Catching up on Classics (and lots more!) discussion

The Last Question by Isaac Asimov is our November 2021 Short Story/Novella Read.

This discussion will open on November 1

Beware Short Story Discussions will have Spoilers

Great! Asimov as I remember him from my teens. Little characterization, but great big ideas! Quick and fun to read. Galactic history in 9 pages, and an interesting twist at the end. Great care taken in incrementally updating the technologies at each step of mankind‘s expansion into the universe. Humanity as a whole is characterized representatively by the few characters of each era. Loved it!

I love Golden Age Science Fiction, especially the short stories. I think I gave this one three or four stars. That is certainly not Asimov's fault. Because this was probably one of the earliest versions of this story of the rise and fall of the Universe - the whole expansion, contraction, to expansion again scenario - it was probably mind-blowing when published in the 1950s. Still it was predictable for me. I have probably read all the copy cats or seen it on TV. The sense that I knew where it was going was what kept me from giving it five stars.

A very thought provoking story. The progression of humans from bodies and minds as we are today then moving to bodies in stasis somewhere with the minds roving freely to all minds joined together and bodies unnecessary at all. Those same ideas are echoed in the movie The Matrix and in the borg from Star Trek. But clearly Asimov got there first.

Laurie wrote: "A very thought provoking story. The progression of humans from bodies and minds as we are today then moving to bodies in stasis somewhere with the minds roving freely to all minds joined together a..."

You're right Laurie. I can think of several entities in Star Trek that had "evolved" past their original embodied states.

This is the first Asimov I’ve read and I loved it! I thought it was brilliant. Definitely made me think of some Star Trek species.

One of my all time favorite short stories. Guess it helps having a science background to really appreciate the ending.

I had a very different reaction to this story. How disheartening and bleak I found it.

Sara wrote: "I had a very different reaction to this story. How disheartening and bleak I found it."

Disheartening in what way, Sara? That humans abdicate to machines, that we evolve to nonexistance, that we recreate ourselves, or something else?

That we dismiss God in favor of becoming some collective mind that exists inside a machine waiting for rebirth. That what is real and sentient about us, the part that has feeling and emotion is lost in favor of that which can only be analytical and mechanical. That all of this is sacrificed in an effort to be immortal--but to what end? What would you do with immortality if you were just a piece of data existing inside the machine you created?

Succinctly stated, Sara. I think Asimov's story sidesteps immortality of individuals living forever by having the human race start over through a process generated by human cognitive thought. As humans evolved they seemed to lose their emotions (for example, a desire to celebrate an achievement) and their spiritual needs were subverted to humanism. We became our own gods or became subservient to the thing we created-thus making it a god. However, humanity reached its limit; so, its god, created by humans, regenerated them. The process begins again and, presumably, ends the same way. This is Asimov's version of immortality and, I agree, there is a bleakness to this.

Nice summary, Pat. I think your version of what Asimov is saying is spot on. It isn't an idea I would ever want to buy into. I suppose I think there is a danger in thinking you can be God or create Him.

My take was a little different. Whether I believe it is right or not, humanity's development of technology marches on (lately it seems the march has turned into a sprint). I'm a bit of a luddite, and usually disagree with these changes, for reasons similar to what Sara points out--the loss of what is real for the artificial/mechanical. This is a sad and disappointing fact of life for me.

What science fiction can do is pull back the camera--way, way back, from my own viewpoint as a human in this time back to include many generations and species over the whole of existence. I found the idea that humanity might turn from its destructive capabilities to its creative capabilities a hopeful one, and liked the story for that.

Enjoy reading your view of it, Kathleen. Of course, you are right that the technological sprint continues and we get the good and the bad of it. Like everything else in life, I complain of the part I don't like and embrace the part I do. AI might win the final battle.

OK I'm going off into bizarre-o land. I actually thought how everything comes full circle. Modern physicists believe that the universe can be broken down into its smallest piece which is not atoms but is really particles of light.

