VAMPIRES DON'T SPARKLE discussion

Okay, I've only read the first Twilight book (before you jump on me...no, I do not need to read the rest of them!), but I know some of the stuff that happens in the other books. What I keep hearing from the Twilight fans is that Stephenie Meyer's "Vampires"...*Cough*..*Cough*...if you want to call those things that...make sense. Here's my problems...

1.) Sparkling. As fucking rediculous as it is, Meyer says that her vampires sparkle in the sunlight because thier skin is diamond hard. How can you move around if your skin is like that?

2.) If Meyer's vampires have no bodily fluids, how then does Edward get Bella pregnant in the last book.

There was a third thing I had an issue with but I can't remember what it is. Anyone have any thoughts? What problems do you have with Stephenie Meyer's vampires???

I haven't read the books either...but the Twilight phenomena is such that reading them isn't really required as far as I can see. You can't get away from it! Believe me, I've tried!!

My issues with Twilight go beyond Meyer's inability to write (I did try to read the first book, just to be fair, and I couldn't get through it.) My issue with the entire series is the ridiculous bastardizing of vampire (and werewolf for that matter) myth and lore. I'll list a few of my issues:

1) I'm with Dan on this one...the sparkling is beyond stupid. I didn't know that Meyer's reason for it was "diamond hard" skin....which makes it even dumber..if that were possible. If their skin were diamond hard, why would it sparkle? Just because it was hard wouldn't change it's composition from skin...and if it did then it would be pretty obvious even without sunlight, no? They'd look like walking mannequins.

2) Why is the slaughtering of animals somehow more humane and heroic than just taking a sip from a human? One would think that if Meyer's vampires were supposed to be the "good guys," then taking a drink from a person and leaving them alive would be preferable to slaughtering animals.

3) Ok..the whole pregnancy thing is just asinine! They are DEAD! Has anyone here ever felt a dead body?? They are COLD. Even if a male vampire could produce bodily fluids, those tadpoles would not swim!

I'm sure I could think of more issues...but that's what I have for now.

Lucy, I have read the first book.

OK, the Twilight phenomenon and sanitizing of dark fiction: I simply think it's ridiculous to literally romanticize monsters, sexy or not. The allure and terror of vampires comes from what they represent: evil. No matter how sanitized the sexual relationship between the vampire (yes an ancient, dead-alive man) and the young woman in Twilight, when one actually thinks about what it represents, it is disgusting--as it should be. That's why bloodsuckers are bloodsuckers, and horror is horrifying--and exhilarating.

Leland that was awesome. I wish there were a like button that I could hit.

After having read Anne Rice's vampire series I didn't even bother with these little ridiculous books. Also, being from New Orleans where vampire and voodoo lore is practically a way of life, the idea of vampires having "sparkly" skin and and being able to reproduce is just plain asinine.

Well said Leland.

Lucy wrote: "I haven't read the books either...but the Twilight phenomena is such that reading them isn't really required as far as I can see. You can't get away from it! Believe me, I've tried!!

My issues w..."

Damn, Lucy..."Tadpoles"??? LOL. You have a funny sense of humor.

Leland wrote: "OK, the Twilight phenomenon and sanitizing of dark fiction: I simply think it's ridiculous to literally romanticize monsters, sexy or not. The allure and terror of vampires comes from what they re..."

VERY well stated, Leland!

I don't like how they have all those super powers. And it's almost impossible to kill them. Meyer took away all thier weaknesses like stakes, garlic, sunlight, etc. A character without weaknesses is boring.

Dan wrote: "I don't like how they have all those super powers. And it's almost impossible to kill them. Meyer took away all thier weaknesses like stakes, garlic, sunlight, etc. A character without weaknesses i..."
EXACTLY! When there's no "chance" for failure, what's the motivation to continue on with the storyline?

Exactley Kimberly.

I totally agree! Ok...I am the first to admit that I haven't read the books (but I'm thinking I might have to throw myself under the bus..as Dan says, it helps to "know the enemy.") However, it's impossible to escape the Twilight frenzy, much to my dismay, so I have heard about them. I totally agree with what both Kimberly and Dan stated...the characters, especially the vampires, are completely one dimensional!! There is no conflict, no depth...I really enjoyed the diagram Dan posted in one of the threads about the proper way to write a story. You NEED conflict, you need weakness or issues, in order to have a compelling story! And, could someone please tell me WHY the character of Bella is immune to EVERYTHING?? And why she seems to have an entire population of beings ("wussy" vampires, "evil" vampires, werewolves, and humans) literally willing to die for her? She is human right? I guess since she is Meyer's literary doppleganger of the girl she desperately wants to be, she is just a special unique snowflake of a human, huh?

