All About Books discussion

The play for this season, 21 March-20 June 2015, is Anton Chekov's Uncle Vanya. Discussion of other Chekov plays is also welcome.

Here I am!

I will try to read this soon -- I have some personal stuff to deal with but perhaps in the next week or so.

Sandy wrote: "I started listening to this today. Another new author for me. I listened to a few of Chekhov's short stories over the weekend and found them pleasant enough so thought I'd try the play."

Are you listening via Librivox?

Could be a good idea: not at the moment, but in a fotnight maybe I'll look for the librivox version of it

Perhaps I will listen to that then. I do like the full cast audiobooks for plays!

Well I read this today. In fact, I started it then decided to listen to the Librivox recording while I read. The full cast recording was very well done so if you are interested in that, here is the link:

https://librivox.org/uncle-vanya-by-a...

The play itself had a lot to think about; I need to mull it over a bit.

One thought I had though was whether Chekhov named the second wife of the professor Helena as a sly reference to Helen of Troy. She certainly seemed to have a similar effect on the men around her!

I didn't expect a play written in 1898 to discuss deforestation and climate change. Since there are still people denying the perils of climate change, it comes as a great surprise to hear the doctor discuss it.

Leslie wrote: "Well I read this today. In fact, I started it then decided to listen to the Librivox recording while I read. The full cast recording was very well done so if you are interested in that, here is t..."
PLanning to listen to it after finishing the one I have on my MP3 now. GLad you say it's well read and performed!

Giorgia wrote: "I didn't expect a play written in 1898 to discuss deforestation and climate change. Since there are still people denying the perils of climate change, it comes as a great surprise to hear the do..."

I was struck by that too!

@Sandy -- my advice is to listen to the whole thing & then think about what it means. But I will copy the blurb from Librivox in case that helps:

"Uncle Vanya (subtitled “Scenes From Country Life”) is a tragicomedy by Anton Chekhov. It is set on the failing country estate of a retired professor, Serebrakoff, who returns after a long absence with his beautiful young wife, and throws the household into confusion. Rivalry, unrequited love, illicit romance, and attempted suicide are the result, punctuated throughout by Chekhov’s sad, wistful humor."

Also, here is a link to the SparkNotes (sort of like online Cliff Notes):

http://www.sparknotes.com/drama/uncle...

Mhh... well, I think the play was Ok, but there wasn't nothing to mull over much.
(view spoiler)[ The drama that could have been, the love... pentagon (?) is just given the shortest time and then everyone leaves. There isn't any difference from before and after. The professor and Helena come and stir up feelings: - passion for uncle Vanja and the doctor for Helena
- Sonja admitting her feelings for the doctor
- Sonja and Uncle Vanja expressing their dissatisfaction about their lives, and regret for the years that they have sacrificed for the rather ungrateful professor.

The potential for a great drama was there.

Uncle Vanja even tries twice to shoot the professor and there is absolutely no consequence.

When Helena and the professor leave, everything resumes as it was before their arrival. They have no lasting effect on anything.

I don't know what to think... the meaning of this play eludes me... was the point just saying how much life sucks for everyone? So is it an encouragement for the audience not tho waste their lives like the characters?

(hide spoiler)]

Vanya might be my favorite Chekhov play. The other one in the running is The Seagull.
Chekhov has a very bleak outlook on life in general in his plays, but that is a big part of what I like about them.

Started this morning going to work. Still, after the first act, don't know where we're going ...

Perfect timing Sandy. I've finished it today, and have the strong impression I might have missed something.

This short play by Chekhov held a few surprises for me. Beyond a story of family , land, and money (recurring themes for the author) I was surprised to read long expositions about land management, deforestation, and other environmental issues which were adding to the poverty and health of the locals and country. Chekhov was indeed well ahead of his time.

Sorry -- I have been neglecting this thread.

Sandy wrote: "This is another (much shorter) article published in The American Scholar in 2009 which discusses the plays of Ibsen and Chekhov.

The Meaning Behind the Lines"

I found this an interesting article (now that I have finally gotten to it!). I read 4-5 Ibsen plays a few years ago and my reaction was almost diametrically opposed to that expressed in the article. I found Ibsen to be surprisingly modern in his viewpoint and the issues he addressed still relevant.

This is the second play of Chekhov's I've read (the other being The Cherry Orchard). I found Uncle Vanya more interesting than The Cherry Orchard but both seem to have a certain despair or hopelessness that doesn't appeal to me. I guess that this is what amber was saying does appeal to her. I will continue to stretch my boundaries but at heart I don't like tragedies (even Shakespeare's) much; I much prefer comedies.

