The Modern Library 100 Best Novels Challenge discussion

December 2010

Post your discussion here for Catch-22.

I read this one many,many (many, many....) years ago and gave it 2 stars at the time, but I am going to read it again because I think I would get more out of it now. It will be interesting to see how my opinion will have changed, because I'm sure it has one way or the other!

I started this one yesterday and am only about 35 pages in. It feels like its going to be a slow read even though it is somehwat funny (absurd may be the better word). I'm trying to put it into context with the time it was written. I would imagine this took on an even greater significance at the height of the Vietnam War, and I'm guessing this was a direct jab at the Korean Conflict. Its interesting so far.

I picked this up from the library today, and I am going to reluctantly admit that I also grabbed the Cliffs Notes to read along with each chapter. I have found that reading the chapter first and then the notes on the chapter can be really great and I do this a lot with classics, just to make sure I am getting everything I need to get. I also like reading the discussion questions, character information, etc.

Stephanie wrote: "I picked this up from the library today, and I am going to reluctantly admit that I also grabbed the Cliffs Notes to read along with each chapter. I have found that reading the chapter first and th..."

Oooohhhh! I'd say cheating (LOL), but I was sorely tempted to do the exact same thing. Some books just need the extra input!!

I think it would be cheating if I ONLY read the Cliffs Notes. ;)

After re-reading this book, I do like it better the second time around. It is a comic farce and a tragedy -- and a few other disparate moods. The story is set at the end of WW2 and basically is about the absurdity of war. I think the first time through, being a teen at the time, I read it more as a straight novel and didn't catch the implications of the story. It is one that you have to read while understanding the tone in which it was written.

By the way, I think the first half of the book is much harder to read (inane conversations) than the second half. Just in case you're wondering if you can get past the first part :)

That's good to hear. I did put this aside for several days while reading The Year of the Flood. I am hoping it gels into more of a storyline.

Garlan wrote: "That's good to hear. I did put this aside for several days while reading The Year of the Flood. I am hoping it gels into more of a storyline."
I agree with Garlan the story line is weak. I was not sure if it was my lack of focus or if the story line was weak... I kept asking myself what is the main character, what is the main character's objective. SO I have put it down as well but hope to finish it soon.

LynnB wrote: "By the way, I think the first half of the book is much harder to read (inane conversations) than the second half. Just in case you're wondering if you can get past the first part :)"

Cool because I am at page 200. So I will continue reading it.

Garlan wrote: "I started this one yesterday and am only about 35 pages in. It feels like its going to be a slow read even though it is somehwat funny (absurd may be the better word). I'm trying to put it into c..." Garlan did you at times start laughing while reading this book, and thought; "I am not sure what is exactly funny, but something just made me chuckle. It was a different experience."

Garlan, I was reading John Gardner on Moral Fiction, and found what might be happening to our flow in reading the story. We may be stumbling because it attempts to be innovative. Innovation is used at the cost of story structure and character development. The author uses words, like a child playing with an infinitum amount of Legos, builds a postmodern story. The structure looks like a Postmodern Lego Architecture set, many colors placed hither and tether but not much clarity.

Gardner wrote, "Words so crushed together that they do indeed become as opaque as stones.'p 69

As you read, remember all the characters are caught up in a "catch-22" and the craziness of the story is that they are caught up in, well, the craziness! Whichever way you go, you get caught.

I agree with Gardner's take on it. There's just so much jumping from character to character, each with a very brief "story" that is so exagerated that it becomes comical. Not an un-interesting story; its just not a page turner for me. I already started and finished another book, and started and have almost finished another since beginning this one. I will stick it out. Its jsut going to take me some time to get through this one unless something happens quickly to change my mind.

I am on page 200+ and struggling with it a lot. I also have began a couple boouks and finished them in the time I have been reading Catch 22.

Gregory wrote: "I am on page 200+ and struggling with it a lot. I also have began a couple books and finished them in the time I have been reading Catch 22."

No question that it's a slow one. I can't believe I actually read it a second time (granted, many years apart)...if it weren't the pick for this month, I highly doubt I would have done so!! (And my opinion of it went from a 2 rating to a 3, but I've been considering moving it back to a 2.)

John Gardner in his book "On Moral Fiction" stated that "It was in its moment interesting, but now it reads like old news, still funny in places but remote, nostalgically curious." I think that is my issue with Catch 22. I think it is a book that makes a good bathroom read, pick it up, laugh, but not something that you read straight through... with gusto.

Gregory wrote: "John Gardner in his book "On Moral Fiction" stated that "It was in its moment interesting, but now it reads like old news, still funny in places but remote, nostalgically curious." I think that is..."

That's what I'm finding with several of these ML100 books...interesting at the time of the writing, but not holding that interest over time. I agree with you on Catch-22 as being one of those.

Finished this today.
I read the good soldier Svejk which, apparently, inspired this book. Catch-22 was certainly more modern in its references and it covered things from multiple viewpoints. Catch-22 was more slapstick comedy whereas in Hasek’s classic you were never sure if Svejk was a genius or an idiot with his simple minded torpidity and senseless compliancy. At the end of the good soldier I leaned towards Svejk being a genius underminer and from reading Heller’s book, he too probably thought this. It’s almost as if Hasek’s protaganist, Svejk, was reincarnated into catch-22's hero Orr.
My own favorite characters in Catch-22 were Milo who’s ludicrous economic machinations were sheer brilliance and the despotic old Italian man who's ruminations on life were genuine.
The plot did bounce around a bit too much for my liking, and the time shifted without warning. Hilarity and riot were mixed sad and poignant scenes such as in which Snowden’s murmurs morbidly about being cold while being cradled in Yassarian’s arms, sheltered by comforts of “There, there.”
In all a good book, especially after tumbling past the first 200 pages or so. I struggled between 3 or 4 stars and ended up giving it 4 due to some of its stronger moments.

I had to pass this one by during the month of December. My mindset has been such that I didn't even want to pick this up, even though it has been glaring at me from my end table for more than 4 weeks.

I had been looking for a copy of this for ages. I finally found a paperback copy just before Christmas with the original blue cover and I couldn't wait to read it.

I'm about 150 pages in now. At first I found it really difficult. It took me a week to get through the first 50 pages. I mean, yes, it was funny and I literally had to stop myself from laughing out loud when reading it in public, but most of the time I was just having trouble keeping track of all the crazy characters and trying to figure out what happened before or after what.

More than a quarter of the book in, I find it's a bit easier to read now and I've gotten the hang of Heller's crazy writing. I still don't know if it'll be worth it in the end cause I'm still not crazy about it. Maybe I need a little reassurance from those of you who endured all 500+ pages?

I have no idea what this book is about, (I am only about 200 pages in) but I am very much enjoying and liking this book.

I would to say that I enjoyed this book, but I am not sure. To sum it up, I feel it is/was a book before its time. This was an exercise of Post-modern thought. It made you think and question many things, but they ended making you question what you were questioning, then you are left trying to figure out if there was in fact anything to question in the first place. Catch 22 you are damned if you do, and you are damned if you don't or another way to look at it, you are damned if you know, and you are damned if you don't know. Again I liked the thought process presented in many of the characters but then it became an exercise of my mind to follow what is being said, and why.

Kyle wrote: "I would to say that I enjoyed this book, but I am not sure. To sum it up, I feel it is/was a book before its time. This was an exercise of Post-modern thought. It made you think and question man..."

To me this is a book that needs to be read slowly and digested slowly. As it is a mental Juggernaut.

It makes you think - I just started re-reading this, and I remember really liking it the first time around. I think it's funnier the second time through, and I'm less confused (for now...)