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Small Angry Planet Discussion
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Day 121, Heresy - End of Book & Final Thoughts [#4]
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So, we're finally getting close enough to the end of the month I don't feel quite so bad posting this, because spoilers and the like. BUT.I ADORED THIS BOOK. For all the following reasons:
1.) I have rarely come across a book that is so diverse, in so many different aspects, without feeling the least bit forced in any capacity. Chambers has an amazing capacity of imagination, and has so clearly thought out these different alien races and communities that they almost literally jump off the pages at you. And she's able to highlight all of their differences without information dumps or monologues, which isn't always the case.
2.) For a book in which nothing happens until the last 50 pages or so, it still manages to feel so adventerous and epic on a plot scale. I think Chambers gets this done through small hints and side remarks by her characters that gives you the feeling that so much is happening OFF the page that it's kind of bleeding over into the plot itself (we never see Jenks and Kizzy partying, but it's made references to enough that we almost feel like we do see it). It's definitely an internal story more than an internal one, but it at no point feels slow or bogged down, as many character-focused novels can tend to do.
3.) ALL THE LOVE. This book gave me more characters to ship (both canon and non) that I have a feeling I'll be referencing it any time someone brings up the topic of character shipping or relationship development in a work of fiction. I mean, Lovey is a computer for God's sake and her relationship with Jenks is more real-feeling than the last dozen I've run across in fiction.
I could go on, but I won't. It's someone else's turn to gush.
tl; dr: I JUST LOVE THIS BOOK SO MUCH *muppet arms*
Agree with Chelsea about all of those points. One thing that stood out to me though was the violation of the rights of the pilot. Part of his cultural identity means that he would experience a premature death. That was taken away from him because of the decisions of another person. While it may have been done to provoke a conversations I'm a little offended that the crew was okay with this violation while the rest of the book supports the unique traits and beliefs of all the other characters. It's an interesting concept to think about and it's the part of the book that has stuck with me the most.
Brock wrote: "Agree with Chelsea about all of those points. One thing that stood out to me though was the violation of the rights of the pilot. Part of his cultural identity means that he would experience a prem..."I can definitely see that being an issue. I spent a good deal of time thinking about this scene, actually, and how I felt about it on the whole. And while it's still the most uncomfortable part of the book for me, instead I liken it to taking the razor blade from someone on the edge of committing suicide. While on the one hand, individual agency is supremely important, it's also completely understandable, to me, that considering whether or not that person is in their 'right mind' to make that decision. There are definitely no clear answers, but in the end I appreciated that Ohan was still around at the end of the book.
I really enjoyed this book very much, I especially loved seeing all the different cultures and alien races the crew encountered and how the crew were a team and their interactions never seemed forced. however, like the Ketty Jay series by Chris Wooding I feel this book could have benefited from a killing off one or two others of the main characters as after everything that happened especially when going through the worm hole I would think the crew wouldn't get off as easily as they did (no offence to Lovey). It just didn't seem believable to me.
I am conflicted with regards to Ohan as on one had I see Brock's point and agree that people should respect the beliefs of others even if they're contrary to their own, but I can also see Chelsea's point as if a friend could be easily spared from a terrible fate I would save him too.
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This book for me was so much like Chelsea in that I just ended up fully adoring the whole concept, characters and everything. I loved seeing the moment between (view spoiler) as they were some of the most wonderful characters and that relationship was something I hoped for and didn't think Chambers would ACTUALLY DO, but THEN SHE DID :)
I also loved seeing (view spoiler) as Chelsea said because again I didn't believe Chambers would actually go for it and yet she did and she made it so fascinating as a concept, (view spoiler)
I also have to say that all the different races just were SO exciting to uncover. I loved seeing each of the backstories for our characters and I have to say that by the end of the book even Corbin (who I didn't initially like) was great. I just think she did a flawless job of the backstory explanations and the way that she developed them as characters and fully believable races too!
In terms of the choice of (view spoiler) I was certainly thinking about it in the same way as Chelsea. I think that the idea is to think about how conscious Ohan really is and whether he's been totally indoctrinated into the ideas of his race and he can't see clearly, or whether it's not that and he's actually being (view spoiler). What I did like about that scene, uncomfortable as it was, is that it does make you wonder and think about what if there was someone you knew well considering doing something very detrimental to their own health and well-being and you knew how to stop it, would you? Would you respect their decision? Would you help them even if they didn't want help as you believed it would be better for them in the long run? All such a fascinating and scary discussion topic and I think in the moment I would probably have done the same as the characters... but it's a tough one for sure!!
