The Procrastinators Book Club discussion

Welcome to the Ruin and Rising Buddy Read Discussion thread! This thread officially opens on December 6th and anyone can join at any time. Please keep in mind that spoilers are allowed in this thread but only up to the group's current reading place. Do not spoil the book if you've read further than the group. Any extra days can be used to catch up!

Each day we will be reading by chapters or page numbers. Page numbers are an approximation based on the hardcover or paperback that is the default on Goodreads. The suggested Buddy Read discussion schedule is as follows:

Week of 12/10
December 10th: Before + Chapters 1, 2
December 11th: Chapters 3, 4

Week of 12/12
December 12th: Chapters 5, 6
December 13th: Chapters 7-9
December 14th: Chapters 10-12
December 15th: Chapters 13, 14
December 16th: Chapters 15, 16
December 17th: Chapters 17, 18 + After

PARTICIPANTS
~ Edith
~ Bopeep
~ Juliane

Hi buddies!
I've said on the other thread to start this today, and I will follow this read schedule:
(view spoiler)[
December 10th: Before + Chapters 1, 2
December 11th: Chapters 3, 4
December 12th: Chapters 5, 6
December 13th: Chapters 7-9
December 14th: Chapters 10-12
December 15th: Chapters 13, 14
December 16th: Chapters 15, 16
December 17th: Chapters 17, 18 + After (hide spoiler)]

Have you started yet? Was the start good and expected?

Thanks for the schedule Bopeep! I haven't started it yet as I just finished Siege and Storm yesterday (will write my thoughts out in the other thread) but I'm hoping to start Ruin and Rising today!

Hello together,

That schedule sounds great Bopeep.

I started early because I couldn't wait after finishing Siege and Storm and am now in the middle of chapter 4 but work commitments have slowed me down and this schedule should get me back on track perfectly :-)

I liked the start so far, the setting at the beginning is really interesting and once again quite different than the first two books but I feel it brings the story forward quite well even despite its rather constrained location.

Sooooo, I started and I too ended up a lot farther than I thought I would. Here are my thoughts so far though:

Before + Chapters 1 and 2
(view spoiler)[
*I felt a little claustrophobic during these chapters. Leigh Bardugo does a great job at deliberately making the white cathedral feel like a prison. I consistently felt smothered by the Apparat’s fanaticism, so much that it almost made me want to stop reading.
*I liked the touch of white to Alina’s character—if she didn’t feel saintly before, she does now.
*It’s so great to see that her and Genya are on speaking terms again and that Alina is back to defending her. Didn’t realize that I missed their friendship.
*The way that Alina gains her powers back felt like a movie scene in my mind lol. To say it was very dramatic is an understatement.
*Also, branding??? I don’t know how I feel about that :/ (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 3 and 4
(view spoiler)[
*Glad to see Alina and the others finally leave their underground prison! I wonder how things will play out in the long run for them.
*When it was stated that 12 of them would be leaving I almost gasped because it’s going to be suuuch a hassle with a big group traversing the tunnels.
*Distrustful of the Apparat, not sure that he will behave in the people’s best interest while Alina is gone.
*Nice to see Alina is giving the Darkling a taste of his own medicine using the connection they have.
*Cliffhanger from chapter 4 is nail biting! (hide spoiler)]

Not much else from these chapters on my part.

Chapters 1-3,5(ish)

(view spoiler)[ Edith, I completely understand your uncertainty with Alinas behaviour in book 2 as you wrote in the other thread. It is really noticeable that there are just too many things thrown at her and too often I felt that it was all too much just tearing her apart.
I was worried that it would continue like this in this last book but I agree her behaviour towards the Darkling showed more security into her own image which I sometimes found she was missing earlier on.

I truly felt so bad when I read about Genyas fate at the end of book 2.
But it is good to see that she seems to be coming out of her resignation towards her fate and is actively helping Alina to escape from the caves, if her behaviour in the kitchens is any indication.

The branding was quite creepy and Alinas behaviour in that moment made me wonder on which path she will continue as I also think the whole search for the firebird might be overdoing it a bit in terms of Alinas fate towards the light side.

But otherwise I found the kitchen fighting scene with all the Grisha coming togehter was really good

I still can't decide if I like or hate Zoya ;-) She has such a mean girl energy but then she does seem quite willing to throw herself into this fight for the good side. I would also be much more comfortable if she and Mal were to be a couple properly not this sneaking around each other.

