SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion

So if you haven't heard the news GoodReads has been sold to Amazon. Here is the blog post - http://www.goodreads.com/blog/show/41... and the press release - http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.z...

What does this mean for users? No one really knows yet. There are concerns about review policies. Concerns about Amazon's track record with similar sites (Shelfari). Maybe this will have minimal effect on users, I certainly hope so.

What does everyone think?

As a Nook user, I'm concerned. This site is already too "Kindle this" and "Kindle that".

As a Nook user in a year or so you probably won't have much to do on it except install modified software on it so you can use it fully. It's all I do with mine as it is.

But I get where you are coming from. I'm really unsure about this, I have my fingers crossed for the best. The Book Depository is still a really good site, they don't have anything to do with Kindle.

As long as the structure remains intact, I believe the integration can only benefit readers. However, as soon as the culture is compromised, people will grow irritated. I think it's just one of those things we will have to play it by ear and nose. If it stinks, I'm sure you'll hear about it.

I'm hoping the injection of money will improve the server issues that keep plaguing this place.

Well, for a while now, my reading experience is connected with Amazon through Kindle and I'm really satisfied how everything goes. Integration of Goodreads and Kindle is most welcoming so I can't wait to see what's on their mind.
Generally, I don't think there will be some major changes concerning Goodreads as they know Goodreads is about readers so don't mess with them if you want to keep them.

Igor wrote: "Generally, I don't think there will be some major changes concerning Goodreads as they know Goodreads is about readers so don't mess with them if you want to keep them."

Both Shelfari and Stanza were about readers. Stanza is gone now and I hear nothing but bad about Shelfari.

We're stanza and shelfari acquired by Amazon?

Great. I am already held hostage by my Kindle and now they own Goodreads I will never get away!

Chris wrote: "Great. I am already held hostage by my Kindle and now they own Goodreads I will never get away!"

And my issue is that now I'll be held hostage by your Kindle too. Heh.

J.D. wrote: "We're stanza and shelfari acquired by Amazon?"

Yes. Stanza was bought in 2009 and Shelfari in 2008. Not everything they own has gone bad though. Audible, The Book Depository, Abe Books, all seem to still be going strong.

Kim wrote: "Both Shelfari and Stanza were about readers. Stanza is gone now and I hear nothing but bad about Shelfari."

Then people will leave and find another place, as always.

I have experienced trouble with Stanza. You're right about the success of the other acquisitions. What are some prospective downfalls or negative issues that could occur from this integration?

There isn't a lot left. LivingSocial used to have a good book cataloging section but I believe that is now gone. I moved to GR from LS. As I said Shelfari is owned by Amazon. LibraryThing is 40% owned by Amazon. Apparently there is an Australian-run site called The Reading Room which can import data exported from GR, but it's quite small at the moment.

Personally I'm not worried about anything that will occur with my book lists. I can't see any fundamental changes that would cause problems with those. I'm worried about how my reviews will be affected and whether Amazon will try anything with groups. I already dislike the amount of spam around here, especially the Author section, and would hate to have Amazon pushing stuff to our members.

J.D. wrote: "What are some prospective downfalls or negative issues that could occur from this integration?"

Reviews being deleted with no notice. Harsher policies on what a review can be. Commercial use of reviews/posts/comments. Removal of all ebook links that aren't for Kindle.

Chris wrote: "And my issue is that now I'll be held hostage by your Kindle too. Heh."

Oh cmon, Kindle as ereader is great ;)

The kindle is awesome but not being able to read books purchased on the iBook store sucks

@Kim That last one is huge . It's important for GR to remain beneficial to the reader, because that is the mission statement of the site.

Kim wrote: "Reviews being deleted with no notice. Harsher policies on what a review can be. Commercial use of reviews/posts/comments. Removal of all ebook links that aren't for Kindle. "

That is a bottom line and unless they wanna shut down Goodreads none of it would happen. Come on, a bit more optimism people. Doesn't have to be all bad when big companies are around (well in most cases is but still...)

