Children's Books discussion

Join us to discuss any or all of these laudable books from 1971:

Kneeknock Rise by Natalie Babbitt

Enchantress from the Stars by Sylvia Engdahl

Sing Down The Moon by Scott O'Dell

And the Winner, The Summer of the Swans by Betsy Byars

All four of these are available, as scanned copies, free to borrow to read online, at openlibrary.org.

I'm not too sure I'm excited to read the O'Dell, but all the others will be rereads for me, and I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy them. There's quite a variety; I'm sure you'll find something you like, too!

The Summer of the Swans

Set in small town West Virginia during the 1960s (and basically a tale of family, friendship and yes, not always being so quick to jump to wrong, to erroneous conclusions), I first encountered Betsy Byars' 1974 Newbery Award winning Summer of the Swans in German translation (probably in 1976 when I was ten years old, but it might in fact have been a year earlier, in 1975). And I do well remember that I absolutely loved Summer of the Swans as a child (or Als die Schwäne kamen as the novel is known in German), that I read the novel three times in a row the first time I encountered it, that I most definitely felt very emotionally close and connected to especially main protagonist Sara Godfrey, and although she at the age of fourteen was perhaps a bit too mature and teenager-like for a nine or ten year old like me, I did indeed find Als die Schwäne kamen absolutely relatable, approachable and both heartbreaking and also extremely loving and encouraging at the same time.

And yes most certainly, I do still as an older adult rereading so much love and appreciate the realism of Betsy Byars' family dynamics depictions, how in The Summer of the Swans, Sara's relationships and her dealings, her rapport with her aunt Willie (Wilhelmina), her older Sister Wanda and her physically and emotionally challenged younger brother Charlie are portrayed as realistic, as both positive and indeed sometimes strained and quite negative (and while everyone in the family, while Aunt Willie, Wanda and Sara obviously clearly and dearly love little Charlie, that sometimes, he is also more than a handful, that sometimes, one needs a lot of patience and self discipline to deal with him, to not become too annoyed at and frustrated with him, but that of course, all this becomes totally secondary when Charlie wanders off alone early one morning to look for the swans which Sara had shown him and that had obviously very lastingly enthralled him, and cannot be located, is lost somewhere in the deep woods).

Now like many teenagers, Sara at fourteen feels very much unsure of herself, often moody, unhappy and in particular not at all satisfied with regard to her physical appearance, with regard to her looks, especially because her older sister Wanda is considered by everyone as very beautiful and graceful, so much so that Sara actually often feels somewhat left behind, that she feels as though she will never catch up to Wanda, that she will always be a mousy and unimportant proverbial ugly duckling so to speak, and that first and foremost, her supposed (in Sara's mind) lack of physical grace, charm and beauty will also prevent her from ever being able to catch, let alone hold on to a steady boyfriend (thus naturellement, Sara also cannot and will not believe that her classmate Joe Melby has not been bullying and tormenting her little brother Charlie, until Charlie gets lost and Joe helps Sara find him and Sara finally realises her mistaken belief that Joe had been amongst the bullies harassing her little brother, that he actually might be friend or perhaps even potential boyfriend material, someone who cares for her, someone who accepts her little brother's physical and emotional challenges and someone with whom she might indeed enjoy spending more quality time).

And finally, what I have indeed always much if not most enjoyed and appreciated with regard to The Summer of the Swans is how for one Betsy Byars focusses mainly on realistic, every-day happenings, scenarios and occurrences (well, perhaps with the exception of Charlie getting lost) and on realistic family dynamics (both positive and negative, even occasionally quite painful) and that for two, the author's writing style is also and appreciatively imbued with that same type of realism and understatement, with natural sounding dialogues, with vocabulary choices that feel unexaggerated and truthful, that are not overwrought and extreme in expressivity and emotionality (and thus, even though emotions are raw and immediate in Summer of the Swans, they are in my opinion naturally depicted, they, like the author's description of family, of small town life read and feel true and actually very much like scenarios that can and do occur in real life, and not in fantasy land).

