All About Books discussion

Week 82 brings us A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess first published in 1961.

To read the (very interesting) article by Robert McCrum go here

Fascinating article Jenny! I haven't read the book yet, but that article made it more likely that one day I will.

This is a great story! I really enjoyed this book and the theme of whether free-will is a good thing or not.
Liked that article, Jenny! Thanks for sharing that.
I haven't seen the movie yet.

I haven't read the book but have seen the movie, it traumatised me

Yeah....I'm kind of afraid that Hollywood will focus on the violence. The book shows violence but isn't graphic about it. In the book, the theme can shine through....I wonder if it can in the Hollywood version; it would have a hard time, I think.

Alannah - I think that was why it was suppressed - and banned from TV - for so long. I do remember that it split opinion when it was on general release, with placard-carrying crowds around the cinemas. I thought the film was chilling and terrifying, and it has stayed with me for a long time. And it's interesting that it can still have that effect all these decades later.

I intend to read the book at some point.

It was Anthony Burgess himself who refused to allow the film to be re-released or shown again, for decades, but I can't remember whether it was because of the criticism it received or for some other reason. The image of Malcolm McDowell as Alex will remain with me always!

It was because of all the media hype John. He was appalled at the fact that some youths had viciously attacked an old man and called it "Doing a Clockwork Orange". The media got hold of it and ... well you can guess the rest.

That's quite apalling (and justifiably upsetting for him), especially since according to Jenny's link, one of the things that inspired the book was his first wife's miscarriage after her being beaten by some drunk American servicemen.

I know. I do remember how all the furore was whipped up. Whatever you think of Anthony Burgess, you have to feel for his situation.

But I'm not sure why the ban stayed in place for so long, particularly with regard to the BBC's reluctance to broadcast it so many decades later. It was a very good film as I remember, directed by Stanley Kubrick whose work is always excellent. And it had good reasons for its content, rather than being gratuitously violent, as some films which have been made since are.

Very true Jean. I remember the film being good too (although disturbing). I'm guessing the problem was probably in the lack of understanding of the people watching as opposed to the film itself.

Alannah wrote: "I haven't read the book but have seen the movie, it traumatised me"

Same for me! I was 18 when I saw it ...

IMHO, the book is less traumatizing, as you said, than the movie. In a way Kubrick has transformed a good novel in a masterpiece, too suggestive and fascinating to be easily understood.

Same age as me Laura (though I saw it at the cinema when it was first released, so I was kind of prepared). A lot of disturbing films came out at around that time, (1971) WR: Mysteries of the Organism,(about Wilhelm Reich), The Decameron by Giovanni Boccaccio, Ken Russell's "The Devils", which was based on both The Devils of Loudun by Aldous Huxley and also John Whiting's The Devils. I can't remember them all offhand. But if that was the sort of fare you wanted to see at the more Arty cinemas, you could.

LauraT wrote: "Alannah wrote: "I haven't read the book but have seen the movie, it traumatised me"

Same for me! I was 18 when I saw it ..."

I think I was 17 when I saw it.

Do you mean the Decameron film by Pasolini Jean? I saw that one and the Ken Russell one on video long afterward when I was in my 20's. I haven't seen the Mysteries of the Organism one though.

Yes. I think what I was groping towards was the thought that although there were fewer dystopian films around, there were a lot of disturbing or shocking films released within a few years, so the context of A Clockwork Orange is not what might be expected in retrospect.

The good films from 1971 which I remember seeing are not the ones which are shown on TV, and although they might come up in specialist cinemas, some may even have been buried in archives.

The dystopian films and novels released now are a different matter, I think, some of them being glossy epics conforming to a certain market.

That's true Jean. The dystopian films today, though some are quite entertaining, belong mostly to the popular escapism category. Kubrick certainly belongs to a different category, and he had a highly different intent.

Alannah wrote: "I haven't read the book but have seen the movie, it traumatised me"

Same here. In fact, I have been put off reading anything by Burgess due to that film!

Leslie wrote: "Alannah wrote: "I haven't read the book but have seen the movie, it traumatised me"

Same here. In fact, I have been put off reading anything by Burgess due to that film!"

Me too!

Greg wrote: "That's true Jean. The dystopian films today, though some are quite entertaining, belong mostly to the popular escapism category. Kubrick certainly belongs to a different category, and he had a high..."

Definitly!

Greg wrote: "That's true Jean. The dystopian films today, though some are quite entertaining, belong mostly to the popular escapism category. Kubrick certainly belongs to a different category..."

I find most of the currently popular dystopian books & films are really hero-adventure stories, just told in a dystopian setting. Many of them don't seem to have a clear social commentary about our culture that I expect in well-written dystopian (or utopian) books. So I agree, Greg!

Burgess' book (& Kubrik's film adaptation) would qualify for what I consider dystopian. I think that term has become misused as it gained in popularity, or perhaps just watered down somewhat.

Yes. I agree.

Good point, Leslie. I saw the film when it first came out and although it was extremely disturbing to me, I remember being really impressed with the cinematography and the music. I think my Dad bought a record of the musical score.
I have wanted to read the book for a while, however, I am getting too overloaded to commit to another discussion.