Sci-Fi Group Book Club discussion

This is the discussion thread for the second book of the month, or group read, for November. Please remember to use the spoiler tags where necessary.

The other group read topics for this month (Philip K. Dick's Electric Dreams: Volume 1 and Stranger in a Strange Land) can be found here and here.

Have you decided if it will be the whole book or selected stories?

Jim wrote: "Have you decided if it will be the whole book or selected stories?"

I wonder if it would be easiest to let people make their own choices and discuss those that other members have also read. That said, if somebody would like to be the discussion leader, perhaps that person could pick a selection and if people have time to read other stories beyond that then by all means do so! What would you prefer yourself, Jim?

I guess I deserve to be put on the spot like that !!! I have to think about it.

Took a quick look and here's what I've got so far. It may be obvious from other posts I've made that I like to read an author's work in chronological order if possible. From what I can tell this collection seems to be in chronological order or close to it. So I looked at the stuff written in the 30's and 40's and came up with these:

Travel By Wire - 1937 - his first story.
Rescue Party - 1946 - Early use of generation starship idea
History Lesson - 1949 - post apocalyptic story with interesting
ending
Transience - 1949 - looked interesting and I never heard of it
before (good reason huh?)

I'll try to look at the 50's and beyond and make some recommendations.

Jim wrote: "I guess I deserve to be put on the spot like that !!! I have to think about it."

LOL I wasn't trying to do that. Sorry. I was just giving you a chance to give your opinion.

Jim wrote: "Took a quick look and here's what I've got so far. It may be obvious from other posts I've made that I like to read an author's work in chronological order if possible. From what I can tell this co..."

It seems reasonable to start with those, Jim. Others might have different preferences but that's OK IMO.

I think Jim's suggestions are great. I'd vote to add these to the list as well:

The Sentinal (basis for 2001: A Space Odyssey)
Second Dawn
The Nine Billion Names of God
The Star
The Songs of Distant Earth (like The Sentinal was later expanded into a novel which, according to wikipedia, was Clarke's personal favorite).

I am happy to take the lead discussing these stories, if that would be helpful.

Yes I think it is best to make a selection of stories for those who are not going to read all of them.

Travel by Wire! I loved how brutal and immoral it was. Especially the part about the first man they send through. Surprisingly good for a first story! And the end is quite clever too. The story is very much the creation of a young man. Full of irreverence and youthful humor.

I did struggle with one aspect of the story. It looks like these are physical wires and that it is not possible to travel wireless. How were they going to travel to other planets with physical wires?

Retreat From Earth was an interesting story about the unknown powers of termites and how they allow humans to exist, since humans are mostly harmless.

David wrote: "I think Jim's suggestions are great. I'd vote to add these to the list as well:

The Sentinal (basis for 2001: A Space Odyssey)
Second Dawn
The Nine Billion Names of God
The Star
The Songs of Distant Earth (like The Sentinal was later expanded into a novel which, according to wikipedia, was Clarke's personal favorite).

I am happy to take the lead discussing these stories, if that would be helpful. "

Thanks for offering to be the discussion leader for this topic, David. :)

If I can't get my hands on The Collected Stories, I'll still be able to read a couple of the above-mentioned tales from Of Time And Stars - i.e., 'The Sentinel' and 'The Nine Billion Names of God'.

Rescue Party was really good, but there are two others just as good that are not on our lists. Technical Error (about a man who gets flipped physically) and The Fires Within (about investigations into the center of the earth (with a wonderful twist).

Thorkell wrote: "Rescue Party was really good, but there are two others just as good that are not on our lists. Technical Error (about a man who gets flipped physically) and The Fires Within (about investigations i..."

Happily, The Fires Within is also collected in Of Time And Stars.

Greg wrote: "David wrote: "Thanks for offering to be the discussion leader for this topic, David. :)"

Thanks, Greg. I will defer to Thorkell on who leads the discussion, as this was his selection. I am happy to help if that's ok with him.

For those without the book, all of the stories we've chosen are available as audiobooks on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_0Vs...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmkkv...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aovi...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veT6p...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tb1Y7...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2Gar...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ci3l...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO1tC...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9zHE...

David wrote: "Greg wrote: "David wrote: "Thanks for offering to be the discussion leader for this topic, David. :)"

Thanks, Greg. I will defer to Thorkell on who leads the discussion, as this was his selection...."

Thorkell's leading another discussion so it would be cool if you led this one, though there's no harm on working together here too. And thanks for those Youtube links!

David wrote: "I will defer to Thorkell on who leads the discussion, as this was his selection. I am happy to help if that's ok with him."

I'm fine with you leading the discussions here David!

Thorkell wrote: "David wrote: "I will defer to Thorkell on who leads the discussion, as this was his selection. I am happy to help if that's ok with him."

I'm fine with you leading the discussions here David!"