But while I do have to admit that with regard to personal nostalgia, I still somewhat prefer the German translation that I read as a nine/ten year old, that I do in fact enjoy Als die Schwäne kamen a tiny and trifling bit more than the original, I can and will most certainly very highly and warmly recommend Summer of the Swans (but with the caveat that since Summer of the Swans was penned in 1970 and thus more than forty years ago, especially some of the words used to describe little Charlie, his challenges and limitations might not really be what one would call entirely politically correct by today's standards, albeit that Betsy Byars definitely and yes very fortunately and happily always points out that the word "retarded" is pejorative and bigoted and should not in ANY manner be used to depict and describe Sara's little brother, who is also first and foremost portrayed as a little boy, even though he is a youngster with challenges and someone who can thus also at times be challenging to and for his nearest and dearest).

I really enjoyed Scott O'Dell's books as a kid but I don't think they hold up.

I also liked Betsy Byars and all her books but don't remember anything about The Summer of the Swans.

I liked Tuck Everlasting but not sure if I ever read Kneeknock Rise

The odd one out on the list is Enchantress from the Stars. I don't recall ever seeing that in the libraries I frequented and wouldn't have read it if I could get it.

Summer of the Swans is a great, focused book. I appreciate Byars' ability to craft a strong, impactful story without cluttering it up with side plots. I think Byars in general is underrated. The Pinballs is a classic.

O'Dell is very hit & miss for me. I love some of his books, like The Black Pearl, but some of them are a total miss for me, such as Sing Down the Moon.

I think the make-or-break on an O'Dell book is whether the main character has agency.

I would like to try to fit in an Engdahl book this month. It's been my intention for a while. I am intrigued by the very random/thrown together covers on her books.

Phil, I do think the fact that there are not really any major side plots regarding The Summer of the Swans, that the novel remains focused on one main storyline is probably why I was able to both read and totally relate to a fourteen year old main protagonist at the age of nine (when I first read the novel).

I read Summer of the Swans back in the 70s when it won the Newbery. Thanks, Manybooks, for reminding me of the plot points of the book. I gave it 4 stars.
I read Kneeknock Rise back in 1999, and only remember a little bit about it. Also gave it 4 stars.
I have never read Enchantress of the Stars, but I have a copy at home, and so I do plan to read it this month.

Well, personally, I was disappointed by Summer of the Swans. I can definitely see the importance of the themes, and the grace & power of the writing, but I just couldn't make myself actually enjoy the book. I do appreciate the original cover, though:

(you can see it without the medal sticker on openlibrary)

Cheryl wrote: "Well, personally, I was disappointed by Summer of the Swans. I can definitely see the importance of the themes, and the grace & power of the writing, but I just couldn't make myself actually enjoy ..."

I loved this as a child and still loved it when I reread it. But part of it might be nostalgia.

My review for the very short book Kneeknock Rise:

It's always nice when something that not historical fiction and/or gritty gets recognized by the committee. This is short & entertaining, even a bit exciting in bits.

Note that Babbitt illustrates, too. Very appealing.

My favorite Babbitt books are, I think, The Devil's Storybooks. This just doesn't quite seem fresh & clever enough, in my own personal opinion.

I've started Enchantress, and so far am very enchanted with the story.

:)

I just read a lost treasure by Babbitt, Dick Foote and the Shark. I hope any of you who are interested can find time to read this fable... it is on open-library and it is not much longer than most picture-books.

QNPoohBear wrote: "I really enjoyed Scott O'Dell's books as a kid but I don't think they hold up.
"

Several of his books made a big impression on my in my youth. I actually haven't reread them as an adult, really no interest to do so. Are his books still popular with young readers today? I think Avi is still popular (I read some of Avi's books around the same time as O'Dell's)?

None of these selections are calling to me this month, but as always, I appreciate dropping in on the conversation and seeing what all of you think of them :-)

I'm currently enjoying Enchantress from the Stars. I like the main theme of their variation of "The Prime Directive." Sounds like they take it more seriously than Kirk did. I also hear Picard's voice in my head when I read Father's words, at least here in the beginning. Now that may be because I'm currently watching (at the rate of two episodes a day) the entire Next Generation series, and I'll have to watch out for Father as being his own self.

