Clean Romances discussion
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It's all in 'The Kiss'!
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Definitely agree with all of the above. Can't stand stories where they go from hating each other to falling into each other's arms. A kiss should be the physical expression of a beautiful relationship, not something thrown in to keep the readers' attention. I love the way you write your books; I have to have a little bit of romance, but it's so refreshing to read a solid plot that draws you in and leads up to 'the kiss'.
I also agree with all the above and especially no mention of tongues,but I do love to read that the hero pulled her closer and 'deepened' the kiss,like Gilbert does when he kisses Anne Shirley at the end of Green Gables the Sequel..AKA/Anne Of Avonlea[swooooon!]I also love when the hero puts a finger under her chin to raise her face for a kiss.
Jessica wrote: "Definitely agree with all of the above. Can't stand stories where they go from hating each other to falling into each other's arms. A kiss should be the physical expression of a beautiful relations..."Wow, thank you Jessica! I'm so pleased that you enjoyed them!
I have the next book in my Broken City series going live on 1st of February 2014, Broken Truce. If you're interested I can send you a complementary copy the day it goes live through smashwords. Just PM me your email address.
DeeDee ;-D
Christine wrote: "I also agree with all the above and especially no mention of tongues,but I do love to read that the hero pulled her closer and 'deepened' the kiss,like Gilbert does when he kisses Anne Shirley at t..."Yep! Nothing wrong with deepening a kiss!!! ;-P
Re: D.D. ,Oh yes and when he pulls her against him,'Whew,mercy me',lol!! I believe that's my favorite film kiss.
What I wouldn't give to read a sweet romance that take into account all of the above mentioned points in a kiss...
Kitty wrote: "What I wouldn't give to read a sweet romance that take into account all of the above mentioned points in a kiss..."They're few and far between!
im with you on the gentle and sweet first kiss. a kiss should only be shared when there is already a relationship in bloom, not thrown away on harry, dick or tom. nerves on the part of both heroine and hero are good - that's how it is in real life. the last first kiss I shared was 18 years ago. it is still sharp in my mind. that's what I want to read. something that puts you in that time and place and makes you blush(sweetly, not due to graphic content) and feel cherished. a small dose of passion is good too. its not like she is kissing her brother. if you need tutoring on how to write a kiss I recommend you read Marcia Lynn McClure, not because she always gets it "right" but just because of the sheer volume of lip action in her books ;O)
Ljb wrote: "im with you on the gentle and sweet first kiss. a kiss should only be shared when there is already a relationship in bloom, not thrown away on harry, dick or tom. nerves on the part of both heroine..."Lol! Thanks, Ljb!
I love sweet gestures. They say so much about a hero.Just like intense sex scenes, kisses should happen at the right moment.
I agree with that the relationship should be building before the kiss, with kindness and attraction already established. The kissing scene should have some anticipation, a gentle touch, a warm look, an embrace to give the reader time to fall into the lovely moment. I like the kiss itself stretched out a bit, but without graphic anatomical details. Kissing scenes should make the reader smile. D.D. I've always wondered about that mouth staring thing. I don't ever remember staring at someone's mouth, or having anyone stare at mine. Do people actually do that?
Beth wrote: "I agree with that the relationship should be building before the kiss, with kindness and attraction already established. The kissing scene should have some anticipation, a gentle touch, a warm look..."I have no idea, Beth!
I would find it really awkward to be staring at someone's mouth for any amount of time. I think the only time looking at someone's lips is non creepy, is if you're admiring their lipstick!!! ;-P
I totally agree with your points. I think a lot of books fail this list for me. I really can't think of that many "kiss" scenes in books that I like. Often its bogged down by exaggerated description that never ends.I totally agree with Beth: "kissing scenes should make the reader smile."
If the kiss can't make the reader smile, it should at least make them feel good.
The most romantic first kiss is a simple, brief kiss on lips and nothing more. It implies affection yet restraint, and the promise of deeper affections to come. In my opinion, the best romances need little or no kissing at all, just a deftly handled deepening communion of the hearts.