OK, great. Thanks, Thorkell. I should be finished with the stories we've chosen so far by tomorrow and will post my impressions then.

BTW, I hope others suggest stories as well, as we've only picked 9 out of 116 from this fantastic collection.

Because of my need (obsession?) with chronology I have listed the 9 stories selected so far with their original publish dates. The reason i like to bdo this is for 2 reasons. One, if you read an author's work chronologically you get to see their development over the years as an author. Second, knowing the data a story was published gives you insight into the current events at the time the story was written and the state of science and technology then.

Looks like David took the time to pick some good stuff from the 50's so does anybody want to take a crack at the 60's ?

Travel By Wire - 1937
Rescue Party - 1946
History Lesson - 1949
Transience - 1949
The Sentinel - 1951
Second Dawn - 1951
The Nine Billion Names of God - 1953
The Star - 1955
The Songs of Distant Earth - 1958

I haven't been able to start reading these stories yet because I am finishing up a classic crime/mystery story (my other favorite genre) from 1940 by Craig Rice. But I'm almost there and I am a fast reader and being retired I can spend a lot of time doing it.

Thorkell wrote: "Travel by Wire! I loved how brutal and immoral it was. Especially the part about the first man they send through. Surprisingly good for a first story! And the end is quite clever too. The story is ..."
I think this story was a little tongue-in-cheek based on the cavalier attitude about sending people through the transmitter without them knowing. Apparently they could transmit people by cable or radio but considered cable safer. "Before long we had services to all the big cities of Europe, by cable that is, not radio. A wired system was safer, though it was dreadfully difficult to lay polyaxial cables,". I believe Clarke was only 20 when he wrote this.

I plan on posting the titles of the stories that speak to me (as I have done above). Maybe that will help once i get into the 60s.

The Wall of Darkness was brilliant and should be on our to read list. Really original stuff and well written too!

Breaking Strain is another brilliant story. It was adapted into a movie in 1994 under the title Trapped in Space and was partly used in 2001.

After finishing the first volume, here are my favorites:

The best ones:
Rescue Party
Technical Error
The Fires Within
The Wall of Darkness
Breaking Strain

Also good:
Travel by Wire!
Retreat From Earth
History Lesson

I've finished the four stories that Jim suggested. I enjoyed all of them and will post my impressions of each a little later on once others have had a chance to read them.

My personal ranking of these stories would be:

1. Rescue Party
2. Travel by Wire
3. Transcience
4. History Lesson

I do have a question about the Youtube audio of Travel by Wire, link above. For those who have listened to it, does anyone recognize who the narrator is? I could swear that it is British actor Michael York (who I recently listened to narrate Brave New World), but cannot find out definitively. I thought the narration was perfect for this story. As an aside, I would highly recommend York's reading of Brave New World.

Greg wrote: "Jim wrote: "I guess I deserve to be put on the spot like that !!! I have to think about it."

LOL I wasn't trying to do that. Sorry. I was just giving you a chance to give your opinion."

I wasn't serious, just kidding.

Thorkell wrote: "Retreat From Earth was an interesting story about the unknown powers of termites and how they allow humans to exist, since humans are mostly harmless."

I didn't enjoy "Retreat From Earth" that much. I thought the writing style was a little jumbled and confusing. But it was only his 3rd story and he was only 21. It was much different from the tongue in cheek style of the first 2 stories.

I've finished the nine stories we originally selected from this omnibus volume. I'll be moving on to the one's that Thorkell enjoyed next.

Of the nine, the only one that disappointed me was Spoiler Alert: (view spoiler)[Songs of Distant Earth. I thought it started out well, was very interesting and well written, but then devolved into a conventional broken-heart romance. I think it would have been much better to pursue the plot-line of what happens when humans from one time meet another group of humans from a time several hundred years distant. Just my opinion. (hide spoiler)]

Otherwise, I think these stories have been great.

The Sentinel was really interesting. Having read 2001 and seen the film many times, I thought it was interesting that the reader is left with little mystery in the end of the short story. Not that I'm complaining. The ending of the short story is really good. The main difference is that the "monolith" is not what drives the story but rather those who placed it there. The whole function of the monolith is much more complex in the book and way more so in the film. Still a beautifully crafted story. I understand why Kubrick wanted to base his film on it.

Time's Arrow is not on our reading list but it is well worth your time. It has a wonderful plot. Some might see it coming. I'm not one of those this time around. I was so engaged in story that I totally forgot to try to guess where this was going.

Thanks, Thorkell. I will add Time's Arrow to the list of stories I'll be reading, probably will start reading them tomorrow.

Thorkell wrote: "The Sentinel was really interesting. Having read 2001 and seen the film many times, I thought it was interesting that the reader is left with little mystery in the end of the short story. Not that ..."
I re-read Arthur C. Clarke's "The Sentinel" back in October after many, many years and was surprised just how different it was from the "2001: A Space Odyssey" movie, which was itself, an important milestone in SF movie making.

