depressing put me off for decades, but I have found it a rewarding read. A working stonemason since he was a boy, Jude Fawley has taught himself the classical languages and now aspires to the ministry. The famous rejection by Oxford/Christminster, and the advice from the Master of Biblioll College that he stick to his trade, is not quite the central event I had understood. Before long there is a rich tangle of husbands, wives, friends and lovers. If anything, the novel becomes more the drama of Jude’s young cousin Susan Bridehead, who is spirited, and pretty, and more widely read than he is.

Hardy’s characters show indifference to the sanctity of marriage, and yet all of them are constrained by the expectations of a society in which a man and a woman cannot just live as they choose. Rather than the rejection of Jude, or even the succession of hammer blows in the final chapters, it is this general attitude that seems to have got Hardy into trouble with critics and the reading public when the book came out in 1895.

Sue appears impetuous, changing course with little warning, to the point where some call her flighty. What she really wants, without always seeing it in this light, is her freedom. The words that Hardy puts in her mouth are forthright. I can’t think of another English writer of the time (a decade and a half before Ann Veronica) who would have his leading lady say this, and in a period setting which appears to be a generation earlier:

“I have never yielded myself to any lover… People say I must be cold-natured – sexless – on account of it. But I won’t have it! Some of the most passionately erotic poets have been the most self-contained in their daily lives.”

and

“Fewer women like marriage than you suppose, only they enter into it for the dignity it is assumed to confer…”

and much more in the same vein. Another character says:

“I don’t see why the woman and the children should not be the unit without the man.”

As always, Hardy tells a good story, and gets on with it. The intense emotions he portrays feel true to the characters, even if the plot itself is unnaturally symmetrical. I did notice something I don’t remember from the earlier novels, some preciousness in the language - for example, people have physiognomies rather than faces, and on one occasion, as Jude is listening to an organ playing in the cathedral, he sees Sue in another pew “ensphered by the same harmonies.”

Logger24 wrote: "The reputation of Jude the Obscure as grim and depressing put me off for decades, but I have found it a rewarding read..."

I haven't read Hardy - you have found some telling quotes. I did see an excellent BBC TV adaptation a while back, starring Robert Powell, and a later film with Christopher Eccleston in the lead role.

Good luck for the next four years... although the impact on the UK will be less in social terms, economically we will suffer if Trump follows his protectionist agenda. One economic think tank predicts that our growth will be halved as a result. Interesting that right-wing Tories hail his victory, despite the harm it'll do us!

Logger24 wrote: "Hard to give your mind completely to reading when political events make the next four years look seismic. I did finish one significant novel.

The reputation of Jude the Obscure as grim and depress..."

Hardy was one of the authors we studied at university. I had to read Jude the Obscure over a weekend and did so in the room of one of my friends who was also working. She asked what the book was about and then got drawn into the story and I had to update her as I was reading. I remember gasping when I came to the because we are too menny bit and her "What? What's happened now?"

Gpfr wrote: "Logger24 wrote: "Hard to give your mind completely to reading when political events make the next four years look seismic. I did finish one significant novel.

The reputation of Jude the Obscure as..."

my grandfather was a member of the Hardy Society and did talks and lectures, he got his love for Hardy via his mother, who was from Dorset. I was a sceptic at school, force fed Far From the Madding Crowd but aged 24, i returned to and loved that novel, its rural scenes and themes. It co-incideded with my grandfather convalescing from an illness and staying with my parents at the same time. I listened a lot to his commentary on novels and themes, we bonded over Hardy. I read quite a few novels of Hardys after that and loved them

returning to Hardy in 2021 , a selection of short stories, i found the themes repetitive and a bit limited, though his novels are much better. Its just a shame my grandfather isnt around to point me to a particular set of stories

Grandfather actually preferred the poetry and i think The Dynasts was his first love of Hardys work

Am faced with an ethical issue, the short but interesting account of arabic travel to India and CHina in the 9c Accounts of China and India is published by NYU Press and the NYU Abu Dhabi insititute

Now i welcome funds to translate and to disseminate non-western language literature and prose as much as possible but the UAE is a backwards, repressive, human rights violating oil mess and i begin to wonder if i should not read anything else in this series of translations.

