Fantasy Book Club Series discussion

February is here! And as such, I'm going to now be putting up a bunch of discussion threads for Magician: Apprentice, the first book in the Riftwar Saga.

We can do our general discussion here. Do you have a favorite character? A least favorite character? A favorite passage or event? Something that drove you nuts or that you absolutely hated? Something you were confused by? Share away!

Spoilers are welcome, but please mark them all per the directions at the bottom of this post.



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To mark spoilers: Goodreads has a new option that I'm hoping we can all be diligent in using, the spoiler tag! It's an html code that will hide the spoiler so that people can browse the thread without fear and click to open the spoiler only if they are ready.

To do the tag, just surround the text that you want to hide as a spoiler with [spoiler] in front, and [/spoiler] at the end (with [] replaced by <> to make it work). (view spoiler)[Then you get a link like the one you just clicked on that the spoiler hides behind! (hide spoiler)].

If you have any questions, or if you're confused by my instructions, feel free to ask!

No one's posted in this thread yet? Amazing! Maybe not enough people have finished it yet?

Anyway, I wanted to add a few comments about the book.

First off: point of view. I like how we got to see the events from all sorts of people. I'm really amazed at how many people we had viewpoints from. Sometimes the switches were vague, othertimes very obvious. It felt like a stream of consciousness approach in a way because it was almost like reading the characters thoughts and intentions, while still leaving much of the events mysterious.

I really like Arutha. Maybe he just reminds me of Arithon from Janny's books, so I took to him quickly. I like his strength of character and his determination to lead his men even in the face of death. Carline kind of annoyed me at first. She seemed like she wasn't very sure of herself but was trying still to be a princess (or at least her idea of one). (view spoiler)[ I didn't like how she latched onto Pug after he rescued her from the trolls. Maybe she was just enamored with her rescuer. I did like that Pug didn't know exactly what to do about her sudden attention. I do think she became a better person neat the end of the book as she starts to grow closer to Roland. I liked her better then. (hide spoiler)] I think someone mentioned in one of the other thread that it was nice to see Pug and Thomas viewing the events on the periphary. I like that idea too. That really made this book more unique. I don't know what happens in the next books yet, but it will be nice to see these children grow into their roles more naturally instead of becoming the hero right away. I also really like Martin the Huntmaster. I think there's a lot more to him that I don't know yet. (view spoiler)[ For some reason I think that the dark elf girl that Garret almost runs into when they are baiting the Tsunami will become significant. I don't know why, but for some reason that scene really sticks out to me. (hide spoiler)] Thomas is another interesting character. I like the friendship that the boys have with each other. (view spoiler)[ I'm not sure what I think about the transformation going on with him. It seems like the people Thomas sees visions of are very powerful, but not necessarily very good. If he's becoming one of them, how will that affect his nature? (hide spoiler)]

I guess I'm embarking on spoiler territory, so I hope I'm doing this right.

(view spoiler)[ I though it was very interesting that there wasn't any more POV from Pug after he was captured. I guess that must come in the next book. It will be interesting to see what has happened to him in the "enemies hands". The very last section was also very interesting. It seems like the Tsurani are a very noble people, but they just don't understand each other very well. One of the things that bothers me is the use of 'barbarian'. Not just in stories, but in real life too. Why is something that is foreign and unknown to us barbaric? Maybe this usage is meant to irk me and I'd definitely say that it worked. From the blurb on the next book, it looks like there's more about the Tsurani and their world and culture in the next book. I'm looking forward to that. (hide spoiler)]

(view spoiler)[ I think the Tsurani are based on Japanese culture, specifically the during feudal times and the Samurais. Thus the term barbarians comes from their culture. But I guess it could be from the human race in general but I don't think that I'll live to the time that we find another alien race and call them barbarians. *grin* (hide spoiler)]

I love reading your thoughts on the book, Amelia. I feel like I can't reply, because I actually know the answers to a lot of your theories and questions, so I have to keep my mouth shut! But it's really nice seeing the story through the eyes of a first time reader :)

Julie wrote: "[spoilers removed]"

(I'm glad they removed the spoilers. I hadn't tried respnding to a spoiler post and wondered what would happen.)

(view spoiler)[ From what I've read so far, The Tsurani seemed like a Japanese like society. I really like reading about such societies. Fascinating. I'm sure once I read the Empire Trilogy I might think the the Midkemians are barbaric too. So far, I think I would rather call them less sophisticated instead of barbaric. (hide spoiler)]

Now the hard part is seeing if I can wait until March before I read the next book.

