Indie Book Club discussion

The only paranormal book nominated was Zero Sight so this is where we will discuss this book. I have already read it and found it to be a great read full of excitement and laughs.

As a quick reminder please use spoiler tags if you are going to give away important plot points.

Gonna have to pick up a copy. I remember looking at this and thinking it sounded pretty good.

Just bought my copy of Zero Sight. Will start reading as soon as I finish Scourge of Screbulum!

Put it on my Kindle this past summer.

I can only hope to one day get that many positive reviews for my own book as he has for Zero Sight. *wistful sigh*

Zero Sight looks pretty good. Away we go!

I read the first three chapters while on the elliptical this morning and I think the (view spoiler)[pink bunny (hide spoiler)] is my favorite part. The book already had a bit of humor even though it starts out with a bang.

Hehe. I'm a strong believer that you need to sprinkle in a bit of humor when your cutting that many characters in half.

I'm starting up a new rotation today. (I'm learning how to deliver babies this month.) The hours are going to be kinda crazy, so the timing of my responses may be a bit off. Still, I'll try to check in daily. I also wanted to say thanks to everyone for reading Zero Sight this October. It's super cool to be the subject of a book club.

B.

Learning how to deliver babies? Impressive, B.! What is your job title?

Well I finished the book today. I was able to focus in on it and ignore the fact that I was on the elliptical and that says a lot. Since I tend to read ahead of most people I will stay a little more passive and do more responses to other posts so I don't give things away.

I will start things out by asking what everyone think of Dieter though.

PS Hear that B. finished the book for the second time. Seems like a good time for the second book to be ready lol. I know it's at the editor, but I am very excited to see what is going to happen!

@Jeffrey: My title = MS3 (3rd Year Medical Student). I just assisted on my first emergency delivery. Recall that scene in Twilight: Breaking Dawn? It didn't do the experience justice.

@Scott: My editor just passed 1 of 2 major "zones of concern" I had in the 2nd book's manuscript. So far, so good. We've been through it once before. The first round required some major revisions. IMHO, it's much better now.

B.

B. -

I'm really enjoying Zero Sight so far. How did you come up with Dieter's gift? You've got a really cool way to draw the reader into Dieter's shoes and experience his life through his eyes.

Was up reading until 1am last night and I blame you. :)

I have one other question... (view spoiler)[was Dieter really responsible for taking Tyrone's head off? (hide spoiler)]

Yeah, yeah, I'll keep reading and find out for myself. :)

I can answer that question using only two words but maybe you should find out from the (view spoiler)[ pink bunny<\spoiler> (hide spoiler)]

@Jeff: What Dieter is seeing with his Sight is the important part. (view spoiler)[Dieter's gift depends on the Chinese concept of Ki (chi/qi). The concept is developed a bit more further into the book, but basically, Dieter is able to see an individual's Chi and make predictions based on it. Some martial arts masters claim to be able to observe an opponent's Chi and anticipate attacks. I've personally only "felt" an opponent's Ki a single time while playing Kendo. I don't believe it was real or anything, but it sure was an odd experience. There is more to Dieter's Sight...but I've gotta save something for the sequel. (hide spoiler)]

Started Zero Sight, and holy crap! Ulnas and esophaguses and fire! BTW, I used to confuse radius and ulna all the time.

I actually just read a pretty interesting blog post about the background of the Bathory name. Pretty scary stuff actually good choice as an ancestor.

The bus just made it to New York. I'm really enjoying this Rei Bathory girl.

You've done a helluva job creating totally believable characters. Are any of the characters based on any people you know or did you totally make them up?

New York is where it gets good! I thought he did a great job with the interaction between Dieter and Rei. Also Dieter's inner monologue is pretty hilarious at times.

Yeah, it is. Totally believable. The part where he spilled coffee on his crotch on the bus almost had me waking up my wife 'cause I was laughing. Not a smart thing to do close to midnight. :)

Bah! Maniacal laughter is the hallmark of a strong marriage...right?

You betcha! I've done it before. I usually get an eye roll and she goes back to sleep. Fortunately for me she loves to read as much as I do. :)

My husband once woke me out of a sound sleep to ask me what was in the toothpaste tube. In his defense, I had purchased lemon toothpaste, an epic failure if there ever was one.

