Reading the Chunksters discussion

This thread was created to support the ongoing discussion in the nomination thread about the most challenging book of the twentieth century.

It also naturally turned into the campaigning thread where people started discussing the books they wanted to read and what to do if your nomination or the book you like would not win.

Reading time and audio-books vs. e-books vs. tree-books were also discussed.

So this is the thread to discuss these questions without flooding the nomination post.

BTW, someone was accused of being spanked :-)

As Kristi justly noticed, we are not that kind of the group, but as my husband said, it might be masochistic to read big books and enjoy them, but to be fair, he is also one of our bunch, but due to his working schedule, he uses only audio-books for fiction reading, and he does not blog about books, neither is he a member of goodreads, to the best of my knowledge :-)

So keep the good banter going with the ideas about this themed read, what makes a book challenging, what is a classical novel, what to read and how to read big books.

You might also find buddy friends for your future read if your nomination does not win the poll.

I might be game for some of your buddy read ideas.

I WANT A BUDDY READ FOR DAHLGREN IF IT DOESN'T WIN!!!!!!!!

;)

I hear you loud and clear. because it was my nomination, I will gladly participate in the buddy read.

You can also use this thread to campaign/encourage people to vote for the book you like.

I obviously can not because I am a mod, but I think it is kosher to be committed and to publicly announce my commitment.

Yay! Book banter thread!! Thanks, Zulfiya. No more hogging the nomination threads. :)

I'm completely torn on what to vote for. I nominated Doctor Zhivago and I fully intended to vote for it, but now... I'm wavering. I really want to read Doctor Zhivago, too. There are just some really amazing nominations.

If Infinite Jest wins, and we start a buddy read for Dhalgren, in addition to the current Dune series read, that means there will be THREE active reads that are all on the top of my "want to read" list. I feel that I am perfectly justified in saying...ahem...WAAAHHHHHHHHHH!

;)

I guess I may have a tough decision to make. In any case, once all of those are over, I fully intend to start a campaign for an Anathem buddy read.

And our realtor is closing the case on our new house, and we will be moving out and in. Luckily, we are not selling our current one right now. I would have never managed any reading hours at all with one buying and one selling ... I am already cheating and reading some of my books as audio, but for chunksters, I prefer paper to sound. It is easier to digest, and you can get more out of it.

Yep, this is what is called - Dilemma, and yes, I want to read IJ so much, but I also want Dhalgren, but all the other choices are also EXCELLENT.

Don't you think cloning could be a good idea, but I really do not want the prescience of the twins from The Dune series when it comes to reading :-)

I'm in for Anathem whenever you start campaigning, John. I've wanted to read that for a couple of years now.

As for having time to read, I always think of Twilight. You live forever and don't have to sleep, think of how much reading you could get done! The only downside is being sparkly and eating baby ducklings.

Sarah wrote: "I'm in for Anathem whenever you start campaigning, John. I've wanted to read that for a couple of years now.

As for having time to read, I always think of Twilight. You live forever and don't ha..."

LOVED Anathem...I would be excited to read it again with you guys!!

John wrote: "If Infinite Jest wins, and we start a buddy read for Dhalgren, in addition to the current Dune series read, that means there will be THREE active reads that are all on the top of my "want to read" list ..."

You can do it, John! Just make them all "currently reading" instead of "want to read". It's that simple. :)

Back in the spring, I was simultaneously all from this Chunkster group Les Miserable, The Once and Future King, and The Windup Bird Chronicle. Although after that, I had to make a real effort to choose some reads with other groups beside just the Chunksters. :)

Sarah wrote: "As for having time to read, I always think of Twilight. You live forever and don't have to sleep, think of how much reading you could get done! The only downside is being sparkly and eating baby ducklings."

Totally! I wish I didn't have to sleep. But alas, it is a must, plus I love sleeping so much. Reading, sleeping, waking up to grab for my book and pick up where I left off....

I think I want to read The Name of the Rose the most as far as main group reads go. There's bound to be some really amazing stuff in that one.