I cant agree with no kissing. I like a well written kiss that makes your heart melt (maybe because we are remembering our own first kiss?) but it should invoke tenderness not sexual tension. maybe we could take a poll on the mouth gazing issue? its the eyes that catch my attention, not the lips. anyone out there prone to staring at their loves lips?
Yep, I think a kiss or two is needed. I just don't want to feel like I should be closing a door and giving the Hero and Heroine some privacy!!!
Wow, I so agree,being totally against no kissing at all! That is no romance then,if there is no physical attraction,and what would be the incentive to marry without any sparks? No thanks,if my late hubby[of 30 years] had not been able to 'light my fire of desire' we would have never become a couple!
I feel like I have been cheated if I read a romance and there is no excitement or passion at all. I love to read how being in each other's presence affects each other's concentration ect. "Been there, done that",~ author, take me back to those days,oh yeah!
I like a LOT of buildup to the first kiss, and I like a lot of passion in it, but without groping other body parts. A good kissing scene makes me remember why I love kissing my husband. Sometimes I ask him to give me a "first kiss" so I can remember again after 31 years. :D
Tamie wrote: "I like a LOT of buildup to the first kiss, and I like a lot of passion in it, but without groping other body parts. A good kissing scene makes me remember why I love kissing my husband. Sometimes I..."the original remains the original. retake is after all only a retake :-)
Jaideep wrote: "Tamie wrote: "I like a LOT of buildup to the first kiss, and I like a lot of passion in it, but without groping other body parts. A good kissing scene makes me remember why I love kissing my husban..."Ha, ha! So true!
Tamie wrote: "I like a LOT of buildup to the first kiss, and I like a lot of passion in it, but without groping other body parts. A good kissing scene makes me remember why I love kissing my husband. Sometimes I..."Exactly, Tamie!!! :]
My biggest pet peeve in a book is when the kiss gets interrupted right before the kiss happens. Especially if the couple never gets back to it! I just finished a very delightful read. Loved it, except(!!) the kiss I was waiting for never happened as they were interrupted and the author never got back to it! The book just ended. I felt quite cheated. :-(
Marinda wrote: "My biggest pet peeve in a book is when the kiss gets interrupted right before the kiss happens. Especially if the couple never gets back to it! I just finished a very delightful read. Loved it, ..."No way!!!!
That would have driven me NUTS!!! Or as we like to say in my family: it would have driven me up the wall, across the ceiling and down the other side!
I must admit that I have a scene in one of my books where the hero and heroine are about to kiss and are interrupted. But the hero finishes it off before he leaves, so the reader doesn't feel cheated (I hope!!!). ;-)
I don't think 'staring' at lips is very romantic, but I've always thought it brought up tension leading to the first kiss when it's mentioned that the hero 'glances' at them when he's talking to the heroine. It lets the reader know what's on his mind. If you haven't kissed that person before, you do get a little focused on their lips/mouth, I think. Wondering what it would be like to feel them, waiting for just the right moment to seal the deal. :-) I like it! The first kiss in a book is very important. I recently finished my very first novel and it felt like FOREVER before I got to the perfect spot to write it! It was just as much anticipation for me as it will be for my readers, I hope! :-)
Beth wrote:D.D. I've always wondered about that mouth staring thing. I don't ever remember staring at someone's mouth, or having anyone stare at mine. Do people actually do that? Oh yes,in both cases! I have done it and had it done to me,lol!
All right then. You must have a very attractive mouth, Christine, lol. I agree, Jaimie, that glancing at her lips and thinking about the kiss is lovely as long as he doesn't stare so long she starts to wonder if her lipstick is smeared.
I prefer a little something more than the endings of Georgette Heyer's novels. I like something that will make me say AWWWW and smile. I want it to come after a moment of deep emotional connection. I like h/h that talk to each other. Never underestimate the power of a good waltz in a historical novel. Matthew and Mary in the Christmas episode of Downton Abbey is perfect. The reference to Anne the Sequel is great, but I also love the moment at the end of the first movie when he calls her carrots and gently touches her hair. That always makes me swoon. There could have been a kiss there if Anne hadn't been so busy snubbing him. Also, the scene in the Sequel where they meet in Kingsport in the rain and catch up and they ALMOST kiss but he's engaged to Christine (boo!). He gives her the note and takes off. Then she races after him to the train station to wave goodbye. I wanted him to jump off that train, say to heck with Christine and go back to Anne but obviously it can't happen that way.