I'm so glad that more people have taken the time to read and enjoy this book though, and I am very, very excited for the Companion Novel she's currently writing up :D I'll certainly have it on preorder!! :D
I just hope the entire book is about (view spoiler) going off and being just the best things in the entire universe together. Or about Dr. Chef. Who I always pictured looking a bit like a much wiser Zoidberg a la Futureama.
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Oh Chelsea, I gosh-darn hope so :P
Romantic relationships in books don't do a whole lot for me so the relationship between Rosemary and Sissix was just sort of there. Of course it's like that in every other book I read with couples. It's not something I really react to. Had a huge appreciation Rosemary and Sissix trying to accommodate the physical norms and customs of their individual races. Different levels of intimacy you know? Lovey was the real emotional heart-breaker in this book. Yeah that was crazy. I wanted her to be fully restored.
From my own viewpoint Ohan should have been given the cure. The possibility of health and longer life are desirable.
If Ohan was at risk of an addictive drug overdose, or harm to others I wouldn't hesitate to act. However, as it pertains to Ohan...
The symbiotic/parasitic nature of his species has greatly influenced their culture. It's not just a societal construct, it's part of their biological fabric. So much care in this book was given to explaining family types, biology types, and the cultures that emerged for each species. Respect was shown for each of those identities, which is why that one act unsettles me so much. There was a great respect for every single belief, except Ohan's.
Is Ohan the same person? Would his indoctrinated beliefs still have a hold after the treatment? I'd expect mentally that would stay with him for a while, even though his health would improve. He may have lived with this mindset his entire life so to rapidly change it through the decision of another gets my gears turning. How would the crew be if Ohan's reaction was "Why did you do that to me? That's what made me, me." It would be like administering a blood transfusion to a Jehovah's Witness or forcing an individual into homosexual deprogramming. Would I give someone a blood transfusion if it was against their wishes?
I think sovereignty of the mind and individual will are vital concepts. Other life forms may not agree with Ohan's mindset but I'd argue that he has the right to his body as well as the right to be wrong.
Brock wrote: "Romantic relationships in books don't do a whole lot for me so the relationship between Rosemary and Sissix was just sort of there. Of course it's like that in every other book I read with couples...."Very, very strongly made points, Brock. I think it's an interesting exercise in removing personal prejudices (we would both want Ohan to survive) and looking at the text as a message-carrier on a larger scale. I think the reason that it didn't bother me is because it was Corbin who did it. Corbin who, both before and after (view spoiler) shows very little respect for the biological/lifestyle choices of others. We see him belittling Sissix for being Aandrisk, we see him disregard Rosemary because she's young and a woman...so, to me, it's completely keeping in his character to do something like this because it is, to him, the "logical" thing to do. As for why the crew isn't more upset, I guess we'll never know (authorial intention is a slippery bugger) but I'd like to think it's BECAUSE Ohan doesn't seem all that upset after the fact, or perhaps that they're just too busy being glad he's still alive. If I remember correctly, Ashby has quite the freak-out at Corbin, but it happens off screen, so who knows.
I guess for me, I see his "virus" as something that innately clouds their judgement and takes away some of that agency. I would never force someone into "degayification", but for me it's more like Ohan has already gone through "degayification" and now the crew is trying to talk him back to his original state of being, which he can't see objectively because of his neurology and biology. It's not a great metaphor, so forgive me, but it's the best I think I've got at the moment!
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Oooh the discussion makes me happy! I can see where both Brock and Chelsea are coming from here and it's such a difficult question to answer (as I suppose there is no 'right' answer short of 'knowing' the people in the book). It's a tough call to say for certain that Ohan was totally in charge of his senses and thoughts and whether or not he had been 'brainwashed'. I think it's an open debate, and a very interesting one, that the author decided to introduce to the book. Very fascinating to consider, but also tinged with the question of is it 'right' and sadness over the betrayal...
Great thoughts though everyone!! :D
I'm liking this discussion too. What Chelsea has said about Corbin's motivations makes complete sense for his character. There is definitely authorial intention at work here. The book has a very clear focused message and I admire that it doesn't stray from it's main theme. It will be good to see where Becky Chambers goes in future novels. Curious to see what other stories she has to tell.
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