Moving this reply over from the Nominations thread:

Kristi wrote: "Everyman wrote: "I consider myself spanked."

um...we're not that kind of group..."


Rats.

[vbg!]

Sure! [vbg!]

Sarah- I'd love to read The Name of the Rose, also! It's been been a to-read for way too long!

The book is wonderful, and very, very literary with codes, intertextuality, allusions, Borgesian, and simply superb, but there are people who do not like it. Beauty of this book is in the eye of a beholder.

I've never heard of Anathem before, but I've had Dhalgren recommended to me on another site. I'd prefer to read it in a buddy read, and read The Name of the Rose separately, at my own fast pace.

Hmm...I guess I would be up for giving Dhalgren a try, and possibly The Name of the Rose, although I am not too excited about that one at the moment. It may be a timing thing. I kind of feel I want to read a book that takes place in more modern times, having just read a cluster of classic reads. And of course I'm still rooting for Infinite Jest to win.

Correct me if I'm wrong moderators, but haven't we read The Name of the Rose as a side read a while back? If so, can we nominate past side reads as main choices at later date?

Andrea, you are right, we read it in February 2013, but it was a small side-read more that 18 months ago, and we witnessed a number of new members since than.

If it wins, it means that many people want to read it, and if does not, so be it, and people can read it as a buddy read. As far as I remember, there were only two who finished it last time as a side read, and people did not comment much. Even for me, it was a re-read then.

Once there was a precedent of the similar repeated nomination, and I was not a mod then, and it was accepted because of the same reason - the book was The Crimson Petal and the White, but it did not win the poll.

The reason was the same - time span and the different status of the read.

I think we will be O'K nominating previous reads if there is a steady interest and if they are not main reads, and it happened some time ago.

Unfortunately, our group goes through the phase thing when active members come and disappear, and new there are few active readers for years, like you. I want to keep the pool of active members as long as possible, and that is why all the campaign about active participation is in full swing.

Thanks for the explanation Zulfiya! The logic behind it makes sense. It's actually good news, since it gives me a chance to read Anna Karenina with the group one day. :)

I wanted to go back and check all the nominations so far, so in case this is of help to anyone else, here is the list of current nominations for easy reference. Hopefully I did not miss any.

Mason and Dixon
Ulysses
Infinite Jest
Doctor Zhivago
The Name of the Rose
An American Tragedy
Atlas Shrugged
Dhalgren
The Golden Notebook

Thanks Linda! That should probably go in the actual nomination thread, though. I think this thread was just created to get rid of the rabble-rousers who were going off-topic :)

John wrote: "Thanks Linda! That should probably go in the actual nomination thread, though. I think this thread was just created to get rid of the rabble-rousers who were going off-topic :)"

Oh yeah, I will post it there too. But I thought this thread was also for discussing and campaigning for which book you nominated and why? I thought the actual nomination thread was just to state your nomination. Maybe I misunderstood.

Thank you Linda, that must have been quite a task! Doctor Zhivago should also be in there.

Sarah wrote: "Thank you Linda, that must have been quite a task! Doctor Zhivago should also be in there."

Sorry for the omission, Sarah! I've edited my post and added it in the proper order it was nominated.

There are quite a few of these I want to read.

Yes, me too. Besides Infinite Jest, the ones that stand out to me are Mason and Dixon, Doctor Zhivago, and An American Tragedy. There are a couple others I might give a try if they win the poll.

I'm actually not crazy about the idea of Infinite Jest. But I like the others you mentioned, along with Dhalgren and The Name of the Rose.

I thin Atlas Shrugged is an interesting read for right now. I've read Follet's Pillars of the Earth series and thought that the plot of BOTH books was, well, basically "The Fountainhead", but with a different setting. I wonder what "Fall of Giants" will be like, and how similar it might be to "Atlas Shrugged" (also, VERY similar to Fountainhead, anyways). If "Fall of Giants" is set up like the "Pillars of the Earth" book, it might actually be interesting to read side-by-side with "Atlas Shrugged".

That's a very good point Kaycie.