Lucy, Meyer was just an unhappy housewife that started writing her fantasies on her computer. Then her sister read it and gave her a "kick in the ass" to go get it published. I'm not being sarcastic here or making this up. That's basically what happened.

Lucy wrote: "I totally agree! Ok...I am the first to admit that I haven't read the books (but I'm thinking I might have to throw myself under the bus..as Dan says, it helps to "know the enemy.") However, it's..."

Lucy--I've only read the one. Anyhow, they're so "commercialized" that you don't need to read them to know what they're about.

I still think Dan should add that "realistic trailer" here somehow--I'm still LMAO at that.

Kimberly wrote: "Lucy wrote: "I totally agree! Ok...I am the first to admit that I haven't read the books (but I'm thinking I might have to throw myself under the bus..as Dan says, it helps to "know the enemy.") ..."

Very well, Kimberly. I'll look on youtube and see if they have it.

:)

I really have enjoyed the honest trailers. I have showed all my Twilight friends, they couldn't help but laugh.

E.B. wrote: "I really have enjoyed the honest trailers. I have showed all my Twilight friends, they couldn't help but laugh."

E.B., I am enjoying your book so far.

I do believe you will like my Alice much better then the Twilight Alice. You will meet her in Chapter 9 and 10.

You have an "Alice"?

Dan wrote: "You have an "Alice"?"

I created this character with my brother over fifteen years ago. I really felt I had to add her, and I refused to rename her, but yes there is an Alice. You meet her in the Chapter Mile High Rd.

This touches on so many issues that I too found very frustrating and annoying. For those delusional twitards out there who say you have to read all of them, I did, and they are all pretty terrible, it's so anticlimactic.

They gather everyone about for this big battle and then hold up, let's all go home, good thing I didn't use my frequent flyer miles for this.

I was so sad that a beloved Werewolf from the Underworld series got suckered in to play one of these 'vampires'. It's all garbage.

One thing that I don't think we have bashed on enough is Jacob imprinting on the little demon child. WTF?
I'm like so into you, Bella...

Nah Jacob, I had a little interest in you when you became all Adonisy, but nah.

Ah it's cool, I'll bone your daughter, don't worry I'll wait around like a lecherous man until the time is right.

That's awesome Jacob! Now we can still be close!

SERIOUSLY??!! How deranged is that? And the whole 'sex' scene is simply pathetic, all this amped up sexual 'frustration' and it's over in a wham-bam-her's your effin baby... really? Garbage. Utter, and complete garbage!

yaaay, Lauren! I think you might hate it more then me....lol.

Haha I dislike it quite a bit. The worst part is that I was on board, I have all the books in hard back because I read them as they came out. I was team Jacob and then it progressively got worse and worse and then disgusting.

I started reading them while taking Latin 304 and Greek 302, I wanted some light, popcorn type reading with no thinking as a break from stuff that sometimes took 25-40 minutes a line to read.

But then it was all just terrible and it's such filth to be young-adult fiction. It has also set the bar low for young adult stuff. There are so many better, accomplished series to read that are completely eclipsed by this garbage. It not only destroyed, nearly single handedly, the vampire, but it also wrecked the young-adult genre.

I also have read them all as they came out, before the whole thing got waaay out of control, and found myself laughing at most of it. The first thing that bugged me was that, vamps and werewolves aside, Meyer has simple re-written old books: the first and second books are effectively Romeo and Juliet, the third book completely echoes Wuthering Heights, and the fourth The Merchant of Venice. She even mentions these books throughout, as if this somehow makes it okay.
The second book was a struggle to finish. I appreciate we've all probably broken up with someone which has been hard to deal with at some stage in our lives, but seriously?! Cant one character in this book slap her round the face and tell her to pull herself together? Hallucinating about said ex-boyfriend and nearly killing yourself to do so is not healthy or normal, and this is what teenage girls are being subjected to? Oh but it's okay cos he was so just looking out for you and we all live happily ever after, blah blah.
The whole pregnancy thing also riled me: Meyer even contradicts her own storyline...Bella discovers she's pregnant, thinks its impossible. Then concludes that female vamps can't have children because their bodies cannot change to adapt to a growing baby. How, therefore, can the male vamps get an erection, if their bodies can't change? Bullshit.
Add to all that the fact that everyone finds their happy ever after (cos of course that really happens and we all ride off into the sunset smelling the roses) and the awful anti-climatic ending to it all (which even the film changed cos they realised how crap it was) I really don't get what the huge fuss is. I'm a lot more cynical now of any book that is commercialised so much.