I don't like excessive lust or descriptions of body parts and tingling or whatever. Just have their lips meet and fade to black but let them kiss.
I'm not sure I'm making sense, it's very late. I'll think more on this tomorrow.
Re:Qnpoohbear,Oh I so agree with the other scenes you mentioned in Anne of Green Gables/Avonlea, in fact now I just have to watch both DVDs again,lol! ;)I also do not like excessive lust, or descriptions of body parts,but I do love the mention of tingling or heat,because I experienced that when I first met my deceased hubby when he reached around me for something and I definitely felt the electricity,lol!
Qnpoohbear wrote: Never underestimate the power of a good waltz in a historical novel. "Talking of dancing, my favorite sexually-charged dance is the one in Sound of Music.
The Austrian dance.
Priceless.
Yes, I always loved the dance scene in the Sound of Music, even when I was young and didn't know quite why. I enjoy reading a variety of kiss scenes, not necessarily all in the same book, lol. Characters are different so I think the kiss should reflect that. That being said, the perfect first kiss should involve eye contact, slowly moving closer, a hand gently touching or lifting the woman's head, and a gentle but romantic kiss, not lightning quick like a peck but not too long either.
I think the staring at lips phrase has been over used. I too hate it when the kiss gets interrupted time and time again.
Shereen wrote: "Qnpoohbear wrote: Never underestimate the power of a good waltz in a historical novel. "Talking of dancing, my favorite sexually-charged dance is the one in Sound of Music.
The Austrian dance.
P..."
I second that! I always find myself rewinding that scene so many times whenever I watch the movie! :) I love the one in The King and I as well. So beautiful!
Talking of dancing, my favorite sexually-charged dance is the one in Sound of Music.The Austrian dance.
P..."
I love that scene too, as well as the dance in the gazebo with Liesl. So romantic.
The lesson in those scenes, Beth and Anne, is that there is so much sexually charged tension there without a single word spoken and barely any touching. Incredible. All done solely through graceful movement to music and eye contact. And so much emotion is shown - admiration, humor, tension, fluster, envy, understanding, shock - all conveyed through expressions alone.
Color me gobsmacked. :)
That's so true... very well said Shereen!
Anne wrote: "That's so true... very well said Shereen!"Oh yes, I second that! :]
Ooh yes The Lendler scene is one of my favorites! The end of the North and South movie (with Richard Armitage)is also very swoony. I thought of a few things that make a good kiss scene:
A gentle kiss and then gently touching foreheads and/or holding hands, kissing hands or holding hand to heart (as in Emma). The sunset kiss in Titanic is beautiful but I wouldn't copy it because it's so well known.
I just read Devilish Dilemma by Judith Lansdowne and there are a few sweet kisses in the book. She kept it clean and more in target for the Regency period than many writers who toss etiquette out the window.
For modern stories, I like the middle of Babycakes by Donna Kauffman before the love scene. It involves emotional connection and nice kisses. I felt that part belonged at the end of the book.
in absolute agreement over the on screen kiss at the end of north and south. WOW. the ability to translate such incredible intensity of feeling in words on a page is seldom seen. and since we are reading romance - I feel that THE KISS is vital and integral to the emotion of the book. even a great story line can become forgettable if the kiss is a let down. thanks for the recommendation of "devilish dilemma". its on the top of my too read.
I just had to respond to some of these from the don't like list, because I totally agree."1. If I'm still reading, I already know the hero is hot, please don't feel the need to remind me at this delicate moment, it just makes the heroine look like a shallow bimbo."
-YES! How shallow are you if the moment the man your supposedly adore is kissing you, you're thinking about his looks. Really? Focus on the moment!
"6. Endless staring at each others mouths... this just gets creepy after a while."