I had gotten the story and movie versions intermingled over the years. The original 1951 short story was a well written, straight forward story about discovering signs of the existence of aliens but not the aliens themselves. In 1951 I would have given it 5 stars for it's sense of wonder resulting from being just making our first early steps into space and the realization that there alien civilizations out there in the vast universe.

Of course it's 67 years later and the story has been told many more times with many different variations but I would still give it 4 stars. Readers who are familiar with the film may be disappointed with no trip to Jupiter, no HAL 9000 and no psychedelic ending.

All the Time in the World was really good.

I also reread The Nine Billion Names of God which is brilliant.

Second Dawn did however little for me.

Second Dawn didn't do too much for me either, I thought it was better than Songs of Distant Earth, though

I did listen to Time's Arrow last night, and thought it was quite good.

I agree with you on the Nine Billion Names of God -- I think the plot is brilliant and the writing is superb.

Thorkell wrote: "Rescue Party was really good, but there are two others just as good that are not on our lists. Technical Error (about a man who gets flipped physically) and The Fires Within (about investigations i..."

I enjoyed "Rescue Party" with it's interesting look at the different ways that alien species deal with a life threatening situation. the plight of humans and their resolution seems secondary to the plot until the very end when human ingenuity is contrasted against the aliens more advance technology.

I wasn't very impressed by "Technical Error" which involved too much nuts & bolts discussion over what happened to Richard Nelson resulting in little excitement even at the, for me, anti-climatic ending

Greg wrote: "Thorkell wrote: "Rescue Party was really good, but there are two others just as good that are not on our lists. Technical Error (about a man who gets flipped physically) and The Fires Within (about..."

Just finished "The Fires Within" and it was very good with a very interesting switch of viewpoint.

Jim wrote: "Greg wrote: "Just finished "The Fires Within" and it was very good a very interesting switch of viewpoint."

It took me totally by surprise. I was like, wait, what... :)

Glad you liked it.

I have just finished "The Fires Within". Great twist ending!

Jim wrote: "Greg wrote: "Thorkell wrote: "Rescue Party was really good, but there are two others just as good that are not on our lists. Technical Error (about a man who gets flipped physically) and The Fires ..."

David wrote: "I have just finished "The Fires Within". Great twist ending!"

That's good to hear! I'll get to it soon!

'It's hard nowadays to find an honest man who stays bought.'

Nice sentence!

I Remember Babylon was really interesting. It's not a story. I would love to talk about it, especially in relation to the internet and how it is being used by Russia to attack democracy.

Sounds good, thanks, Thorkell! I will add that to my list to read from this volume. How do you mean it is not a story? According to the Wikipedia article, it is "a science fiction short story....that takes the form of a non-fiction article." Do you mean that it is speculative fiction that has mostly come true (according to Clarke's introduction to the text)?

Clarke is the main person in the story so I assumed it was based on something that happened to him. So yes a story in that sense but more of a memory than a fiction.

I wonder if Elon Musk read Saturn Rising. :)

The Songs of Distant Earth was a hauntingly beautiful love story. In the later stories Clarke is more interested in normal stories in unusual settings. They don't always work but here it really pays off. And unlike many of the other stuff Clarke has written he actually manages to create characters here.

I agree as a love story, The Songs of Distant Earth was pretty good. My problem is that I just generally don't like love stories, plus I think there were a lot of possibilities on the science fiction side that could have been explored which would have made the story more interesting. I do agree that Clarke creates good characters here, which wasn't always the case.

I've started reading the stories from the 60s. Already found three fine ones:

"Death and the Senator" (1961)
"Before Eden" (1961)
"Hate" (1961)

There is a strong melancholy in both of the stories and Death and the Senator has the strongest character in a short story by Clarke so far. Hate has also a well created character. I guess this is the time when Clarke realized that a story is more than a plot.

Maelstrom II (1962) is really good. It is inspired by Poe's "A Descent Into the Maelstorm" hence the II in the name. I wonder if David Bowie's Space Oddity was inspired by this story. A part of the story is about an astronaut calling his his wife and saying goodbye to her because he is going to die. In the Bowie song we have the following text:

Though I'm past one hundred thousand miles
I'm feeling very still
And I think my spaceship knows which way to go
Tell my wife I love her very much she knows
Ground Control to Major Tom
Your circuit's dead, there's something wrong
Can you hear me, Major Tom?
Can you hear me, Major Tom?
Can you hear me, Major Tom?
Can you "Here am I floating 'round my tin can
Far above the moon
Planet Earth is blue
And there's nothing I can do"

I finished Breaking Strain last night. Good story, a little predictable at the end, although it was neat to see where the design ideas for Discovery One came from.

Moving on to Time's Arrow next...