I know the whole love interest thing is often an integral pert of YA-books but especially for Alina I feel that it would be much more important for her to have a few decently good friends instead of necessarily a love story, which at this point I feel really misplaced. (hide spoiler)]

Sorry that is a lot under the spoiler, I just wasn't sure about spliting it all up into different parts of possible spoiler / non-spoiler, so better safe than sorry :-D

Hi buddies! I did a pretty good read on my trip, 150 pages or so haha
In my opinion, the opening was kinda boring, but from chapter 6 it went better, though its not as action packed and fast as the second one (or so I think?).

I forgot that Alina was so full of fury and hate. But I loved the drama scene where she got her powers back and when she went to see the Darkling. I still don't understand what happened yet, but I like she's trying to get more power from her magic.

For me, Mal and Zoya could be together and leave the Grishas alone, since I don't like neither of them lol Mal makes good strategies, but in relationships he's a total mess. Though I understand him not wanting to be near Alina and be in love with her.

Chapter 6
Oooh Nikolai! I didn't expect him so soon, but I'm glad he's here because I love him and I think he's the best character of the saga Plus he's the only one that makes good jokes.

Chapter 7
I couldn't stop reading with that chapter 6 ending. So I continued a little bit, and I didn't remember well what happened with Genya before all this. The accusation of treachery was legal, but I loved how Genya could point the king too for rape. She's so brave! And those last word to the king were

Chapters 5-8(ish)

(view spoiler)[ I cheered when Nikolai showed up again and his entrance onto the scene was so perfectly him. Can't remember the last time I enjoyed a character this much.

The description of the Spinning wheel and the whole scenery of their hiding place is breathtaking and the training scene with the mountains added some much needed levity considering their whole situation.

I really love how Genya found her voice against the King and Queen especially considering the sordid things she had to endure and her and David are so sweet.

What I also find hilarious are the regular reminders that Oncat is still around, its like in every chapter there needs to be a quick half sentence that the cat is still there and still as postively bitchy as cats simply tend to be :-D

The scene with Sergei in the boiler room shows just how tragic the ending of book 2 still impacts them, because of course none of them actually have had the time to settle and grief their lost friends and loved ones.

I think it is a good thing that they intend to split up the group for the next steps as the group seemed far to large to make a quiet entrance anywhere, as seen by chapters 5 and 6. So I am curious to see how the dynamics between the characters will develop (hide spoiler)]

oH MY GOODNESS !! Okay okay, I have so much I want to talk about but I will wait until y'all are done with chapter 12! what in the world did I read!!!

I'm glad we're all on the same page about Nikolai! he's the best character of all in my opinion

Holy Crap - Chapter 11/12 - What the actual F***

Please excuse the swearing but I currently cannot process this into any other words

Okay wait for me, but I will read chapter 12 today! I won't open goodreads until I've read it so please share your thought here!

I wanted to say that I was surprised by chapter 9 where the Darkling says he will pass to Occidental Ravka but I'm hyped by what you're saying!

yesss!! bopeep, they're good chapters, so much happens! but I won't say anything until you're done! I had to mentally take a break after everything lol

Whaaaaat has happened there? The f*?!

We were falling in love with Nikolai again when suddenly... ZAS! He turned into a monster. I didn't expect that at all. I didn't expect the Darkling attacking, but I didn't want to read some chapters about court meeting neither lol.

Wondering wth will happen now?

Oh my god this development in chapter 12 was so good and so shocking.

I have finished completely by now because I could not stop reading yesterday, I just had to know how it proceeds but I am still ordering my thoughts around it.

But since we all had that particular "What the hell"-moment I want to dive into chapter 12 a bit.

Lets be honest it would have been too nice if they had just split up as intended and everybody left the mountains whole and healthy :-)

I am very torn about Sergei, I don't want to believe that he actually intended to betray them from the beginning and simply played his role of the grieving person that well. I think he was really traumatized after the end of book 2 with Maries death and how someone like that goes back to the only source of safety (or at least safety in his mind) whatever that meant at this point of the story. Honestly don't believe he deserved the fate he was handed in the end.

I think the whole attack and what he did to Nikolai only further reinforced my believe that there is no redemption possible for the Darkling whatsoever. At this point he only wants to destroy every single being that does not bow to him and own Alinas power and he does not think straight on the possible ramifications of getting it.

Like Bopeep I was also surprised for example about his plans for further invasion of West Ravka in an earlier chapter, which to me seemed short sighted in the grand scheme of things.

Plus I think there would have actually been some political merit to for example only abduct Nikolai and use him as a hostage for the Darkling to bargain with Alina, which was my first thought when Nikolai and Alina were grabbed by the monsters. Especially considering the point of the friendship/relationship that Alina and Nikolai were at I think that would have made for interesting developments.