The institute is funded by the UAE

For anyone who can access it, and is interested, the new series of The Day of the Jackal is being aired on tv in the UK. It is on Sky Atlantic for Sky subscribers, and on Sky Showcase (109) for Virgin subscribers like myself. The first 5 episodes are being shown consecutively from 9pm tonight then the next 5 each Thursday at 9pm.

Having fond memories of the first film starring Edward Fox, I am looking forward to seeing how this one matches up. I just hope Eddie Redmayne plays the part as well as he played Stephen Hawking.

Will post this up on the film thread too.

I too have a fondness for Hardy from when I was a teenager. 'Far from the Madding Crowd', and 'Jude the Obscure' and 'The Woodlanders'. I was less keen on Tess of the D'ubervilles though. Maybe its a school thing as it was the novel I was forced to read at school. There is quite a good film version, starring Kate Winslet, of 'Jude the Obscure'. It's possibly where I acquired my fascination for medieval clocks from!?... I identified with the circling around, and not being able to get closer to my fantasy ambitions, that seems to lie at the heart of the story.

I can recommend 'The Darkling Thrush' from his poetry. I'll put up a copy in the poetry thread...

Reading some of the posts above, it would seem that it is not only Shakespeare that people have been put off by studying them at school!

giveusaclue wrote: "Reading some of the posts above, it would seem that it is not only Shakespeare that people have been put off by studying them at school!"

I think its a mixed picture for most people. I have never been put off Shakespeare in school, and I did quite a few of his plays and poems there. My school also introduced me to early 20th century science fiction, which I loved. This was a genre that would never have made it into our home, but then I was not brought up in a 'bookish' household. Any books that we had, tended to be engineering manuals. An obligatory 'Encyclopedia' set, and for my mum, romantic fiction novels... and 'The Readers Digest' 4, abridged, books-in-one, type thing... and that was it.

giveusaclue wrote: "For anyone who can access it, and is interested, the new series of The Day of the Jackal is being aired on tv in the UK. It is on Sky Atlantic for Sky subscribers, and on Sky Showcase (109) for Vir..."

the novel and the film with Edward Fox in it were so good and of its time, i'm wary of a modern adaption

still amazes me how some comments sink without trace on here....you post something and all 5 replies above are totally unrelated.

ts not as bad as the G where the woke agenda ruins everything you type but sometimes i wonder if some posts are rendered invisible. Not the political ones, i can see why people dont comment on them but i was very suprised no traction on the UAE and its institute,

AB76 wrote: "still amazes me how some comments sink without trace on here....you post something and all 5 replies above are totally unrelated.

ts not as bad as the G where the woke agenda ruins everything you..."

TBF, you only posted the comment less than an hour ago!

I would say that it all depends on whether the UAE in any way interferes with the content - is it censored? Or is it carefully selected to be non-controversial from their POV? Is it possible to find out? If the funding is hands-off, then no problem. But is it?

giveusaclue wrote: "Reading some of the posts above, it would seem that it is not only Shakespeare that people have been put off by studying them at school!"

I was never put off Shakespeare... in parallel with studying usually abbreviated versions of the plays, at the time the BBC regularly showed versions on TV... my family watched enthralled as 'An Age of Kings' was shown:

"An Age of Kings is a fifteen-part serial adaptation of the eight sequential history plays of William Shakespeare (Richard II, 1 Henry IV, 2 Henry IV, Henry V, 1 Henry VI, 2 Henry VI, 3 Henry VI and Richard III), produced and broadcast in Britain by the BBC in 1960." (Wikipedia)

On the other hand, the over-sentimental 'Oliver Twist' left me with a long term distaste for Dickens - I have never read him since - though I have in recent years appreciated adaptations such as 'Bleak House' (excellent) and 'Little Dorrit' (not bad), as well as the old B&W 'Great Expectations' and a few others. Still don't fancy reading the books, though...

AB76 wrote: "the novel and the film with Edward Fox in it were so good and of its time, i'm wary of a modern adaption"

I know exactly what you mean, and am wary myself, but given how long ago that was I am willing to give it a try.

scarletnoir wrote: ""An Age of Kings is a fifteen-part serial adaptation of the eight sequential history plays of William Shakespeare (Richard II, 1 Henry IV, 2 Henry IV, Henry V, 1 Henry VI, 2 Henry VI, 3 Henry VI and Richard III), produced and broadcast in Britain by the BBC in 1960."

Oh, that sounds interesting. I guess you mean this one

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Age-Kings-DV...