B. Justin -

Should have mentioned this a while ago, but many congrats for actually making me read my first story with a (view spoiler)[ vampire (hide spoiler)] in it. I like Rei alot, and I knew something up was up with her as I was reading along.

Sadly, Dieter figured it out before I did, although in my defense, I usually don't read books that have them in there. :)

Great job for hooking me in and not letting go! I'm getting close to finishing.

I didn't want to say anything about that particular feature Jeff. I know it's normally a deal breaker, but the book is so good it can be overlooked.

I am curious about some of the other items referred to. The second book should be amazing!

Also Roster is annoying and when I read the book I always read his name as Rooster.

LOL!

So, pretty sneaky not mentioning that little tidbit. :) All is forgiven. It's a really good book so far. I'm hoping to finish it tonight. Maybe by tomorrow.

Got it finished! I really liked the story.

The only part I wasn't too sure about was at the end where (view spoiler)[DOMA wants to recruit the students to steal ACT devices. Yes, the situation certainly demanded it, but I thought a little far-fetched. Will I buy the sequel? You betcha!

To me it felt like a whole lot of history was all jammed together in a few pages. I was able to follow along, but to me it felt as though the flow of the story had changed. Easy to follow along, easy to picture the scenes, able to enjoy the battle scenes (Rei's giddiness during the end battle cracked me up!), and then a history lesson about Talmax.

I still rated it 5 stars, and even if I totally disagreed with the end of the story (which I don't) I'd still rate it 5 stars. Very well written. Very graphic scenes (yikes! Some parts were waaayyyy graphic! LOL!). Dieter's ongoing commentary was hilarious, with many chunks of sarcasm thrown in. (hide spoiler)]

Congrats, B. Justin! You made me like a vampire story!

Ok, now that I'm thinking about it, I do have a question...

According to the debriefing at the end, (view spoiler)[it's reported that Talmax had taken over, or attacked, several cities across the USA. Are the people in those cities aware of the attacks or are the imperiti incapable of seeing/sensing what was wrong? It was just something I wasn't too clear on. (hide spoiler)]

Yea, so the (view spoiler)[fight fight is over the possession of the leylines. The actual cities are of no concern to the magic folk. As will be more developed in the second book, discovery by the imperiti is a major concern. The tactics the the Magi use to cover their trails is consistent with the Men In Black concept of flashing someone's memories. I also have an explanation for how they avoid being recorded by technology, but I'm using that to advance the plot later on the story. (hide spoiler)]

I've been very interested in the many varied responses to the ending. Hopefully getting the second book out pronto will address a lot of the concerns, but I do understand where some of the displeasure is coming from. I was tone deaf while creating it, but perhaps I engaged in too much cliffhanging / info dumping while setting up for the second book. I was going for the strategy Caine used in her Morganville series, but I could have overshot.

All and all, being my first book, I was just happy that people liked the characters. That was my deepest worry.

Thanks for reading it Jeff!

B.

B. -

Not too worry. I really loved the book. I absolutely loved Dieter's on-going narrative. Hysterical! I easily slipped into his role and saw everything through his eyes. Good job!

And I'll have you know, I was actually rooting for the vampire during the end battle. I was literally thinking, come on Rei, kick their a$$e$!! You totally had me rooting for a vampire! That's happened only ONE other time, in Basement Blues, by JH Sked.

Can't wait for the sequel! A lot of it is based in Vegas? Cool! Been to Vegas many times!

B. I actually had a question as well.

(view spoiler)[Will the Tier system of power classification be explained more in further stories? I know EC is reserved for the highest level students only, but that just makes me curious as to the differences between tiers. (hide spoiler)]

Oooo, good one. Had briefly thought about that but naturally the thought escaped me later. C'est la vie. :)

The Tier system? It will be described in great detail, but I can reveal the basics now...

(view spoiler)[The Tier system is based on the amount of mana a mage can hold, aka their internal battery. The Tier system is logarithmic. A Tier 0 mage isn't a mage at all. They hold the mana of a normal human. A Tier 1 mage holds enough mana for one modest spell. A Tier 2 mage holds enough mana for two modest spells. A Tier 3 mage produces enough mana for 4 modest spells—or one major spell. At Tier 4, we see the big jump thanks to the logarithmic nature of the Tier system: 16 modest spells, or 4 major spells!

(As frame of reference, a minor spell is defined as a parlor trick, a modest spell is defined as a crowd pleaser, and a major spell could most certainly knock them all dead.)