Amelia wrote: "I really like Arutha. Maybe he just reminds me of Arithon from Janny's books, so I took to him quickly."

I never made that connection. Maybe because I read this book qite a long while before Janny's ... Arutha has been one of my favourite fantasy characters for a long while now ( and I hope I don't spoil anything when I say I like him even more in the coming books).

That said, I certainly like Arithon too. Perhaps because, as you said, their personalities are somewhat alike - the quiet, no-nonsense kind who are a bit inclined to brooding but nevertheless does what needs to be done.

I finished this yesterday, but haven't written my review yet. I will say that I was a bit disappointed with the story after (view spoiler)[Pug's capture. Time leaped forward quickly and we completely lost contact with those characters we traveled the first part of the story with (hide spoiler)]. I realize this is an artificial ending, since the original publication was one larger book, so perhaps I'm feeling that amputation for the other story lines.

Jon, could you mark the spoiler about (view spoiler)[Pug's capture (hide spoiler)] please?

How is that a spoiler?

It gives away the ending of the book, for one.

What Chris said... That's a plot point from quite late in the book, how isn't it a spoiler?

I guess I get tired of the spoiler marking thing ALL the time. Is there a time that we can talk about the book without worrying about when it is or isn't a spoiler? Sometimes you just want to let your thoughts flow and not have to over think when it is or isn't a spoiler. Not sure if this is the place to talk about it or not, but those are my thoughts. I would say that the "General Discussion Thread" is probably not a place for spoilers but why wouldn't we be able to just talk about the book in the "Finished Book and your Reviews" thread and not what is or not a spoiler.

I guess I don't see what's so hard about putting spoiler tags around the text, to prevent other people from being spoiler. It's two extra words, and you can let your thoughts run as freely as you want in between them. The idea of this thread is general discussion of impressions throughout the book. Often those impressions will involve spoilers, which is fine, as long as a second is spent marking it so that people who aren't as far along can still read without the story being ruined. The idea of the reviews thread is to see where everyone ended up review and rating wise.

The the advent of the new spoiler tag, I like the idea what we don't need a hundred different spoiler/non-spoiler threads, just considerate people who err with the side of caution and hide their spoilers in all threads.

Dawn wrote: "Jon, could you mark the spoiler about [spoilers removed] please?"

All of my comment? I really didn't think it was spoilerish, especially in this 'general' topic.

Dawn wrote: "Jon, could you mark the spoiler about [spoilers removed] please?"

I hid the one plot point I meant to hide the first time I wrote my comment. Sorry about that.

No not the entire comment, just the little point I mentioned. Looks perfect now, thanks! :)

Here's a little food for thought about discussions in general. I'm in other groups, and one of them in particular is horrible about spoilers. Entire threads spoil entire books, and not just the books the threads are about. People in there refuse to mark spoilers. So what happens is, if the thread is over a book that I haven't read/finished, I completely avoid the thread altogether. I don't comment, I don't read. I don't participate.

If several potential discussion members do that, you get an end result of dead air....

I've deleted friends for that, Nicki...or at least, removed them from top friends. I've had some that were serial spoilers....

I've been spoiled that way too as well! No fun. That's why I just go with better safe than sorry, even in a "spoiler" thread. What if there was someone new to GR who didn't get the concept and came exploring? Or someone like me who assumes spoilers are allowed in spoiler threads but will still be marked? Better to be safe about it.

Okay, I read this ages ago, but let me see if I can remember it well enough to join in the discussion. I remember the first chapter took me about three months to read, because it bored me to tears. Every word was a nightmare. The rest of the book took me about three days. It was like a broke through a wall after that first chapter and suddenly found myself enjoying it.

That's funny, the first chapter was the thing that hooked me! Strange how something so small as 10 or 20 pages can have such diverse effects on different people :)

This was my third reading, and I found myself bored this time around for about the first half of the book. But then it seemed to take off. I thought I was going to drop it to 3 stars, but by the end I felt that my original rating of 4 was still good.

I guess to solve this issue I'll just put everything I write in a spoiler.....

I really don't think you need to go that far, I'm only asking that once your done writing a post you look back at it for a second and consider whether or not anything in it gives away major plot point and mark it if it does... But do whatever you need to do I guess. I didn't realize it was asking too much :\

It was with great reluctance that I closed the book last night at page 445 and went to bed.