Anyway, deep breath, rant over. Keep calm and carry on :)

J.M. wrote: "I also have read them all as they came out, before the whole thing got waaay out of control, and found myself laughing at most of it. The first thing that bugged me was that, vamps and werewolves a..."

I really enjoyed your rant. It is hard to understand what people see in these blood sucking aliens, but all we can hope for is that it dies quick as it came.

My one issue: that she dares call them "vampires."

J.M. wrote: "I also have read them all as they came out, before the whole thing got waaay out of control, and found myself laughing at most of it. The first thing that bugged me was that, vamps and werewolves a..."

yeah I hear ya on the whole sex/romance thing. People do get depressed and suicidal over ex's. But does that make it okay for Meyer to tell them it is???? NO!!!!!!!!!!
And here's the thing, since you brought up the pregnancy thing (keep in mind I've only read the first book but I know what goes on in the other books. But feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). Meyer says that her "vampires" do not have any bodily fluids. Well, in order to have sex with Bella Edward needs to get an erection. In order to get an erection the penis must become filled with blood. And in order to get a girl pregnant you need semen. So how the hell could he do that if he can't bust a nut in her let alone get it up???

Dan wrote: "J.M. wrote: "I also have read them all as they came out, before the whole thing got waaay out of control, and found myself laughing at most of it. The first thing that bugged me was that, vamps and..."

What you have failed to realize... is that Meyer's vamps ALL WAYS HAVE A HARD ON!!!!! And they didn't need sperm, that's how strong there love is. It all makes perfect... look white rabbit.

E.B. wrote: "Dan wrote: "J.M. wrote: "I also have read them all as they came out, before the whole thing got waaay out of control, and found myself laughing at most of it. The first thing that bugged me was tha..."

Are you mocking me, old friend? No, Meyer's stuff is still crap.

P.S.- When are you sending my shirts?

No I mock Meyer's, because her story as so many holes in it. And your shirts on there way I promise. I have everything hit a one time. I'm helping produce a music cd, my second book, the cover, on and on. And problems with shirt guy.... I had to switch vendors. As soon as I get to town I will pick up the shirts from a store that as them, but I am not forgetting.

Thank you, E.B.. I hope we can do more work together in the future.

Lucy wrote: "I haven't read the books either...but the Twilight phenomena is such that reading them isn't really required as far as I can see. You can't get away from it! Believe me, I've tried!!

My issues w..."

Or they could break into blood banks since Edwards "dad" was a doctor. haha I thought the same thing about the blood.

Lucy wrote: "I totally agree! Ok...I am the first to admit that I haven't read the books (but I'm thinking I might have to throw myself under the bus..as Dan says, it helps to "know the enemy.") However, it's..."

haha It's because she still has her magical "V" card and everyone wants to take it. And Bella is supposed to be this plain Jane type who's not all that good looking and has no social skills. Yet everyone thinks she's that hottest thing ever. That's what I don't like. Every character should have a pro and a con. In the movie Kristin Stewart doesn't fit Bella at all. To me I think she's way to pretty to play her. That right there killed it. And the two guys who played Edward and Jacob are not attractive

Lauren wrote: "This touches on so many issues that I too found very frustrating and annoying. For those delusional twitards out there who say you have to read all of them, I did, and they are all pretty terrible..."

So I'm not the only one who thought that Jacob imprinting on a baby was gross and weird. How would he explain that to her when she's old. "You see, I was trying to get with your mom but then your dad got in the way of that so I'm settling with you. Edward now has to worry about his daughter having half breed." I wonder if she'll write another book about them. haha

And who the kid age normally or super fast like she was? Because she wouldn't last all that long if she kept aging like that. I can't remember if she stops aging at some point or not.

Katharine wrote: "Lauren wrote: "This touches on so many issues that I too found very frustrating and annoying. For those delusional twitards out there who say you have to read all of them, I did, and they are all ..."

Well in the last movie she aged super fast. And yes, it is gross imprinting on a baby. A lot of Twi-Tards try to defend that tooth and nail, but it's just gross. There is something wrong with Meyer.