But only half a page later, poor Nikolai, the actual story development toward him felt so much harsher than any possibilities I could have imagined and at least to me it felt like it was only geared toward breaking Alina into submission, as opposed to earlier points where the Darkling still seemed to pretend he wanted Alina to be his Queen as somewhat equals. To me the whole idea of turning Nikolai into this creature simply shows that the Darkling has not much left but cruelty.

Baghras involvment in all of this and her family history turned out to be very interesting. The whole story of Morozovas experiments and the ruin of his family is seeped with tragedy and I am a bit glad to read about Baghra admitting to her mistakes in raising the Darkling. Although of course considering that there had never been power like hers its not like she could have really known better from past experience on how to change things. But I feel like her sacrifice at the end of the battle was well written and showed that even with this kind of power it is possible to maintain a grip on humanity instead of going completely towards the dark side. Although of course she took a long time getting there and in the meantime simply lived along to many of the Darklings evil schemes. But yeah in the end I do not despise her quite as much anymore and after all her sacrifice was vital to have anyone survive this massacre in the mountains.

I was driving and listening to the audiobook when it happened and I was just like "nooooo! no no no no!" aloud to myself lol. omg and then Sergei too???? omg I felt soooo bad for him :( but then I keep switching mindsets between he deserved it and then feeling bad again. I guess we'll never know what his true intentions were. I want to have high hopes for Baghra as well but everything happened so fast :( And poor little adrik, he's so young and already missing an arm lol. at least he stayed alive though!
on another note: Zoya is really becoming a homie! I'm starting to like her more and more as she's shown herself to be a true ally to both Mal and Alina. I'm glad to see everyone finally banding together to fight this one big terrible thing. (I know they were before, but this time around it feels like they're a team)

@Juliane: YES! That is a very good point regarding Baghra! No matter how long it took, she still ended up sacrificing herself in a way that was beneficial to her allies. it's interesting that she and her son are both on opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to power. and I'm also wondering how likely it is that Alina is also a descendant of Morozova

Im so sad I couldn't read more, I thought I would have more free time! But I wanted to reply to chapter 12's comments~

I think that Sergei was just scared, he did that to be safe after all, but ended dead too :( But I agree with you, Juliane, they didn't almost grieve.

It seems the Darkling is getting madder little by little, and their connection with Alina is so possesive, though we did know that by now haha

Yep, I thought the Darkling abducted Nikolai. ... Well, that's not 100% true. I thought that Nikolai was playing some trick on Alina, I didn't think is was an attack hahaha

Baghra surprised me!! She was always an annoying old woman, trying to teach the others, but not wanting too neither. I didn't thought about her going against his son, and less that she trusted Alina to flee.
Her story was amazing too, I didn't think they were Morozova's descendants.

And now I wonder who might Alina's mother would be, because I'm pretty sure she will appear now that they are on the area were Mal and Alina were born.


@Edith Hahahah I can imagina that situation!
And yeah, poor Adrik, but it seems he accepts it? I loved the little pun they did at some point :)

I still have mixed feelings about Zoya D: Not sure what expect of her, really.

I agree with you on Zoya, Edith. She really grew on me in the course of this book and now I find her sarcasm and snappy remarks a real light in the darker moments of the book.
Also I can totally see the reaction to listening while driving ;-D

Since I don't know about the different progress in reading I'm just gonna put a few thoughts for the rest of the book under a Spoiler warning

(view spoiler)[

I absolutely have to admit I did not see the Mal reveal coming. Like Bopeep I also figured we might get to meet Alinas family but I am guessing more schock was needed.

Also I am not quite sure how I feel about the whole Mal situation because it came so suddenly and while to me it wouldn't have felt necessary for Mal and Alina to be connected this way I did feel that it fit the overall story really well. Although I feel torn about the Twins resurrecting Mal.

The solution of Alina losing her powers and instead more Sun summoners being created seemed a really good idea to me because ultimately what the story showed was that nobody should have as much power as the three Amplifiers would have provided.

In the end I like where Alina and Mal ended up, even though I still feel them ending up as a couple was not strictly necessary. I think it fits their lives that they would want to create a better future for the orphaned children while also living quietly and without further attention from the rest of the world. I think it is really sweet that Misha found a family with them (and of course that the cat survived with them till the end haha).
I love that Zoya, Genya, David and Nikolai keep visiting and the deep bond this shows between them.