I haven't made a final decision on how I'm going to vote, but (as the topic implies)I'm hoping for a book that is truly challenging to read (I understand the word is subjective). Something that someone might very well give up on without a good moderator (which we are lucky enough to have) and a structured, participative group. Except for Mason and Dixon, I've read all of them and, while some of them I found hugely enjoyable and engrossing, they don't require as much effort and sheer perseverance as some of the others.

Pynchon, Joyce, DFW, Delany - that's really hard stuff. There are tons of layers and sheer "stuff" going on underneath the surface (linguistically, symbolically, thematically, structurally, or all of the above)as well as intricate plots and characters. And just by talking about plot and characters, those things are going to pop up because of the genius of the authors. All that stuff is like little video game "Easter Eggs" sprinkled throughout and they will surface as soon as you touch on them just a tiny bit. It can be hard and sometimes maddening, but so cool!

It's kind of like the difference between walking 10 miles on a flat surface as opposed to 10 miles uphill. It's a long way (10 miles is a chunkster of a walk and something to be respected), but one is easier than the other. Ten miles uphill might require someone to pull you, sweating and screaming, along and encourage you to stick with it. Whereas, 10 miles on a flat surface might only require a good walking stick, some firm resolve or, if you are social, a buddy or two to chat with.

I think this is what made it difficult to discuss Outlander. Now, I didn't care for that book, but even if I did, I don't know what we would have talked about week after week. If you loved it, it was because it was fun and entertaining. Very escapist. A great beach read. But when all is said and done, other than everyone recapping the plot, what is left to talk about? And I think, even for people who loved it, no one could think of anything to say that wasn't just a synopsis of those X number of chapters. I think that's really why the conversation kind of petered out.

Please, this is all just my opinion. Just me lobbying :).

I'm not (yet) lobbying for a particular book - more for a particular "kind" of book. But if we're going to read something called one of the most challenging books of the 20th Century, I hope it is a book that fits the title.

I'm going to go run for cover now :).

Paula wrote: "I'm not (yet) lobbying for a particular book - more for a particular "kind" of book. But if we're going to read something called one of the most challenging books of the 20th Century, I hope it is a book that fits the title."

Great points, Paula! I am also hoping for the same type of book. As not having reading any of the nominations, I don't know how difficult or not any of them are (except probably Ulysses since I see that mentioned over and over again). I mentioned which books looked interesting to me only as pertaining to the plot, but I hope that anyone who has read some of the nominations can chime in as to if they think the nomination is suitable for this theme.

Linda wrote: "Great points, Paula! I am also hoping for the same type of book."

Thanks Linda! Just so everyone knows, I started and stopped reading IJ 4 times before I finally got over that initial hump - and it's all because I joined a group that was discussing it and that gave me the encouragement to keep going. The group petered out, we all got tangled and confused in the threads because all of the reading schedule threads were loaded at the same time. And then I just couldn't stop reading (ahead). I stayed up nights because I couldn't put that thing down. But again, I think I started and stopped it over a 6-year period. It wasn't an easy book by any means. But I'm SO glad I finally gave it one more try because, seriously, it is one of the best books I have ever read.

Which again, is totally subjective.

Great points, Paula!

John wrote: "Great points, Paula!"

Thanks John!

Ya, Paula, I completely agree with you, and that's definitely the type of book I plan on voting for. That's what I'm hoping to get out of most of the book discussions on this group!

Kaycie wrote: "Ya, Paula, I completely agree with you, and that's definitely the type of book I plan on voting for. That's what I'm hoping to get out of most of the book discussions on this group!"

It's an exciting lineup!

In the face of so many fearless readers undaunted by the task - which is in fact their pastime - of reading one hell of a difficult book, I feel humble. I have never undertook the challenge of reading one of them.

I didn't feel the urge because of the great choices among very easy books that clamored for my attention. E.g brand new releases by my favorite authors, or the next 14 or so books belonging to the same series that I was dying to read, since the first book was such a hit with me. This is different. I am quite nervous. If reading a cozy mystery was like a 10 mile hike, then reading such a difficult book such as one of the nominated sounds like a hard workout with no reprieve at the gym. It's mentally draining.