First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon realized that she writes like a third grader. She has no talent and, in my opinion, no right to the millions she has made simply because she found a lucrative way to market something to teenagers. Putting that aside, nothing about her vampires make any sense. If they have no bodily fluids, why would they drink any blood at all? I could be wrong but I have heard that they do drink blood...it is simply the blood of animals. So where does it go if not in the body? Second, how would any vampire in any way impregnate someone? Does she realize that vampires are not made like humans, that they procreate through teeth on skin contact, that they would not have the ability or a reason to procreate like a human? Probably not. I honestly don't think she knows anything about what vampires are supposed to do. I would love to know the vampire novels that inspired her because my guess has always been that she gave vampires no thought until she suddenly decided to rip apart everything that made a vampire a vampire for the amusement of teenage girls. lol I have been accused of being harsh when it comes to Twilight. Maybe I am. I don't mind new concepts concerning vampires. Anne Rice's vampires were once very much against the grain of the traditional Dracula-style vampire that was popular before her and I love her work. However, I do believe that if you are going to write about vampires you better have a real interest in them and you should be prepared to look through all of the old myths and the way that they've been portrayed in fiction to decide, logically, what you believe a vampire would be if they existed. I do not see anything about the Twilight "vampires" that suggest Myers did any of that.

Keair wrote: "First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon realized that ..."

LOL....Keair, that was AWESOME. I wish this was like facebook and I could hit the like button under that post. Good thoughts dude.

Dan wrote: "Keair wrote: "First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon ..."

Thank you. :)

Keair wrote: "First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon realized that ..."

Great insight!

Keair wrote: "First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon realized that ..."

Yup, you said it all!

The Twilight Saga reads like an incomplete outline for a poorly done 8th grade creative writing class assignment. As vampires Stephenie Meyer's characters make no sense, however as a family of sparkle fairy fae who dwell in the woods and drink animal blood...

Keair wrote: "First, I have a problem with Stephanie Myers in general because before I knew anything about Twilight beyond the fact that it was a "vampire" novel, I attempted to read it...and soon realized that ..." Clearly Stephenie Meyer has little use for quality research or respect for the legends of any culture. Look at her treatment of the legend of the Vampir in the character of Renesmee. Or the Native American Skinwalkers...A little good research would have gone a long way.

Lucy wrote: "I haven't read the books either...but the Twilight phenomena is such that reading them isn't really required as far as I can see. You can't get away from it! Believe me, I've tried!!

My issues w..." Unfortunately, The Twilight Saga has so much wrong in it. However, there are legends about the children of humans and vampires. These hybrid children are known as Vampir. Such children can only be made by a vampire who after being turned has retained part of their soul. Also it is required that there must be true love between the human and vampire. The third requirement is sacrifice because the nature of the vampir is to cannibalize its mother killing her. While keeping all that she was within them. This sacrifice was to restore a vampires soul completely allowing them natural life, death, sins forgiven, and entry into heaven to be reunited with their beloved. Vampir children in legend often become vampire hunters. Stephenie Meyer saw this legend somewhere and used it in part with the Renesmee character. The name Renesmee means reborn & loved.

Angela wrote: "Lucy wrote: "I haven't read the books either...but the Twilight phenomena is such that reading them isn't really required as far as I can see. You can't get away from it! Believe me, I've tried!!..."

I think you are referring to the DHAMPIR legend. Renesemee....yuck I really hate that name.

Yes, the Dhampir. For some reason in Japan they are often called Vampir. Their theme is very popular in anime, the most well known Vampire Hunter D. Renesemee is not a great name...

If Stephenie Meyer had done better research on the Native American Skinwalker legend Renesemee may have been named something more like Mai-coh, the Navajo word for wolf and witch. Something that would have worked well in having Jacob imprint on her. In fact, that entire episode needed to be handled better.

Angela wrote: "Yes, the Dhampir. For some reason in Japan they are often called Vampir. Their theme is very popular in anime, the most well known Vampire Hunter D. Renesemee is not a great name..."

Vampire Hunter D kicks ass!

Lauren wrote: "This touches on so many issues that I too found very frustrating and annoying. For those delusional twitards out there who say you have to read all of them, I did, and they are all pretty terrible..."

Such a nasty mix by Stephenie Meyer...This is why she really needed a real storyline. She could have used a historic connection between the Black family and the Swan family to explain the current connection between Jacob and Bella. Then she could have used a skinwalker legend with prophecy to explain why Jacob would imprint on Renesmee. There is a scene in Breaking Dawn part 1 where pregnant Bella is withering. It is determined by an angry Jacob that the baby monsterly craves blood. Yet Stephenie has Carlisle rolling up his sleeve to fill a cup of blood for Bella to drink. If she had thought to have Jacob do it instead then Renesmee would have had some of Jacob's lifeforce and the way of the wolf become part of her and further help to explain the imprinting. It would also have meant that Renesmee would not need to cannibalize so much of her mother allowing Bella to "live" as a vampire.