While purely a measure of a mage's internal mana budget, their Tier ranking is a strong predictor of their capacity to cast useful magic. This has to do with the efficient use of mana. You will recall from the first book that Jules bemoans Dieter's fire-hose approach to mana. (She assigns him the task of filling circles with mana over and over again to improve his control, stressing that control is critical to proper magic.) You will also recall that, despite being a generally lousy mage, Dieter seems to be able to blow anything up he sets his mind to. What I meant to hint at was that both experience and natural talent effect how well a mage can manipulate mana.

Natural talent:

Each mage show certain predilections. Some have a natural talent for working with fire. Others will truly shine with manipulating water. Some prefer to cast on themselves (cataphracts). Others prefer to cast at targets (classic mages). The consequences of these preferences are obvious. If you ask a fire-specializing cataphract to cast a spell on a distant pool of water, they are going to expend many-fold the mana that a water-specializing classic mage would. No real surprises here. Dieter could burn down a forest with ease, but he would be utterly spent after making a single ice-cube.

Experience:

As you become more experienced, you will spend less mana on the same spell. A rookie mage will waste upwards of 90% of the mana they attempt to transmute. A true pro will waste less than 10%. This means that the learning curve for magic is very steep at first. A rookie is so wasteful that he/she may only get to practice one spell a night. An experienced mage can learn/develop new spells rather quickly. The gulf between the two (Tiers being equal) is huge.

With those basics laid out, perhaps you are noticing the Catch-22: I've created a tremendous barrier to entry during the early training phase of magery. I've also said that a Tier 3 can only cast a single major spell. Follow that logic to its natural end...

What if a mage starts out with a really small amount of mana?

The answer is that they can never even learn.

Sad? Absolutely. But we must all face the hard facts. If a mage starts out with a small magic budget (Tiers 1-3), they will never be able to practice casting a major spell outside of their magical niche, they will forever be one-trick-ponies, and they will never be considered "true" mages by the magical elite.

This barrier also explains the seemingly arbitrary Tier 4 entry requirement for Elliot College. A Tier 4 mage has enough of a mana budget to waste 90% of their energy and still manage to cast a major spell that is outside of their favorite discipline. Though the road will be long and hard, a Tier 4 will eventually become a "true" mage able to cast spells in all 4 major disciplines.

One final word: Your ability to extract and conduit mana from external sources is a distinct skill set. This is an important detail. (hide spoiler)]

Nice! That seriously helps! That's a well thought out response. How long did it take you to set all of that down as your basis for the usage of mana?

I wrote the bus scenes first, then sat down and worked out the world for about a month prior to writing again. Also, I tend to ask "why" a lot while a write. I jot answers down in my scrivener research files for later reference. That's where I pulled this one from.

Very nice. I tend to write a scene and then read it to my wife. She's the one that asks "why" all the damn time. Works great for me. Makes me sit back and think, well, if this character did this, and they're supposedly able to do that, then it wouldn't be realistic. What about doing it like this, or that?

It works out great for me. She keeps me grounded. :)

All in all, I was very impressed with the complexity and thoroughness of the world you created. My hat's off to you!

(view spoiler)[B is Dieter at the lower end of the Tier 4 spectrum? I remember a scene where he says he feels like a flashlight surrounded by lighthouses or something like that. Is he just a special case because of the amount of mana that he can pull from the leylines? I could also totally be misremembering that part. (hide spoiler)]

(view spoiler)[He may be lower still : ) (hide spoiler)]

Ok, now that Comic Con is behind me I have time to read again. Am I the only one who hasn't finished?

I finished. It was a very good book. I love Dieter's narrative throughout the story. Someone I can totally relate to!

I like the narrative as well. His voice never seems forced or contrived.

I remember being as (more) awkward as Dieter with the ladies when I was in highschool. Luckily I did not have an addiction to scalding hot beverages so I never had any searing spillage issues.

OK, Deiter's in college now. Funny, I remember the first time I went to New Haven, thinking it was the most remote destination on earth.

Sorry guys, late to the party. Just wanted to say that I quite enjoyed Zero Sight. A bit gruesome at times, but great magic concepts and like everyone, I loved Rei :)

I really liked Rei's character, too. But I think my favorite bit was Dieter's commentary throughout the whole book. There was tons of humor and just enough gore to make me queasy. :)