My greatest fear is not to be bored, but to be the only participant to give the book 1 or 2 stars. I joined this group to benefit from the leading questions of the mods, not isolate and ostracize myself. I wanted to be in the company of people from whom I can learn. But not reading this category is not an option (unless I can't get the book). Contrary to the past, I now feel the need to experiment. Even if the book I vote for doesn't win, I will sweat this out. But I'm still relieved that a Tolstoy or Murakami book is not in the running. I see this as a sign of encouragement.

Luffy wrote: "In the face of so many fearless readers undaunted by the task - which is in fact their pastime - of reading one hell of a difficult book, I feel humble. I have never undertook the challenge of read..."

I love cozy mysteries! :) and there are so many mystery authors I adore. I love JD Robb, Louise Penny, Agatha Christie, Rex Stout and lots of others. I read them over and over. Although I know people who go from one difficult book to the next and to the next, I can't do it. I find that tiring. I dont know how they have the desire, much less the energy. There are many reasons I read. To be challenged is certainly one of them but reading for sheer escapism is just as important to me.

I know what you mean about giving low ratings to books everyone else seems to love. At first, I used to feel that it meant there was something wrong with my abilities as a reader, but I've gotten past that. Not everyone likes or values the same thing. Sometimes it is just not the right time to read a particular book, which is ok because there are so many books to turn to. I became a member of this group over the summer and this is the first time I think we will have a book that I want to do a group read. I don't worry anymore that I disliked Outlander, Fall of Giants, Wuthering Heights and Jane Eyre when I am obviously in the minority. Not everyone likes the same thing and that's ok.

You may very well come away from this read disliking the book that was chosen. So may I and so may a lot of other members, but hey, it's all good because there will be other books flowing through this group that hit your sweet spot, and mine :). Or, we may find that it isn't a book we enjoyed, but that we can admire very much. Anna Karenina falls into that category for me. Don Quixote is another. I deeply admire that book, but I can't honestly say I enjoyed reading it and I won't try it again.

There are a couple of books that have been nominated that I won't read again because I wasn't crazy about them the first time. If one of them is selected, I will wish everyone happy reading and sit this selection out.

The great thing about this group is the variety of books that are chosen and the wonderful moderators we have. It's a great group with awesome members!!

Paula wrote: "I don't worry anymore that I disliked Outlander, Fall of Giants, Wuthering Heights and Jane Eyre when I am obviously in the minority. Not everyone likes the same thing and that's ok.

You may very well come away from this read disliking the book that was chosen. So may I and so may a lot of other members, but hey, it's all good because there will be other books flowing through this group that hit your sweet spot, and mine :). Or, we may find that it isn't a book we enjoyed, but that we can admire very much. Anna Karenina falls into that category for me. Don Quixote is another. I deeply admire that book, but I can't honestly say I enjoyed reading it and I won't try it again. "

I didn't know that there was a reader in this group that has that amount in common with me. It's heartening. I wish you well. And you're right, we have great mods.

Luffy wrote: "In the face of so many fearless readers undaunted by the task - which is in fact their pastime - of reading one hell of a difficult book, I feel humble. I have never undertook the challenge of read..."

I haven't read any of these either. There are probably five I want to read, but chunksters take TIME. I also know what you mean about disliking a popular book. I think that's going to happen to me if Infinite Jest is chosen.

Can anyone who has read The Name of the Rose tell me how difficult it is? I was leaning toward that, but if it's something that I'll be able to read on my own I might switch to Atlas Shrugged. Kaycie made a good point about reading it in tandem with Pillars of the Earth.

Oh, and I passionately hated Wuthering Heights. :)

Sarah wrote: "Can anyone who has read The Name of the Rose tell me how difficult it is? …"

I'd like to know too. I tried reading it about four years ago and got so irritated with Eco's characterization of the monks, that I ditched it, which I almost never do with classics. I know I completely missed many of the allusions that Eco was trying to make so I'd like to give it another attempt at some point.

Sarah wrote: "Oh, and I passionately hated Wuthering Heights. :) ..."