-I think a glance at the other's mouth is great, but staring…do people really do that?
"8. Do NOT tell me how innocent the heroine is and then turn her into a harlot. I do not buy it!"
-Ah yes, the classic, 'I've never kissed a man and now, oops! I just fell into bed with him'. *shaking my head*
"9. Stop eating each other, if you're hungry get take out!"
-Makes me crazy when they describe how someone tastes. It's just weird.
Annette wrote: "I just had to respond to some of these from the don't like list, because I totally agree."1. If I'm still reading, I already know the hero is hot, please don't feel the need to remind me at this ..."
Lol!
It's nice to find so many like minded people!!! I was starting to think I was the odd one!!!
I love Annette wrote #9. Stop eating each other, if you're hungry get take out!"-Makes me crazy when they describe how someone tastes. It's just weird. Feb 05, 2014 12:37PM
I put a book down recently because they were devouring each others mouths. Get real!
Great discussion. Movie kisses...North and South is great, although at the very end it's a little awkward with the train and they are just kissing as it rolls along. The lists...I like anticipating the first kiss. Glancing at the mouth seems natural to me. (You've got to aim!) Touching before the kiss is sweet - chin, cheek, etc. As far as #8, of course I don't want my heroine to be wanton, but it is fun to see an awakening if she's innocent.
Great lists, DeeDee. Thanks for giving us something to think over. :)
The ultimate scripture on kissing is in Song of Songs. It says, "Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth." Kissing should be a spiritual connection, not just physical.
*The kiss* is one of the highlights of a romance book, it's the moment your hero and heroine finally show how in to each other they are. It's a BIG DEAL! The reader has probably waited 200 odd pages for this moment.
Now when I'm writing 'the kiss' I have to constantly fight the desire to simply state: 'they kissed' and move swiftly on.
When I'm reading, I feel cheated if I don't get a bit more info than that! On the other hand, I don't really find an explanation of the mechanics of the thing very 'romantic'. In fact a lot of kiss scenes leave me gagging!
So I got to thinking: what IS it that I like to read?
After a bit of thought I came up with a list of what I like:
1. I want to know how this moment makes them feel closer, not just physically but emotionally as well.
2. I want to see their relationship change. The kiss showed the truth about how they felt for each other, lets not kill the moment with a: it was *just* a kiss, remark.
3. I like anticipation before my kiss, please don't hand it to me in the first few chapters. I like to work for my dose of kissy kissy; if I've had to wait, I'm more invested when it finally happens!
4. Sweet gestures!!! The hero gets bonus points for gently caressing the heroines cheek!
5. Build up! Not just throughout the book, but also in this moment. Holding hands, hugging, reassuring each other about something that has happened, it doesn't really matter. Just get me to question whether this will be 'The' moment.
6. When the heroine is embarrassed and the hero helps her to get over her nerves.
7. Non aggressive touchy feely. (Not to be confused with grabbing at bits and bobs!) This is 'the kiss', you're supposed to be proving that your love is pure! ;-P
And what I don't:
1. If I'm still reading, I already know the hero is hot, please don't feel the need to remind me at this delicate moment, it just makes the heroine look like a shallow bimbo.
2. Please, please, please don't mention tongues: It's as much of a mood killer as mentioning spit!!!
3. Please don't throw this beautiful moment of trust in to the middle of an argument! I've waited forever for this, I want it to mean something! 'The kiss' is a gesture of affection, not an underhand way to win an argument!
4. If the hero is kissing her, yet there are unresolved issues about whether or not they are free to do so. (i.e. do they have a not quite ex?)
5. No fighting! Either the hero is a rapist, or the kiss is by mutual consent.
6. Endless staring at each others mouths... this just gets creepy after a while.
7. Kissing a random person to make the hero/heroine jealous. Congratulations: your hero/heroine is a douchebag!
8. Do NOT tell me how innocent the heroine is and then turn her into a harlot. I do not buy it!
9. Stop eating each other, if you're hungry get take out!
So, now it's your turn! What do you like? What don't you like? I really want to know.
DeeDee. xxx