I love that the three different points-of-view are distinct. So many novels nowadays use that technique, but not nearly successfully enough. Sometimes, even when I'm given different fonts for he said/she said, it's not easy to keep straight. But here it is perfectly natural & right.

Cheryl wrote: "I'm currently enjoying Enchantress from the Stars. I like the main theme of their variation of "The Prime Directive." Sounds like they take it more seriously than Kirk did. I also hear ..."

I am really loving this book. I am on page 212 of 286 in the edition I'm reading, so getting close to the end. I liked your opinion about the "Prime Directive." It's possible the author may have been a fan of the original Star Trek TV program, but Next Generation came years later, so she wouldn't know about Picard yet, even though, as you state, Father sounds a bit like him. Elana is one of those impulsive people who leap into situations without getting all the facts first, or ignoring the facts, because, of course, she knows better. Ditto on the three different points of view; I like they are separated by the double spacing between characters.

Cheryl wrote: "I'm currently enjoying Enchantress from the Stars. I like the main theme of their variation of "The Prime Directive." Sounds like they take it more seriously than Kirk did. I also hear ..."

Well, now you're tempting me with the Star Trek references ;-) I'm currently reading a YA Sci-Fi novel so I don't want to double up, but I will keep this in mind for the future.

Kathryn wrote: "QNPoohBear wrote: "I really enjoyed Scott O'Dell's books as a kid but I don't think they hold up.
"

Several of his books made a big impression on my in my youth. I actually haven't ..."
I enjoyed Sing Down the Moon primarily because I majored in anthropology in college. Therefore, I imagined Ursula Le Guin's dad (A. L. Kroeber of anthropology fame) encouraging Bright Morning to tell her stary as he listened and took notes.

Discussion questions from my review of Enchantress...:

This first note can be read as defense of faith, or of belief in magic, or even as encouragement to do science... what does it mean to you?

"Why, if nobody believed anything except what they understood, how limited we'd be!"

Second, do you agree with Georyn?

"For it is better to know of what exists than not to know. I would rather be helpless than blind...."

I do recommend it. And the sequel, too!

I finished Enchantress and gave it 5 stars. It is much more character driven than plot driven, focusing on three people: Elana, Georwyn, and Jarel; their thoughts, their actions, and their interactions with each other. Elana is from the Federation, the most advanced people in the universe, for whom telepathy and telekinesis is as natural as eating. Jarel is from the Empire, a civilization that is spacefaring and seeking to colonize new planets. Their belief is that science and nature is all there is; they do not believe in the supernatural. Georwyn is a native of the planet, Andrecia, that the Empire has arrived upon to colonize. Their people have approximately the technology of the medieval period of Earth. The thrust of the novel is that Elana, her father, and her fiancé need to try to help one of the natives to develop some telekinetic power, and so frighten the Empire's colonizers to leave the planet. But Elana, et al, are under strict oath not to reveal who they really are. The plot moves along slowly, but surely, as Elana, et al train Georwyn to fight the "dragon" (actually a mechanical machine that clear cuts land). Not everything goes completely according to plan in this well-thought out, engrossing novel.

I'm so glad you enjoyed it.

Did it prompt any ponderings or possible discussion questions for you?

I can think of one:
The author seemed to imply that it is wrong for an advanced civilization to push aside a more primitive civilization, and even to kill the indigenous people who try to interfere, in order to establish a colony. How might this relate to our world, either in history or in the future?

I do agree with Georwyn, in the quote Cheryl wrote above. Ignorance is not necessarily bliss, especially when "ignorance of the law is no excuse." But yes, I would rather know.

Oh, yes, I'd love to listen to young readers discuss the theme of colonization. Speaking for myself, I do not take for granted the fact that some of my ancestors had a role in 'colonizing' the upper Midwest, displacing the indigenous peoples. On one planet, though, it's hard to share respectfully....

Ignorance, well, yes, in the abstract I too agree with Georwyn. But I do have to take time off from keeping up with politics and news once in awhile... it gets stressful sorting truth from biased and fake news, and then coping with the disillusionment that comes from spending too much time learning about what is considered newsworthy by the more reliable sources.

Which is why I read books. I read history, and science, and philosophy, etc., trying to understand more universal, more 'big picture' constants and patterns....