Jane Austen discussion

Now that our discussion of the novel is finished, it is time to view and talk about the 1999 miniseries adaptation of Elizabeth Gaskell's Wives and Daughters.

Enjoy!

I haven't read the book yet, but have seen the movie of Wives and Daughters and thought it was well made. Cynthia was a spoiled girl, but she found an ally in Molly. Molly's stepmother was manipulative as far as her daughter's wants and needs. She married Molly's father to upgrade her station in life, I suppose.

I haven't read the book yet either. But I have seen the movie ;-). I thought it was good - it provoked a very strong reaction from me to some of the characters. I totally disliked Molly's stepmother - she was Wickham-esque in her slimy manipulations. I liked Molly and Roger. Osborne was quite something. I enjoyed it.

SPOILER ALERT:

Yes, the mother portrayed the stepmother in a not too nice way. She was always scheming. I liked Molly and Roger as well, but I think when Cynthia liked Roger, and Molly confronted her and her true feelings came out, that was the turning point for Molly and Roger. That was sad with Osborne and his father, with the father not liking foreigners and Osborne has a French wife and child. I am glad it turned out well in the end, and the widow of Osborne and child lived with the grandfather.

I love this movie. It is very true to the book--except the very end. Gaskell died before she finished the last chapter or two, so the writers of the movie had to write an ending to the story. The scene they wrote is very romantic, but is in conflict with the way Gaskell said the book would end--not in the big details, but in smaller details.

SPOILER

Gaskell said that Roger went off to finish his African expedition and didn't declare his love for Molly until he got back. In the movie, he declares his love before he leaves, they get married, and she goes with him to Africa. It doesn't really make sense, because Roger should have learned from his mistake of letting his emotions overcome his reason and becoming engaged to Cynthia before he left the first time. Besides, Mr. Gibson verly clearly told him not to do it. And I don't think Molly would have gone to Africa. She doesn't have the robust health that is required for such an expedition.

In the movie, since I did not read the book, it followed along that Molly did go with Roger. He should not have gotten engaged to Cynthia in the first place, since she was all wrong for Roger. That is what Cynthia told Molly, she isn't constant, when she did get engaged to the other guy, who she eventually married. It seemed that Cynthia all along was hiding something, esp. with her other suitor, and all the men seemed to come out of the woodwork to become engaged to Cynthia. I did not know that Gaskell died upon seeing the movie. I do know that Molly's father the doctor was very protective of her. Maybe it did make sense for Roger to claim his love for Molly when he returned from Africa. Whichever way it happened, I am fine with the movie's ending.

I've read the book and have seen the movie serveral times. I Thought they did a good job with the movie as well. Matter of fact after I saw the movie I went back to read the book again.

I need to read this book, I loved the movie, the scheming Cynthia, who wouldn't with a mother like hers. I didn't think the mother and Molly's father had much in common. Gaskell showed the social classes of the day, interacting with the working class. Do you think the ending in the movie was static? Gaskell died before the book was finished, and the director of the movie just added what they thought the ending should have been.

I'm almost at the end of the book, and I saw the movie earlier. I think the movie is pretty good, but I did not like the end, the final scene, Molly dressed up as a man. I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong, Victorian woman wore pants. It may be a single scene but I feel it spoiled the rest. That's something I see with Andrew Davis, he seems like a good screenwriter but he adds some oddest, unexpected scenes like the seduction scene of the new Sense and Sensibility.

As for the cast, I really like the actress who plays Molly she's just like in the book. She performs really well. I've seen her in 'Great Expectations', a 'Tess of the D'Urbervilles' and I think she was there in that Mansfield Park movie starring Frances O'Connor.

Also I think the appearance of the actor who plays Roger is pretty similar to his description in the book.


Commenting on the spoilers:

Alicia, you are absolutely right about Molly's going to Africa. Molly doesn't have that kind of an adventurous spirit in her. As for the rest I'll finish and comment.

I haven't found time in my maddening schedule to read this lovely book. Sad since I desparately wanted to join the rest of us Austenites. But I'll be happy to add my comments when I get to it (I first need to finish my First Read Win for Madame Tussaud)

...anyhow I religiously watch W&D and am in love. The scheming Cynthia gets more than one giggle from me.

The ending felt very Hollywood spun. It's terribly cute how the pair join but I had wondered if Molly's disposition improved enough TO go to Africa. I suppose the producers/director wanted an independant female spirit in the film.

But how would the other ending feel to you? That she had to wait again? Would Molly stay constant or would someone else enter her life?

Molly would definitely stay constant! She and Roger could write letters to each other, and even if he didn't declare his love to her, the letters would keep them close in mind and spirit.

By waiting until a more appropriate time he would show more discipline and character. I think that is why Gaskell told her editor that the book would end that way. We wouldn't want people to say that Roger married Molly on the rebound, which is what some people would think if they got engaged right away (as they did in the movie.) If he waited until he returned, Molly would have more time to be sure he is completely over Cynthia.

Yes it somehow makes sense. Heavens knows there were enough marriage proposals coming Cynthia's way anyway. She certainly had a hold on men. She didn't seem to do anything extraordinary, I guess she was just being herself.

Based off the movie, Cynthia is like her mother. Remember the scene with the mother looking at her daughter wishing she could be like that again?

Cynthia is like her mother in some ways, but while Cynthia is basically good at heart, Mrs. Gibson is not.

Mrs. Gibson seems to me a conniver, and a manipulator. I think Cynthia was kinder in nature. She and Molly made a good pair.

Mrs. Gibson definitely was a manipulator; I like that the novel had such a character instead of being pure and everyone getting along. Conflict can be good. And I like that Cynthia in some ways learned the error of her ways but with men I still rapped my forehead as though she didn't learn at all :P

I know she was oblivious to their attentions. She had more than she could manage, poor Cynthia. She did find love in the end, though, and so did Molly.