You're right! We can only hope they appreciate the GR community and culture of that community enough to maintain the framework of it.

J.D. wrote: "You're right! We can only hope they appreciate the GR community and culture of that community enough to maintain the framework of it."

Of course that is the whole idea. If they wanna improve Kindle experience by integrating it wih Goodreads fine with me but buying Goodreads just to shut it down would not benefit Amazon. And no, previous experiences doesn't necessarily means it will happen here too.

J.D. wrote: "You're right! We can only hope they appreciate the GR community and culture of that community enough to maintain the framework of it."

Yeah, that would be my only concern. I love the community feel of Goodreads and just hope it doesn't become too commercial or focused on selling books.

I use Amazon a ton though and buy many books from them, both Kindle and regular books, so I can't pretend like I don't like the company! They've made my life a lot easier in many ways.

I am being cautiously optimistic. I like Amazon and Kindle. My Kindle is one of my most prized possessions alongside my camera. It's rare for me to go somewhere without either (or both).

But I'm also worried about any potential negative repercussions.

Thanks for the link.

All of this is exacerbating my panic.

I am concerned that GoodReads will no longer be an outlet for independent publishers and self-published books that are too small to qualify for Amazon.

As someone (Kim) mentioned earlier, I'm hoping Amazon's $$$$s will sort out the server issues, make website run faster and slicker with less issues.

It wouldn't make business sense for Amazon to shut down GR, with this huge exposure to lots more 'potential customers'.

The last thing they would want is a mass exodus.

The best thing I can say is that at least it isn't Google.

I'm taking a wait-and-see attitude. On one hand, Amazon isn't a bunch of screw-ups like Google and they aren't stupid like Facebook, but it still is a giant company now who are getting cutthroat about competition.

Igor wrote: "That is a bottom line and unless they wanna shut down Goodreads none of it would happen. Come on, a bit more optimism people. Doesn't have to be all bad when big companies are around (well in most cases is but still...) "

Why wouldn't it happen? All they'd need say is that goodreads review rules have to follow Amazon rules and that'd be it.

My concern is that they'd mess with the review algorithms. It wouldn't make sense to have a site that's just a clone of theirs. There's a good reason why I look up books here and not there. And the idea that they could delete reviews makes me nuts. Goodreads is a whole different thing than their site though. This is my database of my records that I worked really hard to accumulate, that is information that I volunteered into their database that they can do whatever they want with. I hope they understand the difference.

Ala wrote: "Why wouldn't it happen? All they'd need say is that goodreads review rules have to follow Amazon rules and that'd be it. "

Because in that case they may as well rename Goodreads to Amazon and what would be a point in doing so?

Good link to check out (thanks Jeffrey)

http://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/by...

Igor wrote: "Good link to check out (thanks Jeffrey)

http://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/by..."

Interesting article. Thanks for posting, Igor!

I'll be interested to see if Goodreads does start selling books itself.

that would be soooo fatal to my credit card...

Julie wrote: "I am concerned that GoodReads will no longer be an outlet for independent publishers and self-published books that are too small to qualify for Amazon."

Actually, as a Amazon-published author, I've found Amazon has been pretty good to us indies. The customer service can be pretty bad when you have special requests, though. I'm curious... What do you mean by "too small"?

My big question, though, is how far Shelfari will be integrated into Goodreads. My (faulty?) impression is that Shelfari has been the #2 book review site, with Goodreads the obvious #1. I expect that Amazon will go with the strength, now that they've acquired Goodreads, but simply ignoring or, more dauntingly, trying to integrate one significant user base into the other is a big deal...

Here's another article. This one makes the case for the positives that could come out of this deal:

http://davidgaughran.wordpress.com/20...

I think my only fear is that once merged the reviews and discussions that I may be involved with will effect or change what Amazon may do with recommendations for reading, especially if they incorporate that into Goodreads. I am a kindle user, and I find that due to my wide range of reading genres that what Amazon offers is limiting and feels forced. I find that the users on Goodreads offers me a wider selection of informed choice and opinions. I tend to make my reading choices here. I hope that does not change.