Me, too! *** high five *** But I duck all the pelting tomatoes whenever I admit it. :-D

I didn't think Atlas Shrugged or The Name of the Rose were challenging reads, but it's very subjective. Probably Rose is more complex. Atlas, I found more interesting when I was a lot younger, but her heavy handed philosophical preachings bordered on the pedantic. When i was younger, it was easier to ignore and just focus on the plot, but as i got older, that wasn't possible for me. And there is that section where for 50 pages or so, she summarizes her philosophies once again just in case you were too stupid to get what she was saying all along (Barbara Kingsolver does the same thing and it irritates the life out of me). It gets tedious. She doesn't have a subtle bone in her body in this novel, so of all the nominated books, I think this is the easiest read from the standpoint of being able to understand it. It's very straightforward because the last thing Rand wants to have happen is for you to miss her points :). But it is a worthwhile book to read - it was very much a product of its time. It had quite a following and still does today, although certainly less so.

I forgot about The Golden Compass being nominated. It's interesting that Lessing once said that the more interpretations a reader can give to a novel the better it is. I think that kind of crystallizes what this next read will bring us, that is, the opportunity to bring so many thoughts and interpretations to the book. This is such a cool group and the discussions will be fun!'

I hate Wuthering Heights also, so there are a lot of us.

I may or may not take part in this read depending on what wins. I think I'm close to being done working 50+ hours a week, so I should have time. The only one I know for sure I wouldn't want to read is Atlas Shrugged. I made an attempt years ago before I knew anything about the book, but I found the author's poor writing and lack of ability to create 3-dimensional characters to be too irritating. Well, those factors plus the fact that I found her "philosophy" to be morally reprehensible and based on a total misunderstanding of human nature and the world.

Paula wrote: "I didn't think Atlas Shrugged or The Name of the Rose were challenging reads, but it's very subjective. Probably Rose is more complex. Atlas, I found more interesting when I was a lot younger, but ..."

I agree, Atlas Shrugged is NOT a challenging read other than its length (and I have no desire to re-read it). But, that being said, if "Fall of Giants" is anything like Follett's other novels, readers might get a new level of understanding about the book if they have read it. It might also be possible for an interested group to do a side-read of a shorter novel like the "Fountainhead" and still get the same thing from it.

Luffy wrote: "But I'm still relieved that a Tolstoy or Murakami book is not in the running. I see this as a sign of encouragement."

Along those same lines, I also don't find Tolstoy terribly difficult or intimidating. His books can be long and have tons of characters, but I usually find myself getting so into the stories that I don't notice the length and can easily keep track of everyone.

I'm much more nervous and intimidated by books that do crazy things with language, such as Joyce, in such a way that I don't understand what is going on. Those are books that would be so hard to read by myself because I'd have to keep stopping to look stuff up or check Sparknotes or something. With a good group discussion and the great moderators it seems like we have here, I am excited to try one of these much more challenging books!

For me, Faulkner and Joyce both are writers I need to avoid. Maybe Murakami and Tolstoy are easier, but at the moment I'm struggling with Persuasion! So in my case, many normally easier authors are tricky.

I think I'm going to resort to Eeny Meeny Miny Moe.

If you look at the first review on Main and Dixon, she quotes the first sentence of the book. It's complex and elegant and beautiful. Bit I have to wonder if I wouldn't get lost in some of his sentences. Still, it looks like it's worth reading.

I think things can also depend on the mood you are in at the time our how the authors writing meshes with you. And if you can't get into a book because it's not for you, you just can't get into a book! No amount easily understandable language will help with that! I definitely have those authors that I just can't read for some reason, so I definitely get that!

The comment about the authors writing meshing with you happened to me with Wind Up Bird Chronicle. I was looking something up on IMDB about Gerard Butler and at the bottom people were talking about what books he's reading. That book was one he had apparently commented on and all these people in the thread were saying they didn't think he was smart enough to read it. After I read the comments, my curiosity was killing me and I had to read it. I loved it and didn't think it had anything to do with intelligence. It just clicked with me. Some books are like that.