Computers are just machines of 1s and 0s. They achieve this on/off through the opening or closing of tiny circuits (now on little chips). Basically on/off or light/dark. The story uses a computer for the basic intelligence of the universe.

The story was written by Asimov whose family was Jewish. He was well aware of the scriptures. God created the universe in the Bible by saying let there be light.... full circle would be our modern physicist saying the true basis of the universe is particles of light, which have a "spooky" relationship to one another. They work in tandem not randomly.

If Asimov had just used the word God instead of a computer he would be doing a modern retelling of the Genesis creation story. Of course it was a computer for the shock value, and his own personal position on his ancestral faith heritage.

Part 2 - Asimov was of the early Campbell group of authors. at Astounding Magazine. In a forward written in his later life Asimov speaks of his relationship with Joseph Campbell, Jr. (ha this was a mistake...John Campbell, Jr.) who actively rewrote stories before publishing. Asimov broke with Campbell because his 1940 story "Homo Sol" was heavily rewritten to make humans the "masters of the universe" in a way that made him unhappy. At the time of WW2 fighting and then post-war euphoria Asimov felt Campbell went over the top with American cheerleading. So this 1950 story has a new publisher and Asimov is spreading his wings in a new freer environment where he is not being rewritten for a political vision.

Not bizarre-o land at all, Lynn. Very astute thoughts. You, Pat and Kathleen have given me something to think about. I like when others make me take another look at a story with different eyes, which is why I love discussions!

I agree completely with Sara and love all of the takes on this story.

Lynn, your thoughts are rather brilliant I think. I'm a Joseph Campbell fan, so you made my head spin for a second though. I had to look it up and I think you're referring to John Campbell Jr. I knew nothing about him and that history you reference--so interesting to uncover the philosophies behind what we read!

Seeing the comments I had to go and read this and it brought back memories. We read Entropy as a prescribed book in my first year at university and the fact that eventually everything will come to an end as it runs out of energy was a disconcerting thought. Isaac Asimov takes this further, but then brings life back at the end and it will have to evolve again from the start.

Kathleen wrote: "I agree completely with Sara and love all of the takes on this story.

Lynn, your thoughts are rather brilliant I think. I'm a Joseph Campbell fan, so you made my head spin for a second though. I ..."

hahaha yes, Joseph Campbell is someone else!!!

I have read this twice and plan on reading it again keeping these comments in mind. These comments should make my next read through the best.

The fiction is insightful and predictive. It envisions the future i.e. translates our present in some way; the shift towards sustainable energy sources, advancement of artificial intelligence, exponential population boom etc.

The ‘circle of life’ discussion here is really interesting. While I noticed it, I hadn’t really given it as much thought. I wonder if the reason for that is that I have lived most of my life in India. The idea of life being a never-ending chain of birth, death, and rebirth, and humanity thus being ‘immortal’ is very common to Hindu and Buddhist philosophies here. According to these philosophies, only the body dies; the soul (or the mind) is always alive – much like how the humans in Asimov’s story begin to communicate through their minds at some point, their bodies suspended in a sort of trance.

What I found terrifying, though, was the vast ‘existentialism’, the pointless of it all. The humans in the story are constantly wanting to get better, become technologically advanced, have answers to every question. And they do all of it, but for what? And what is the cost to reaching out to things that can’t be understood by the human mind where it stands today?

It was also pretty frightening to think that a machine could become so powerful that it could create computers, more advanced than itself, to be its successor. It is collecting data at all times; it is always listening; in spite of that there isn’t sufficient data to answer ‘the question’. The sheer intensity of it all is terrifying.

And yet there was something warm about the fact that human beings never stop asking the question. Even if it was a machine that re-created the Universe in the ‘end’ of the story, the machine too was after all a creation of humanity. And there was something endearing about the sheer capacity of the human mind to create – and keep asking questions.

I still cannot find this book… ggrr! Any ideas? i will close my eyes and use online version for now but i am an old fashion girl which likes the smell of the pages of a book..