I loved the movie. I haven't read the book yet, but I felt that the movie was really well done, all of the characters were very well developed and the story itself kept me wanting more. I really enjoyed it!

Did you laugh when you discovered her first "secret" engagement?

I've watched half of this miniseries so far, and I am loving the performances, production values, and script.

I am captivated by the plot, as I was while reading the book, and the casting couldn't be better. I had no idea Michael Gambon was in this until I watched it! It is also cool to see Tom Hollander and Osbourne, and I like the actor playing Roger. I also love that I'm watching this at the same time Downton Abbey is airing--Penelope Wilton is in both of them and she's amazing!

They chose the moment of Roger's engagement to Cynthia and his leaving for Africa as the stopping point for this half, and it was a particularly dramatic choice. Justine Waddell is wonderful in these scenes. She makes Molly really distraught. I just received the second half from Netflix, so I'll be watching it soon--probably tomorrow!

I finished the miniseries, and I have to say I enjoyed it a lot.

I agree that it is a bit of a stretch to believe that Molly accompanied Roger to Africa, but I still like that "happy ending" version. One problem I did have was that we don't see Molly and Roger kiss! He planted this big kiss on Cynthia, and we get a proposal in the rain scene but NO KISS! Oh, well. I still enjoyed it!

I saw the adaptaion back in December 2002 (when it first aired in the US), which made me have to read the book. I liked both.

I enjoyed the cast so much that I continued to follow them. I think Justine Waddell's next film was Dracula 2000, which was surprisingly better than I thought it would be (but then my expectations were very low); a little tongue-in-cheek and an oddly fun cast, including Gerard Butler as Dracula before he got all famous. She reunites with Johnny Lee Miller (they were both in the wildly inaccurate 1999 Mansfield Park), who plays Van Helsing's young assistant, to fight big, bad Drac. Justine is very good at playing vulnerable, which worked in both movies. I like Keeley Hawes, she was a great choice for Cynthia, and also enjoyed her in Tipping the Velvet and Ashes to Ashes... and as the voice of Lara Croft in the Tomb Raider video games. I have a younger cousin who really likes Keeley and made me play some Tomb Raider just becuase it's her. I felt really bad because I kept killing her in a multitude of horrible ways and laughing - she recorded many great dying sounds. Already liked Tom Hollander, he was in my favorite version of Nicholas Nickleby (release in the US Jan of 2002) and continues to be great. Not sure what I noticed Michael Gambon in first, W&D or High Heels and Low Lifes (Minnie Driver and Mary McCormack), which is a quirky little film that I watch about once a month. I mostly always like him, although I preferred Richard Harris as Dumbledore. Gambon is a little too robust for me as Dumbledore, but that was perfect for Squire Hamley. So, I agree, good cast.

Then I joined this group a few months ago, re-read the book and then re-watched the film. I had a little W&D marathon and my dad sat down and got sucked right into it. It was pretty fun. I liked them both again. At least I'm consistent.

Manda wrote: "I saw the adaptaion back in December 2002 (when it first aired in the US), which made me have to read the book. I liked both.

I enjoyed the cast so much that I continued to follow them. I think..."

Dracula 2000 was the first thing I saw Waddell in, and you're right, Manda--it pleasantly surprised me, too. I liked Miller and Waddell together in that film, and Christopher Plummer, too. The film itself is nothing spectacular but it is fun for what it is. I think Waddell gave a wonderful performance here in W & D, so I hope she does more in the future.

Yeah, I'm a fan. Have you seen the Miss Marples with Geraldine McEwan? I think they look similar enough to be grandma/granddaughter or play the same character across a time gap. I dunno, but I really like them both and want to see that. Maybe I should write a script. I don't have an idea really, but... is that important? It doesn't seem to be all that important in a lot of the stuff I see making it to the screen...

I haven't read the books, but its definitely on my list now. I thought the movie was excellent! Molly was wonderful, but I never really understood her instant attachment to Cynthia. I also liked Lady Harriet, she was Jane in the most recent big budget Pride & Prejudice I think. Even though I liked her character, I didn't really understand her, and her friendship with Molly. There were a coupe other things I found a bit confusing in the show (how old was she? Why wasn't she married or looking for a husband??) but I'm guessing that is explained more clearly in the book... :) I really did think the show was wonderful.

Now that I have finished reading the book, I got more insights into what they were trying to portray in the movie. I think Lady Harriet wasn't married, since she never found anyone suitable for her station in life. I liked that she befriended Molly and became her ally in their dealings with Mr. Preston. He was a cad, I don't know how Cynthia ever got involved with him. I don't know why Mrs. Gibson got involved with Mr. Preston, I guess since she had no one else on her radar at the time, she found him interesting. That shows his true character if he enlists the mother's and daughter's love simultaneously.

I just finished watching the miniseries, I bought the vhs cassettes several years ago. I have read the book and thought it followed the book fairly closely. I don't remember the ending with Roger and Molly waiting after his African expedition. I think Molly might have worn pants in Africa. It was a savage land with poisonous insects and lots of vines and plants to trudge through. So it makes sense to me. But she was definitely a stickler for traditional social customs so she would never consider it in England. That step mother was a beast at times. She simply got rid of Molly's mothers things without so much as a how do you do. She also fired the family servant. I think the father decided to marry simply to have a female influence in the house. But bringing Cynthia into the house was wonderful for Molly to have a sister. One thing mentioned by Robin previously was Lady Harriet. She would certainly be a character I would love to know more about and have a book written about her like Cranford had. In the movie, the brother was certainly nothing to look at. He was older and not tolerably looking at all. I want to get the audiobook and listen to it in the car.