@Manuel -- You mention one of the most interesting aspects of the play to me. It is fascinating to me that these land management issues were discussed so long ago!

@Giorgia -- I get the feeling that this would have been more dramatic on stage. However, your point that in the end nothing much has changed is valid. Perhaps that is the point - the daily business of life goes on no matter what emotional upheavals we individuals go through? That feels like a very Russian sentiment to me...

Well put Sandy. I did think that this was more like "real" life and that perhaps was one reason it wasn't so dramatic -- life is usually not very dramatic even when all the elements are there.

The changes are mostly in the people's relationships and attitudes. Another change is that (view spoiler)[Sonia is no longer hoping to win the doctor's romantic attention. I found Sonia's situation the saddest aspect -- her life was full of drudgery but at least before she had the comfort of dreaming of a possible romance. In the end, that illusion is taken from her (hide spoiler)].

Sandy wrote: "I also felt frustrated at the end of the play when it appeared that nothing had happened. I suppose that is my own personal need for a plot and some semblance of action or movement. It seems possib..."

We sometimes fail to fully appreciate the circumstances of pre-revolutionary serfs in Russia, or that of a predominately rural society. Anton was himself a physician whose father became bankrupt (which can be an interesting insight into characters in the play and their motivations). Nothing changes because in Russian rural life, nothing changes except for the people in the story.

Yes that is what I was trying to say to Giorgia. You have expressed it better though!

@Leslie I don't think Chekhov is writing tragedies. Tragedy is more everyone ends up dead then what happens in Chekhov plays. I think of him as more of a realist, and that's what I like about him. I'm sick of the born on the street and now they're a millionaire sort of stories. Most people's lives don't change that much, and that was even more true in Chekhov's time when most people were living the same way their families had been living for a thousand years.

On the environmental stuff; I think Chekhov was writing in an era following more mechanized logging and farming which was a major change, so I'm not surprised it would have been on some people's minds.
I think the difference between Chekhov and Ibsen is Ibsen was writing things that aren't thought of as questions any longer, most of the reading world now knows women have wants and desires, while there are still a lot of people with educations that think people aren't affecting the earth.

@leslie I forgot something. I don't actually think losing the idea of a romance is as bad still having it. (view spoiler)[ as long as Sonia is still thinking she and the doc could be together she has to feel the pain again every time it doesn't happen, without that she can hopefully find a way to be content with her life as it is rather then live in the fantasy of what it could be. (hide spoiler)]

amber wrote: "@Leslie I don't think Chekhov is writing tragedies. Tragedy is more everyone ends up dead then what happens in Chekhov plays. I think of him as more of a realist, and that's what I like about him. ..."

Oh, I wasn't saying that this is a tragedy. I was just musing about my own preferences, sparked by your saying you liked the bleak outlook.

I agree Chekhov is portraying life in a realistic manner; this isn't a tragedy or a comedy. However, the 'realistic' life he is showing strikes me as depressing.

Regarding your spoiler in message 35 -- that is one way of looking at it which I hadn't considered. (view spoiler)[So Sonia can now have a contented life even though she has lost the hope of romantic love. I can see arguments on both sides of whether that is desirable or not! (hide spoiler)] But your interpretation does fit in with Chekhov being a realist.

I read another play by Chekhov a few weeks ago, The Seagull, and was struck by the similarities with this one. And if tickets are available, my dad and I will be going to a local college's production of The Three Sisters this weekend. I haven't read The Three Sisters so will be interested in seeing if it also has the same themes...

Seeing a live performance of a Chekhov play, even if it wasn't Uncle Vanya, seems like a fitting way to wrap up the Spring group play!

After some discussion, both here (in the Ask the Moderators thread) and amongst us moderators, it has been decided to set up a separate section for drama. I will be doing that sometime soon and will post an announcement when it is done.

Leslie wrote: "After some discussion, both here (in the Ask the Moderators thread) and amongst us moderators, it has been decided to set up a separate section for drama. I will be doing that sometime soon and wi..."

Yay!

Well, The Three Sisters is now my favorite Chekhov play! Maybe I was influenced by the fact that this is the only one I have seen performed live. The performance was very well done, performed in a small (black box) theater which seated about 150-200 people.

While the play is clearly a tragedy, it didn't seem quite as bleak as Uncle Vanya or The Seagull. There was definitely some of the same themes (women choosing to marry men they don't love because their options are so limited, for example) but I felt there was more voicing of hope for the future than in the other two.

He has some good short stories too! Glad that you have discovered a new author to enjoy Sandy :)