Didi wrote: "I still cannot find this book… ggrr! Any ideas? i will close my eyes and use online version for now but i am an old fashion girl which likes the smell of the pages of a book.."

Since Asimov was writing for pulp magazines, his short stories were later on anthologized in various collections. This one was present in the collections: Nine Tomorrows (1959), The Best of Isaac Asimov (1973), Robot Dreams (1986), The Best Science Fiction of Isaac Asimov (1986), the retrospective Opus 100 (1969), and in Isaac Asimov: The Complete Stories, Vol. 1 (1990).

Didi wrote: "I still cannot find this book… ggrr! Any ideas?"

I see Armin already found what Wikipedia had to say about that.

Further down the same page Asimov explains:

"Why is it my favorite? For one thing I got the idea all at once and didn't have to fiddle with it; and I wrote it in white-heat and scarcely had to change a word. This sort of thing endears any story to any writer. Then, too, it has had the strangest effect on my readers. Frequently someone writes to ask me if I can give them the name of a story, which they think I may have written, and tell them where to find it. They don't remember the title but when they describe the story it is invariably 'The Last Question'. This has reached the point where I recently received a long-distance phone call from a desperate man who began, "Dr. Asimov, there's a story I think you wrote, whose title I can't remember—" at which point I interrupted to tell him it was 'The Last Question' and when I described the plot it proved to be indeed the story he was after. I left him convinced I could read minds at a distance of a thousand miles."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Las...

Also:
Asimov "privately" concluded that the story was his best science fiction yet written.[a] He placed it just higher than "The Ugly Little Boy" (September 1958) and "The Bicentennial Man" (1976).

Sneha wrote: "The ‘circle of life’ discussion here is really interesting. While I noticed it, I hadn’t really given it as much thought. I wonder if the reason for that is that I have lived most of my life in Ind..."

I think your comments are on point.
It's human nature to ask himself the Existential Questions, but it is also the forbidden knowledge. Adam and Eve were expelled from Eden by eating the apple from the tree of knowledge. If we try to understand something our minds cannot process, it ends up in the wrong direction. So, it is also in human nature to label or misrepresent things that we don't understand. When unable to solve something, we end up being in the loop, frustrated, depressed and it becomes pointless. But it's not the beginning and the end that is important, it's the process between, the life and its energy. It circulates and gives another things life, in an endless loop, in endless forms. So, it's pointless to think and become depressed about it, since the life circle will never end (or will it :D?).


This short story most likely inspired Douglas Adams to create the great supercomputer Deep Thought and Marvin and the Paranoid Android in "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy". I would highly recommend it for ones who love to read similar stuff from a more funny perspective.

Armin wrote: "Didi wrote: "I still cannot find this book… ggrr! Any ideas? i will close my eyes and use online version for now but i am an old fashion girl which likes the smell of the pages of a book.."

Since ..."
Thank you, Armin, I think I found it online now on multivax.

I suppose the fact that we can identify with this story better than those who read it in the 1950s when it was written automatically qualifies it as a visionary piece.

I really enjoyed this discussion and seeing all the different ways we viewed the story.

I had never even heard of this story so I went in without knowing anything about the plot.

The way I viewed the story was that all the resources were being used up so humans had to evolve to survive. They eventually evolved to the melded minds at the end.

What I thought was so beautiful, was, to quote one of my favorite movies, "Life finds a way." It was hopeful for me to imagine that there is no end. That once the energy we have is used, it will find a way to grow and expand again and the circle continues.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts everyone and giving me some different perspectives. It was a thought-provoking discussion.

Natalie wrote: "I really enjoyed this discussion and seeing all the different ways we viewed the story.

I had never even heard of this story so I went in without knowing anything about the plot.

The way I view..."

This is beautifully put, Natalie: "once the energy we have is used, it will find a way to grow and expand again and the circle continues." What a lovely conclusion--thanks for sharing it.

I just recently finished this story and loved it. My review here.