Would have preferred to never hear from the Apparat again but of course he had to show up and get involved, I don't like it no matter how much sense it might make for Nikolais politics.
The future for Ravka very much seems like an uphill battle although one would hope it could not get worse ever again.

In general the ending felt bittersweet for me in many parts but at the same time it seemed very fitting for this trilogy.

(hide spoiler)]

Are you guys planning on reading the Six of Crow duology? I would recommend reading that, and then the King of Scar books.

I really enjoyed reading your comments :D

I haven't finished yet, so thank you Juliane for putting everything under spoilers! :)

@Mina: yes! I absolutely want to continue with the grishaverse but I'm going to put it on hold until February. Leigh Bardugo's second book to Ninth House is coming out here in a few weeks so I'm VEEERRYYY excited about it lol. I'm hoping I find someone to buddy read it with!

@Edith
Yes! I'm glad you are going to read them in that order because things are connected, and it's so nice to know why some things are happening the way they are. On another note because I just can't NOT comment on it... I can't wait for you to see Zoya's growth.

I wish I had the discipline to wait on the right order on finding out how the story continues :-D But once my brain is locked in on a character and their story I just can't help myself haha.

So I just started reading Crooked Kingdom while also listening to King of Scars. However I am trying to pace myself to actually finish CK befor continuing with KoS because I realize that one spoilers the other. Rather hard considering I enjoy all the characters and their stories in both books so much.

However if we arrive at the same point in the order of these books for another buddy read I would absolutely be open to it.

Nooooo Juliane 😂 That is not good. King of Scars has characters from both series, S&B and SoC, and it is set in time after those books..

If nothing else it's good you read the S&B books because a lot of people just skip them because they are not as good. Which okay I understand it, I wasn't impressed with them when I read them, but they weren't bad. HOWEVER S&B is playing a big part in understanding what's happening in KoS, and of course when you read KoS you know the characters and see their development.

Believe me Mina deep down I know its wrong 😂 but oh the woes of a reader in desperate need to find out what happened to beloved characters haha

But for this trilogy for me these Buddy reads came at just the right time and I enjoy reading everyones comments. Otherwise I don't know when I would have picked this series up again as I also did not feel as enthusiastic about S&B as I had hoped. But Siege and Storm was a much better follow-up and actually my favourite of the series while Ruin and Rising brought a fitting ending in my opinion although I have some things I am on the fence about. Its too bad there are no half-point-ratings on goodreads that would make my ratings of the books so much easier ;-)

I finally finished the book today! had to put everything on pause due to holidays taking over, but a few things:
(view spoiler)[
*I thought the final battle would be bigger than it was for some reason? I was expecting them to go out with a bang I guess.
*the darkling's downfall seemed way too easy and unremarkable, which I supposed was the point to it all, but I personally was not satisfied with it lol
*Like you @Juliane, I also think they should have left Mal dead. it would've made for a better ending in my opinion.
*I actually liked that Alina lost her powers as well, truly befitting of her overall character as the way she was progressing in the story didn't sit well with me.
*Screw the apparat honestly (sorry for the language)...but the dude did not lift a finger to help in the war and it seems unfair he is trying to partake in new Ravka.
*I'm so glad Oncat made it throughout the end T__T
*Overall wasn't a fan of this book. my favorite one was probably still the first one honestly and Mal wasn't as annoying back then. The ending just seemed kind of predictable and was not wowed by the conclusion.
(hide spoiler)]

Had fun reading with you guys, thanks for a very enjoyable and active discussion!!

I'm still reading this, but I will share my thoughts when I finish!

I can just say wtf Mals the third amplifier?!
And they have to kill him? Can he just touch Alina when necessary? XD


Soo the next book is six of crows?

Hiii!
I'm finished!

I was sooo confused that Mal was an amplifier, but it was a nice twist. I love how Bardugo always has the readers think one thing, and then BAM. It wasn't so well written though? I can only compare it to Ninth House ^^'

I really did expect to go all wrong, because the Darkling predicted everything in advance. I thought they had a plan B, but in fact they are just teens playing heroes.

I was happy that they had a happy ending after all! And I loved the idea of the study house/orphanage.

As you said, I would prefer Mal dead, but somehow I knew the author wouldn't allow that. BUT I didn't want Alina to go with Nikolai either. My idea was Alina living by her own like a crazy cat lady hahaha

@Edith Mal wasn't annoying on the first book because he didn't appear as much hahaha

So, the next book to read is Six of Crows?

I'm so glad you liked it Bopeep! and yes, the next book in the series would be six of crows. I heard it's very very good?