^Agree with Scott.

Same here Scott, I tend to pick up my next book here either by reviews or recommendations. That probably will not change.

So the great Satan gets what it wants agaain

OK, I'm a Goodreads author, and my books (printed and ebook version) are listed on Amazon; but they are also listed with Barnes & Noble and a bunch of other online sellers, including iBookstore.

I'm also a business guy, and I think that, in general, it's a bad idea for a site that reviews or discusses products to be owned by a major vendor of those products. And yes, I am concerned about the question of deleted (or modified, or restricted) reviews, as well as restrictions on posts that mention or refer to a bookseller other than Amazon. Let me ask you this: If Consumer Reports were suddenly acquired by General Motors, would you put much faith in their automobile reviews?

I've had a few experiences along those lines -- been associated with hobby forums "sponsored" by a major vendor of products associated with the hobby, and had to deal with some "thought police" issues regarding posts that didn't serve the "sponsor's" interest. I don't belong to those forums any more.

Goodreads is about free discussion among readers and authors, those who appreciate books for their content, no matter who is selling them. I hope it stays that way, but I do have my concerns.

Oh, and by the way, I used to have Stanza as a book reader on my iPhone, and I loved it because it would let me read books in Microsoft Reader (.lit) format (of which I have a very large collection, including many classics in the public domain). Amazon bought it and killed it (or rather, let it die by failing to update it so it would run under newer versions of Apple's IOS). Fortunately, I found Calibre (which lets me convert those old books to ePub) and MegaReader (which lets me read them on an iPhone or iPad).

Amazon's Kindle supports the MOBI format; but most other readers (including the Nook and other Android-based devices) use ePub. It's really a war of technology, and I'm old enough to remember the old VHS-vs-Beta videotape wars (in which superior technology lost out to superior marketing). I fear that the Goodreads aquisition by Amazon is just a strategic move in another such war.

I am most worried about a potential influx of people who think Twilight is the best book EVAR

Chris wrote: "I am most worried about a potential influx of people who think Twilight is the best book EVAR"

There's already lots of those people on here. Never venture near a paranormal romance group...

Chris wrote: "I am most worried about a potential influx of people who think Twilight is the best book EVAR"

LOL ;)

Seriously though, I think there are some real concerns about reviews which haven't really been addressed yet. I'd love to hear the back story -- do you think we'll get to find out?

John is right, the big concern here is credibility. Does anyone know when the official change will take place (actual integration)?

"One thing is for certain; there is no stopping them; the ants will soon be here. And I for one welcome our new insect overlords. I'd like to remind them that as a trusted TV personality, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil in their underground sugar caves." - 1994 Simpsons episode (#96, Homer In Space)

J.D. wrote: "John is right, the big concern here is credibility. Does anyone know when the official change will take place (actual integration)?"

The sale will be finalised mid-year.

John wrote: "Amazon's Kindle supports the MOBI format; but most other readers (including the Nook and other Android-based devices) use ePub. It's really a war of technology, and I'm old enough to remember the old VHS-vs-Beta videotape wars (in which superior technology lost out to superior marketing). I fear that the Goodreads aquisition by Amazon is just a strategic move in another such war."

In a nutshell this was my concern, poorly phrased above. Jeff Bezos comes across as an affable, nice guy, but he's as ruthless as the head of any other big company you can name.

I, too, am old enough to recall VHS v. Betamax, which was echoed in the Blu Ray v. HD-DVD war 20 years later. In both instances the superior technology lost to the deeper pockets backed by the bigger conglomerate. At this point only Apple can stand up to Amazon, and I'm not a big fan of Apple.

I do find it troubling that they are systematically gobbling up the indie sites. IMDB became horribly difficult to use after Amazon bought it. We just have to hope Amazon won't become another Wal-Mart, but all the signs point to that direction.

Hopefully it will go more the direction of Costco.