(view spoiler)[I certainly hope that Pug gets out of captivity before the end of the book, that Tomas figures out what the heck is going on with his gift from the dragon, that Carline decides to wait for Pug, and that there are more dragons! (hide spoiler)]

Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work.

Oh, to speak to the spoiler controversy, if you uncheck the box 'Add to my Update feed' then spoilers don't show up in the feed. This would help in threads where spoilers are ok, and everyone's read the book.

Hah, I so wish I could comment! Having read on though, I'm in no position to speculate with you :)

Dawn wrote: "Hah, I so wish I could comment! Having read on though, I'm in no position to speculate with you :)"

Well the book is so much fun that I'm hoping for happy outcomes!

Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work."

@Sandra's spoiler: (view spoiler)[I agree with all your wishes except with respect to Carline. I'd rather Pug NOT complicate his life with her and let Roland carry that torch. I'd prefer Pug devote himself to his unique magic talent. (hide spoiler)]

Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work."

@Sandra's spoiler: [spoilers removed]"

Well, I'm a romantic at heart. I must say that Pug's approach to that affair is remarkably mature so far.

Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work."

@Sandra's spoiler: [spoilers removed]"

Well, I'm a romantic at heart. I must say that Pug's approach t..."

Agreed on Pug's approach. I'm unfortunately not much a romantic. :)

Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Oh, to speak to the spoiler controversy, if you uncheck the box 'Add to my Update feed' then spoilers don't show up in the feed. This would help in threads where spoilers are ok, and everyone's re..."

I've unfriended people because they didn't do that. Now that we have the spoiler tags, there is no excuse for anyone to post spoilers any where.

Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work."

@Sandra's spoiler: [spoilers removed]"

Well, I'm a romantic at heart. I must s..."

I agree that Pug was really quite sensible about Carline,(view spoiler)[ especially when he left the fortress. I like that he wanted to figure out how everything happening to him really affected his life before he would get involved in a serious relationship with a princess. I get the impression that the other princess, the one in Krondor might become more significant as the books continue. (hide spoiler)]

Amelia wrote: "Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Jon wrote: "Sandra aka Sleo wrote: "Hopefully I will have time to finish it today at work."

@Sandra's spoiler: [spoilers removed]"

Well, I'm a romantic at ..."


Well I finished! And Amelia I'd forgotten all about the other one!

That's all I'll say for now but I'll have to jump into the next one before March!

Jim wrote: "...I've unfriended people because they didn't do that. Now that we have the spoiler tags, there is no excuse for anyone to post spoilers any where..."

One of my problems is that I don't always know something is a spoiler. This is esp true of long series I have read in the past and one forgets what happened to whom in which book. The simple solution is when in doubt use the tag. The hard part is knowing when to be in doubt.

Okay not sure where else my thoughts go so I thought I'd put them here. I have finally had a chance to read some more (One Bonus point for a winter blizzard). I have just finished chapter 5 and am loving it now. The story for me has gotten more engaging and I am growing more and more curious. I have all sorts of questions and theories so far. I'm sure some of those will be answered as I read on.

General Thoughts on the Thomas/Pug friendship.

(view spoiler)[I am loving the friendship focus of the Story, Thomas, and Pug, Its the one comfort that he has. I find Thomas' fears about losing touch very real ones, we are lucky enough to live in an age where phonecalls and e-mails and the internet make it 'easy' to stay in touch and even then friendships drift. In a world where there is no such instant communication very realistic and forethought of him. I hope that they maintain it none the less. And don't end up having to be enemies or something that would make me very sad. I picture theirs as a friendship that will stand the test of time rather and they will always feel 'at home' with one another. At least that is what I am hoping for. (hide spoiler)]

Thoughts on Magic and Pug:

(view spoiler)[I am very curious about this, the magic that Pug uses is different than the magic Kulgan is use to. With the powerful magics that the Tsuranuanni seem to have access too. I have feelings there about a possible connection I am not sure what that connection is. I'll probably find out soon. (hide spoiler)]

Right now I am curious about everything, the characters, the magic, the world. I can see how it wouldn't be quite as enthralling at this point to those of you that are doing rereads especially if you remember the answers to all the questions right now what is driving me is absolute curiosity to find out why, and what, and how everything is happening. :)

Mary-Ann wrote: "Okay not sure where else my thoughts go so I thought I'd put them here. I have finally had a chance to read some more (One Bonus point for a winter blizzard). I have just finished chapter 5 and am ..."

Me, too, Mary Ann. I have finished the first book and am attempting to read something else, and today found myself thinking about Pug, Tomas and all and wondering what they're doing next!