Would have to buy a dvd player!!

scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "still amazes me how some comments sink without trace on here....you post something and all 5 replies above are totally unrelated.

ts not as bad as the G where the woke agenda ruins e..."

well from what i can see, it directly funds the instititute, which would mean money from a government that is not free and fair, is tied to polluting substances and denies human rights

i see it as part of the "soft" power of the ghastly gulf states(inc Qatar and Saudi)(, where they flood western sports and culture with large amounts of blood soaked cash. The shocking thing is that it mostly or almost always works, capitalism and greed, hand in hand.

I have never visited the Gulf area for holidays and never would, regardless of whether i loathe sunshine and heat but i am appalled at the massive, eco-disaster cities that have sprung up, in barren desert states. They werent even Oases, just small fishing ports with no future and now house cities with millions of people in a still non self-sustaining region for human life

Gpfr wrote: "Hardy was one of the authors we studied at university. I had to read Jude the Obscure over a weekend... the because we are too menny bit "

That’s quite a moment, isn’t it?

My favorite Hardy, for entirely non-literary reasons, is Far from the Madding Crowd. You can’t read the book without your mind’s eye being full of the beautiful 1967 film realisation with Peter Finch, Terence Stamp and Alan Bates, all excellent, and outshining them all a dreamy Julie Christie as Bathsheba.

I always sympathised with friends doing English at university, who had to read so much under pressure of time and the weekly essay, and was glad I had opted for a non-literature course which left me free to explore books as I pleased.

AB76 wrote: "Am faced with an ethical issue, the short but interesting account of arabic travel to India and CHina in the 9c ..."

I think I would look more to the author/translator than to the source of the funding. If as far as you can tell the author has not been lent on to express views favourable to the funding party then it’s OK to carry on reading, especially when you’re unlikely to find the material you’re after published elsewhere. To take another, now rather historical example, the articles in Encounter were still well worth reading even after the magazine was revealed to have been funded for years by the CIA. (Quite when that funding ceased seems to be a murky question.)

Logger24 wrote: "I always sympathised with friends doing English at university, who had to read so much under pressure of time and the weekly essay..."

Oh, I absolutely loved it.

Logger24 wrote: "AB76 wrote: "Am faced with an ethical issue, the short but interesting account of arabic travel to India and CHina in the 9c ..."

I think I would look more to the author/translator than to the sou..."

good point, i think in terms of a translation of a 9thc arabic travel account, the UAE probably havent lent on the translator that much, as there was no UAE then or any organized government in that part of Arabia

giveusaclue wrote: "Oh, that sounds interesting. I guess you mean this one..."

Yes, that's the one.

I daresay that technically it will look very old fashioned, but the acting (from very long ago memory) was very good. No idea how well it holds up. Perhaps it could be borrowed from a library?

I can say that I much enjoyed the old B&W series of 'Maigret' starring Rupert Davies from the same era - but that had a lot of location shots in France, which as it was filmed not too long after the period of many of the books, made for a realistic basis. I was disappointed that Maigret didn't have an old stove in his office, though - he uses a poker to keep it going in the earliest books set before WW2.

AB76 wrote: "i see it as part of the "soft" power of the ghastly gulf states..."

You make many good points... I dislike the way football teams have been bought up by petro-states, for example.

One of the most grotesque developments is the creation of ski slopes in these very hot countries! Just think what that does for global warming...

As for holidays - I'd never go there either, any more than I went to Franco's Spain or Salazar's Portugal in the 1970s.

Logger24 wrote: ".I always sympathised with friends doing English at university, who had to read so much under pressure of time and the weekly essay, and was glad I had opted for a non-literature course which left me free to explore books as I pleased.

Same here... I like to explore books in my own time and following my own impulses. I didn't get much from literature lessons in school - they were off-putting if anything. I was reading stuff that interested me all the time, but not the 'school texts'.

Literature formed a large part of madame's uni course -she'd lost her ability to read for pleasure when I first knew her, as the tendency to analyse the text would get in the way.

The resistance to 'obligation' wrt reading is also why I won't be joining any reading groups.

The Valley of Fear is just what i was looking for, a good autumnal edwardian read

Conan Doyle is a master of style, there is always so much more in there than just the bones of a well worked plot. Little details and the clarity of his style, recently, well in last 4 years i read a short empire set novel and his Gothic Tales, which reminded just how good a writer he is.